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Thread: What would happen if

  1. #73
    herenorthere's Avatar
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    Christian Amanpour's husband was part of the Clinton administration State Department and she was accused (probably correctly) of spinning news coverage to favor the Clinton administration's point of view. Though I guess that makes her perfectly qualified for a role in what passes for government during the last couple decades.
    Bruce in CT

    Madness is something rare in individuals — but in groups, parties, peoples, ages it is the rule. Friedrich Nietzsche

  2. #74
    Let's positive thinking! seedjar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (0zzy @ Oct. 18 2005,3:43)]Bush had this war planned before he ever took office, because he wanted to be the one to finish his daddy's job. If you will remember Saddam put a hit out on G.Bush sr. Do you think Jr. is the type of guy not to get revenge for that?
    Isn't there some soundbite floating around out there where Jr. specifically says he wants revenge for the hit put out on Sr.? Or was that just some anti-Bush rhetoric? I think it's really funny how much of major US affairs has fallen to the whims of the good ol' boys. If you look up Jr.'s old college buddies, you'll find a shocking number of them in all sorts of very high places. Isn't life grand?
    And Outsiders71, at the risk of being quarrelsome, since when weren't approval ratings important? What do you think the job of president is there for? Shouldn't the president represent the will of the people and be there to keep the houses in check and working towards our mutual goals? If the president's approval rating is low, that tends to mean that they aren't doing their job properly.
    The way I've interpreted our system of government, being president (or any sort of politician) doesn't mean you get to rule the country your way; it specifically means that you must yield to the opinion of the people, to use your authority to act as their most trusted representative. If it were otherwise, we'd have an oligarchy, not a democracy. That's why politicians care about approval ratings at all - because if people don't like what they're doing, they'll be out of a job.
    ~Joe
    o//~ Livin' like a bug ain't easy / My old clothes don't seem to fit me /
    I got little tiny bug feet / I don't really know what bugs eat /
    Don't want no one steppin' on me / Now I'm sympathizin' with fleas /
    Livin' like a bug ain't easy / Livin' like a bug ain't easy... o//~

  3. #75
    SirKristoff is a poopiehead Ozzy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]because if people don't like what they're doing, they'll be out of a job.
    Uness of course they steal elections.

  4. #76
    herenorthere's Avatar
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    It's never necessary to make up stuff about Bush.

    As was widely reported three years ago (for example, see http://archives.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLI...bush.war.talk/) Bush said, "After all, this is the guy who tried to kill my dad."
    Bruce in CT

    Madness is something rare in individuals — but in groups, parties, peoples, ages it is the rule. Friedrich Nietzsche

  5. #77
    Let's positive thinking! seedjar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (herenorthere @ Oct. 18 2005,4:20)]It's never necessary to make up stuff about Bush.
    But it's not too hard to get away with anymore. ;)
    ~Joe
    o//~ Livin' like a bug ain't easy / My old clothes don't seem to fit me /
    I got little tiny bug feet / I don't really know what bugs eat /
    Don't want no one steppin' on me / Now I'm sympathizin' with fleas /
    Livin' like a bug ain't easy / Livin' like a bug ain't easy... o//~

  6. #78
    apple rings.. what more can i say? FlytrapGurl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]if we stay on the offense we can help keep terrorists at bay by 1) eliminating them
    You cannot eliminate all terrorists. There will always be terrorists and you can't stop that. How many times do I have to say this?

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Thanks for the link to the source.
    YOU DON'T NEED A LINK! It's a fact! Of course, that's if you believe all the right-wing 24-hour news channels, then it's a fact.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]It appears it was 51% of the nation that was brainwashed at the time of the 2004 Presidental election. While 48% of the population remained normal and supported gay marriage.
    Whatever that meant.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]I know you have a problem with the fact that G.W.B is pro-life and anti gay-marriage. Can you include an argument how these beliefs affect the way our nation functions?
    For one, if he manages to outlaw gay marriage and [insert apparently vulgar word that starts with "a" and ends with "bortion"] as well as whatever other horribly sinful things he's against, it's not going to help the nation at all. All it's going to do is cause people to get even more P.O.ed and find illegal ways do to it (especially in the case of [insert apparently vulgar word starting with
    "a" and ending with "bortion"]... outlaw that and people will go back to dangerous, illegal methods to get it done.. ever heard of the wire coat hanger method?).

