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Thread: Green swamp

  1. #1
    swamplady
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    I see the last posted message was from Ash, NC. Ash is in the heart of the Green Swamp, a eco system 2nd in biodiversity only to the Great Rainforest (a quote from The Nature Conservancy). The swamp was once filled with cp's as described in the Ash letter. Industrial paper is unmercifully draining this 350,000 acres, has removed the native Long Leaf Pines and hardwoods found in its forested wetlands, and converted this once beautiful place to tree farms and heavy herbicide use. There are currently two fronts we're battling here -- the draining and spraying AND a regional landfill in the heart of the swamp. The landfill battle has been on-going for about 3 years. We have now reached the point that much of the footprint is in a floodplain (thanks to the paper company's drainage) and it's illegal to put landfills in floodplains in NC. Our legislators, however, weren't wise enough to omit a loop hole, one which the local county is trying to exercise by voicing a critical need and the fact that there's no other place not in a floodplain.

    I will be posting names and address to contact in the near future to help us save and restore this unique eco system so full of CPs. In the meantime, you can check out our website at <swampwatch.org>.

    And Ozzy, you are right about burning that land. If he doesn't do it every year or two, he'll lose them. Nature used to do this for us, with thunderstorms in the spring; but we got too smart for that and put Smoky the Bear to work -- well, that's another whole can of worms.

  2. #2
    SirKristoff is a poopiehead Ozzy's Avatar
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    Anybody that knows me knows how I feel about the Green Swamp. The reason I got the idea for this forumwas because I was trying to think of something I could do to get more people aware of what is happening there. I know some of you can't believe that I haven't already made a post here about it. I first wanted to get some info from Swamplady that I could post there. She decided to join and post the info, and I want to thank her for that.

    The Green Swamp is alot more than cp's, but for now I'll focus on them. There is no place in the world that has more cp's. There is no place in the world that has more cp species. I know of 17 diffrent speciecs. They are Dionea muscipula, Sarracenia flava, rubra, purpurea, minor, Pinguicula caerulea, lutea, Drosea capillaris, intermedia, filiformis, brevifolia, Utricularia cornuta, juncea, inflata, purpurea, subulata and gibba. There may be more but these are the ones that I have confirmed. I made a post about this in another topic sometime ago. Instead of typing it over I'm just going to cut and paste it here.


    The Green Swamp is facing threats from many different sources. Some are the same as all other cp sites, poaching and development.
    North Carolina has some very strict laws for poachers. Last time I looked it was $2000 and 6 months in jail for each incident. That may not sound like alot but the thing is every plant you take is a separate offenses. Say that you only take 5 plants, 5 plants equals $10,000. That's enough to make you stop and think about it.
    But with all that poaching still happens.
    Southeastern NC is one of the fastest growing area's in the country. It's a very big tourist spot, It has the Atlantic Ocean and some very nice beaches and with Myrtle Beach just across the state line, thousands, if not millions of tourist visit the area every year. These people have to have places to stay, eat, shop and entertainment, so countless numbers of hotels, restaurants, shopping centers, golf courses, ect, ect, ect have just been built. I can't imagine how many cp's were and still are being bulldozed.
    When most people hear the Green Swamp they think that it's very swampy. It's not. I'd say about 90% of it is pine savannas. So The International Paper Company bought most of The Green Swamp years ago, because pine savannas are perfect for growing pine trees. For years they have cleared the land, drained it and sprayed herbicides and pesticides from helicopters. Of course some of these chemicals drifted into steams and onto what remains of the green swamp. The scariest thing is when you walk in to the swamp and you think how quite and peaceful it is. Then you realize it's too quite, no birds, squirrels, deer. I have yet to see any live animal other than a few bugs there. This is the only wilderness place I have ever been to and not heard a bird singing. That's something to think about.
    Look at the pic on this website.


    The Green Swamp

    When I saw this picture for the first time, It made me think of a song by Lynyrd Skynyrd called "All I Can Do is Write About It" There is a line in there that says:
    And Lord I can't make any changes
    All I can do is write 'em in a song
    I can see the concrete slowly creepin'
    Lord take me and mine before that comes

    I now have those lines in my signature.

    Notice the area with no lines in it. That's what's left of the Green Swamp. Maybe 2 by 4 miles. This swamp use to cover the SE North Carolina and NE South Carolina. And it's been reduced to this. This is about the only undisturbed area that's let of the Green Swamp. To the north and west you'll see land that has alot of lines through it. The lines are logging roads and that's the paper co. land. Of course their land stretches far beyond what this pics show. The ocean is to the south east so all the steams, with all the chemicals run through the Green Swamp on it's way to the ocean.
    The landfill is the most immediate threat. They want to built it just NW of the nature preserve area. Keep in mind that the streams run S-SW to the ocean. It's about 3 miles upstream (If I remember right). They are required to have sheeting that will hold all the liquid and other waste inside the mound. The same company is under investigation for a barrier leak at other landfills that they own. It's the same barrier that will be used in this one. Ok let's say that the barrier in the other landfills didn't break and the one that'll be used in the Green Swamp works perfect and never breaks. They are designed to hold so much rain, I forget how much they are designed to hold. In 1984 the area had (I think) 19 inches of rain in 24 hrs.
    It was during hurricane Dianna. That would have over flowed the landfill. In 1996 we had 2 hurricanes with in a month Bertha and Fran. I forgot the total rainfall but it was alot and it was enough to overflow the landfill. In 1999 there was 3 hurricanes that hit the area within a month and a half. Floyd was the biggest, I believe we had almost 60 inches of rain. With Floyd dumping close to 30 inches within 24 hrs. That 3 times in 14 yrs that the landfill would have overflowed. Just imagine if the landfill overflows just once. All the chemicals, wastes, nutrients that the landfill holds will be released into the streams and ground water. All of this will settle in the soil. What's one of the most toxic things to cp's. Nitrogen. Think about how much nitrogen will be released, not to mention the other things like sodium. Another thing to thing about. How many landfill have you seen with out seagulls? The seagull population will explode after it is built. I believe that the seagull droppings will fertilize the area. Eventually killing the cp's.
    Most of the land that you see undisturbed is owned by The Nature Conservancy. Thank God that they do or nothing would be left. They burn and manage the land, and try to keep it the way it's supposed to be, full of cp's. This is why I think the key to saving cp's are organizations like TNC and people privately buying sites to keep them from being developed.
    If anybody wants to learn more about The Grenn Swamp, here are some website to visit.

