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Thread: My Pinguicula moctezumae is confused...

  1. #33
    SDCPs's Avatar
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    I wouldn't let it flower, personally...at least not yet

  2. #34
    Oh, the humanity!! TheFury's Avatar
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    I was JUST thinking about that! When I first got into CPs, one of my first plants was a P. moctezumae (not this one). At the time I had been reading about VFTs and how exhausting the process of flowering is for those plants. So while I certainly enjoyed the flowers on that ping (of which there were many), I began cutting the scapes off after they got an inch or so tall... just cuz. Probably unnecessary for a plant that was doing as well as it was (that is, until I killed it)... but that would probably be a good move on this poor guy as you suggest!

  3. #35
    Moderator Joseph Clemens's Avatar
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    Yes, it certainly doesn't appear to be stuck in the same place anymore. It also looks like the new leaves and inflorescence are a deeper shade of green.

    From reading and looking at the photos of Fernando Rivadavia's accounts with this species in its native habitat, the photos show what looks, to me, like gypsum formations and possibly gypsum sands (BTW, though calcium bearing - gypsum is usually neutral in reaction). The authors who published this species say that it grows in tufa, calcium carbonate. It looked like there were plants in bloom and plants growing, and plants with what appeared to be Winter rosettes, all at the same time. I might be mistaken in my various assumptions concerning this species (Fernando Rivadavia - can you help with this?), but I will certainly make future attempts to grow some in pure gypsum sand and even forms of calcium carbonate. None of mine ever showed an inclination to produce Winter rosettes. My experiences with this species took place prior to my discovering Fernando Rivadavia's report of his personal visit to the home of this species. Some of his report is here.

    It was also curious to read that the substrate the plants grow on, in natural habitat was supposed to be calcium carbonate (main ingredient in chalk, tufa, marble, limestone, calcite, coral). The authors who originally published this species wrote that in the narative. I wonder how this was determined. If accurate, their natural substrate would, most certainly, be somewhat basic or alkaline. So, I wonder why the plants I tried with some coral, appear stunted?
    Last edited by Joseph Clemens; 11-17-2010 at 07:18 AM.
    Joseph Clemens
    Tucson, Arizona, U S A

  4. #36
    Oh, the humanity!! TheFury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Clemens View Post
    It was also curious to read that the substrate the plants grow on, in natural habitat was supposed to be calcium carbonate (main ingredient in chalk, tufa, marble, limestone, calcite, coral). The authors who originally published this species wrote that in the narative. I wonder how this was determined. If accurate, their natural substrate would, most certainly, be somewhat basic or alkaline. So, I wonder why the plants I tried with some coral, appear stunted?
    Interesting you should mention that. I believe it was in The Savage Garden that I read that Pinguicula grown in this mix of media don't grow as large but have much more robust root systems. I of course can't speak about this intelligently at all because I've never even seen coral and limestone in stores let alone grown Pinguicula in it, but perhaps that's what you're observing?
    Last edited by Joseph Clemens; 03-13-2011 at 12:40 PM. Reason: N. A.

  5. #37
    Hort. School dropout X 2
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    There isn't usually limestone it is under the name lime

    As I have been told most P. moranensis will benefit form a small amount of lime in the media Info second hand from UCD
    P. esseriana will die quickly if put in this media. Personal experience
    Last edited by Joseph Clemens; 11-24-2010 at 05:09 PM.
    Every seed that you plant ,doesn't sprout.
    Every seed that sprouts, doesn't make it to maturity.
    Every cutting that you stick doesn't grow roots.
    Every cutting that roots doesn't grow to a small plant.
    Every small plant doesn't reach maturity.


    Who needs speelcheck?

  6. #38
    Moderator Joseph Clemens's Avatar
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    Limestone is available in many garden centers as: agricultural lime (ground limestone - predominantly CaCO3); dolomite lime (ancient seabed deposits - more magnesium than other limestones); marble chips for landscaping (almost pure CaCO3); found in pet stores as coral sand (mostly CaCO3), for use as substrate in saltwater aquaria. Lime is limestone CaCO3 (Calcium Carbonate) heated to high temperatures until the extra CO2 is driven off, leaving CaO (Calcium Oxide). Calcium oxide is called lime, or quicklime, when water is added to calcium oxide it forms Ca(OH)2, also called calcium hydroxide or slaked lime. Calcium hydroxide is moderately high in pH and when in solution reacts with CO2 to precipitate calcium carbonate. The natural tufa, Pinguicula moctezumae is said to inhabit is usually formed when calcium is leached by cold water from underground deposits, then reacts with carbon dioxide in the atmosphere to precipitate as soft crystiline deposits of CaCO3 (tufa).

    A description of tufa can be found here.

    Many other Mexican Pinguicula species grow in and around formations of gypsum, gypsum is also a calcium bearing natural mineral, calcium sulfate dihydrate(CaSO42H2O). Gypsum, most often has a neutral pH reaction, neither being alkaline or acid in reaction. Though, if these plants can benefit from supplemental calcium, then even crushed egg shells could quite possibly supply this need.

    As flytraplady5 has said, species, such as Pinguicula esseriana have a very adverse reaction to higher pH levels, so be careful what calcium source, if any, you use in your Pinguicula media.
    Last edited by Joseph Clemens; 03-13-2011 at 12:42 PM. Reason: N. A.
    Joseph Clemens
    Tucson, Arizona, U S A

  7. #39
    Hort. School dropout X 2
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    Smile

    hey Joseph
    since i consider you the guru of pings .so glad that you came thru with that technical explantion on t Ca+
    since i consider you the guru of pings
    I will never forget the amazing room full of pings that I saw when I was priviledged to meet you several years ago
    A gracious host and freely sharing your knowledge of these plants
    Lois
    Every seed that you plant ,doesn't sprout.
    Every seed that sprouts, doesn't make it to maturity.
    Every cutting that you stick doesn't grow roots.
    Every cutting that roots doesn't grow to a small plant.
    Every small plant doesn't reach maturity.


    Who needs speelcheck?

  8. #40
    Moderator Joseph Clemens's Avatar
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    Howdy Lois,
    I moved my reply to a new thread so I wouldn't meander too far off topic in this one.

    New Topic.
    Joseph Clemens
    Tucson, Arizona, U S A

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