agreed...i edited the thread title already.
I have some D. madagascariensis planlets from a leaf cutting.
considering $8-$10 per tuber isnt uncommon. Pea sized tuber. I gave away precious things. ........
This makes me sad. Especially since I and lots of other people entered this give away who could of given these a good home.
And I agree, both that A: you shouldn't of entered to begin with if you weren't knowledgeable about this species and confident of your growing skills.. And B: you shouldn't be TRADING something that was gifted to you. Its bad form. If you dont want them, do your OWN give away.
Last edited by Brie; 09-12-2012 at 09:03 AM.
I agree with Brie. you should give them away, not offer for trade.
Not Growing Up!
If I read this thread correctly, I think CPBobby already plans to give them away.
It appears that while he wanted to try these out, he didn't really want that many tubers, & thus was finding a way to spread the others around, without it costing him.
Anyone who is new & just follows what they see others doing here, might not know it is "bad form" to trade or sell things that they got for free.
There's all different kinds of situations here, where it is difficult to see what is "bad form". For instance, there are people here who push & manipulate to get rare/desirable plants in trade from others, claiming they "really, really want a particular plant. The person with the plant may not want to part with it, but seeing how much the person wants their beloved specimen, they may go along with a trade or such.
Then not more than a month or two later, they see the plant being traded here on TF to someone else! When they ask about it, they are told "oh, the plant isn't growing well", or "Oh, well I found this other plant that I always liked better", or some other excuse. For those of us who value our "babies", this can be seen as "bad form" too.
Indeed there are a lot of ways where "bad form" takes place!
So before we tar & feather CPBobby here, perhaps we should look at his real motives...
He said from the very beginning:
"...I always wanted to grow tuber and the opportunity came about before I can properly prepare for it...." and, "...I don't want to slaughter the lot of them..."
" I will be willing to trade them... no reasonable offer refused...but ...would take a capensis that could dwarf the ones I have, if it came to that."
From this we know that he is 1) concerned for the welfare of the plants themselves; & 2) he isn't trying to get a lot or make a great deal off of these, even though they are worth "$8-$10 per tuber", as was pointed out.
From what I see, he simply hoped to get a little something in return for sharing them.
I also got in on the original give-away & lost, ...and I think that this could be a nice way of getting a second chance to get some tubers.
And again, he's not asking for much in return. In fact, I'd actually rather send him some of my extra plants than to send him money for postage.
Most people want something rare or large in trade for things, and yet here he values even common things in return for these, so he is making it possible for nearly anyone to get some rare tubers! It is obvious to me that he is NOT trying to get rich off of these in any way. Its not like he got these or manipulated someone to trade these to him, in order to sell them on ebay or to get some other rare plants or something. So what is the big deal?
In the past I have tried to share anything I "WON" in a large give-away & to spread around the "winnings"... by having the person doing the giveaway to SPLIT my winnings (if I win) into smaller packages & to give the 2nd & 3rd place "winners" some. (I did that recently with some seed that Butch had in a very generous give-away.)
No one really needs 20 tubers in order to try the plant out, however I would assume shipping out 5 packages to different people would be costly, perhaps more-so from Hawaii or where-ever. And in many give-aways you still have to pay postage.
So if CPBobby charged shipping while giving them away "free", or simply got a person to cover some of his expenses by doing a trade for them, is it really that much different? (Again, he is only wanting a common plant in return!)
I find this whole situation very "ironic", as there are so many other situations of "bad form" worse than this here on TF, that for some reason never get addressed.
In fact, I have been around long enough to remember someone here getting a whole load of VFT's & other really nice plants from someone who was getting out of the hobby... and then turned around & used those plants to trade for other stuff for themselves. This sort of thing goes on all the time. How is this that much worse or different?
Just my opinion...
I agree with you, GrowinOld, on all points but the trading them away. All other "situations of bad forms" aside, trading plants just gifted to you is unethical. Just because there are worse ways to conduct oneself that don't get brought to our attention doesn't mean what's done here is right or that one should also overlook this situation.
Imagine, persay, a young child asks his parents for a present for his B-day/ Xmas/ whatever. His parents generously provide him with this gift even though all of his siblings asked for the same gift too and didn't receive it. He then goes on to trade off the gift to his siblings for their presents/ things right under his parents' noses. How would that make the parents, or in this case gifter, feel knowing that probably most of the other people who entered would have hung on to and at least attempted to grow the tubers out.
While I'm positive CPBobby wasn't trying to cause any trouble or do any wrongs and is in fact doing this for the plants' success, there are better ways it could have been handled to avoid this problem. For example, contacting the host and asking for permission/ explaining the circumstances before trying to trade the tubers away would have been a good idea. Or hosting a giveaway rather than a trade, as previously mentioned...
^ I agree that I definitely should have consulted with the host before implementing my distribution strategies. Would have taken the wind out of alot of sails.
against my better judgement there are some things I wish to add:
-I have always planned for a giveaway.
-In the beginning after I realized that I was taking too big of a risk with what is regarded as "precious things"(no disrespect intended; just the opposite actually). I had considered merely bequeathing all of them to one person and wash my hands of it but I did not. I decided to do more than a giveaway by enabling not only the lucky few or possibly 1 who draw a number to get some tuberous drosera. I am enabling nearly anyone with some spare seedlings to trade to have some tubers of their own reaching far more people than just a 1 time giveaway which literally guarantees they will have their own tubers for next to nothing instead of playing a game of chance only to be disappointed if they lost.
-For those who don't have spare seedlings to trade there is still a giveaway which I have just put up.
-Also I believe my distribution methods are more effective this way....bc reaching as many people as I have/plan to just isn't worth my time handling the infrastructure otherwise.
-In essence and application I have enabled EVERYONE to share in my good fortune by either luck or exchange.
To directly address some of the comments I have very little to say(that I haven't already) except:
-I have conceded to the points that I feel require concession.
-I am not sure what qty one of the other winners received from the giveaway but I personally received way more tubers than I would use even if growing them wasn't an issue. Which I can and will grow a few for myself; but keeping them alive for the long haul looked to be more of a risk than I wanted to take with all of them given their rarity and felt I would be doing the host more of a service by distributing them to many people thereby ensuring the host's generosity would have an impact on many more people than just the 3 that got lucky.
-speaking of which from my POV some of the post in this thread seem to come from more of an ego base than an objective one.
-some agree with my motives and some do not either way I do not take issue with stating ones opinion.
Last edited by cpbobby; 09-15-2012 at 01:12 AM.
Consider that very often the first time you try tuberous sundews you end up killing them. Providing people with many increases the odds of success. Were I to send each person one and it fails it ends up killing ones interest because the supossedly easy one didn't work so I won't try again. My feeling was I sent just enough for a rookie to get started
Number two what I asked in postage after PayPal did not even cover the postage. Not to mention the cost of the envelope. if costs were an issue I would have sold them and made a few hundred dollars. I am not in this to make money.
I want people to learn about the enjoy them share them but hard to learn if you give trade or sell them off. You got them consider them as your property. Do as you will. But there won't be more for you. I will probably go back to doing my giveaways like I normally do look to see who is interested and wants to learn. Open random drawing will cease.