    http://www.geocities.com/greenswamp211/greenswamp.html

    http://ccsenc.freeservers.com/

    http://www.uhaul.com/supergraphics/f...roduction.html

    If you would like to explore the Green Swamp go to this site and you can zoom in and pan around.

    The Green Swamp

    If anybody would like to sign a petition to stop the landfill, contact me and I'll send it to you.




  3. #3

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    Angry

    that's awful! why would they do something like that? drain a bog? Shame on them! [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif[/img] You should make an on-line petition, like the fear factor abuses snakes one. Much less hassle, and more people are more likely to sign it!
    Good luck!
    -Spec

  4. #4

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    Quote (Spectabilis73 @ June 04 2003,8:48)
    that's awful! why would they do something like that? drain a bog? Shame on them! [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif[/img] You should make an on-line petition, like the fear factor abuses snakes one. Much less hassle, and more people are more likely to sign it!
    Good luck!
    -Spec[/QUOTE]
    I totally agree, Spec! The one thing you should change about your statement is after: that's aweful, shame on them! You should put: [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/Skin/SKIN-2/PostIcons/icon13.gif[/img][img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/Skin/SKIN-2/PostIcons/icon10.gif[/img] [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif[/img] [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif[/img] instead of [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif[/img] that way you get your point through! J/K [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif[/img] [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif[/img] , I just had to add something good to all this bad! [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif[/img] [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif[/img] [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif[/img] [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/alien.gif[/img] [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif[/img] [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif[/img]
    I am back..

  5. #5

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    The use of land like the Green Swamp for pulp paper tree farming is increasing and will increase exponentially. There are some understandable reasons, and one of the biggest is the demand for toilet paper. It's a commodity that most consumers don't want to do without, and I doubt that it's going to change. Our feeble efforts will not stand in the face of the Demon Money. Where there is demand, there will be supply.

    Still, I am more than willing to open my mouth wide and bellow where bellowing is called for. I don't have to like it, and I DON'T. (Personally I would rather pay 1.00 for a roll of toilet paper). I did some good bellowing regarding the cow depradation of the heterophyllous Darlingtonia population so well illustrated by Barry on his website, and I DO believe that had an impact. In some cases we CAN make a difference with our collective complaints. I hope the Green Swamp will prove to be one of these instances.

    Swamplady, I doff my Stetson to you! I nominate you for the CP-ulitzer Prize to be awarded at the First International PFT Barbeque and Plant Exchange Extravaganza......well, even if that never happens, I bless you for your efforts on behalf of us that are, and those that are yet to be!! I know what inspires you, for it is in me as well.

    It's an honor to have you as a member of the PFT Forums.

    Do not let them "go gentle into that good night"! Rage! Rage against the dying....... Don't let it be said by posterity that "no one cared".

    In the LONG run, it will all work out. In terms of geologic time, issues of mass extinction are not new scenarios. No species thrives but at the expense of another established population. It is survival of the fittest at work. We continue to place stress on ecosystems incurred by our own species success, and the rubber band is stretching tight. At some point, it will snap and these systems will again return to a balance evolved over millions of years. I fear the repercussion will take its toll on our own populations, but the wonder of the Cosmic Design will bring up new forms out of Creation. When I am bitter over the losses I am powerless to prevent, this is my comfort.

    But for Now, there is work to be done! Let's Rock!



    "Grow More, Share More"

  6. #6

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    Angry

    It's nice to find a place where people as obsessive-compulsive about conservation as i am are able to commune. I wrote a letter to the park service over that D. californica scandal that Barry wrote up, too, Tamlin, and i was impressed how eager they seemed to do what was necessary to come out looking good. I have the petition from Ozzy, and was trying to get the local Greens chapter to sign it, but i guess they're all too busy graduating or something. I'll keep trying.

    Is there a responsible party we can write to, like in the case of the Darlingtonia?
    There's no 'a' in perlite.

    My Growlist
    NECPS.org - New England CP growers unite!

  7. #7
    SirKristoff is a poopiehead Ozzy's Avatar
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    Tamlin I agree with what you said. We all need and use paper. But there should be a line in the middle, we need and have to have paper and we need clean drinking water, we need to keep at least part of the Green Swamp alive. The line in the middle was set by the NC lawmakers. Swamplady has shown me proof of time after time the paper company breaking law after law. And she has shown me pictures of aftermath of the broken laws. (I'll let her tell you the evidence, if she fits to.) And worst yet, I heard the results of the broken laws in the silence of the the Green Swamp. No animals anywhere.

    Quote
    Is there a responsible party we can write to, like in the case of the Darlingtonia?[/QUOTE]
    Yes. That is one of the ideas for this forum, Somebody list any names that they have and we all respond. Swamplady is getting a list of the names and address and she'll post them here.

  8. #8

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    someone should put a pettion online and have everyone type there name on it. then send it somewhere it will be heard.

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