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]My bad I guess I assumed you had faith/relationship with God since you believe there is a God. Usually people who believe in God and read the Bible (which is considered the word of God by Christians and Jews) have faith. Otherwise you wouldn't have a problem with the teachings of the book you are reading. I'm sorry but no one will silence my faith in Christ. Thank you for reassuring me though that I will be fine.
    When did I say I didn't have faith in Christ? I do. And I think the Bible is great. It's a great religious book. But nothing proves anything better than prophetic humans wrote it.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]It's Christian/Jewish/Catholic <insert religion that deals with bible here> belief that the Bible is God's word.
    Based on...?

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]I don't understand what your talking about, circle thinking...evolutionists thinking, they're your friends??
    No, I was referring to you when I said "my friend". It's a figure of speech.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]From a perspective without faith it may be.
    When did I say I didn't have faith? Why the hell do you have to worship the Bible like it's God itself to have faith?

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]I guess there's a better word for that. His will.
    I believe God has a will. That doesn't prove the Bible was written by the hand of God. I have nothing against the Bible whatsoever. I don't NOT believe it. But I see no reason to believe it's written by God.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Why not it will lower gas prices!
    That's my secondary concern. My primary concern is the fact that there is still a planet Earth to inhabit. Otherwise there's no use in lowering gas prices.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]In air. In water.
    But not in cars!

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]You can continue to support the oil industry and give them that $7.
    I don't really have a CHOICE. That doesn't mean I SUPPORT the oil industry.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]I don't see how you can look up so much to someone who says junk like "You gotta solve problems with problem solvers"... "Is our children educated?"... and freely states that he'd like to "learn more about federal government". And you people call us unpatriotic rednecks...
    What is there to clarify? What I was trying to say as clearly as possible was that I don't understand how you can have so much faith in someone who obviously slept in class, and then you call us (left-wing, liberals, libertarians, Democrats, Independents.. basically everyone but right-wing conservatives), who can actually form words and speak consistently, unpatriotic rednecks.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Out of the question how old are you?
    Doesn't matter how old I am. Find out for yourself, it's not that hard to find. My age isn't the question. The only reason you want to know is so you can automatically disregard everything I say only due to my age anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]No more gay marriage? That was something that was left to the states to vote on, not G.W.B. medical procedure? Ever hear of Roe vs Wade? It still exists and G.W.B. didn't make or pass any laws that constitutionally banned it.
    That's because there are too many level-headed people who won't pass it. If he could, he would.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]I don't have the time to give a lesson on the 3 branches of Gov't, but it is the Legislative branch, the senators and representatives that we vote in that make the laws. G.W.B. can propose laws but it is not his duty. He vetos or signs the bill.
    Therefore it doesn't even matter. If ridiculous laws get passed that help nobody, the Congress sucks for passing it and GWB sucks for signing it.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]There's nothing to debate really. If we were to pull out of Iraq prematurely (now),
    Prematurely? Why would it be premature?

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Iraq would fall to the insurgents. That would be why we are still there now.
    It's not that I don't care about the Iraqis... I do, really. But we never signed anything stating what happened in other countries was any of our business. They set up that kind of government, they can deal with it.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]When you ignore foreign affairs, that implies that we are isolating or blinding ourselves from foreign problems.
    Putting words into my mouth again. I did NOT say "ignore". I said STAY OUT OF. As in, DON'T throw the first punch. If they're not screwing with you, it's not your problem. Keep an eye on it, but don't jump right into war assuming the worst is going to happen if you don't. If they screw with you, fine. Fight it. War should NOT be a preventative action. It should be a DEFENSIVE action. If you use war as a preventative action, you might as well go to war with half the countries on the planet.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Once again when Clinton was in office he knew about Osama. He knew about Al Qaeda. He left them alone and what happened?
    Nothing. Not until Bush was elected.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Gay marriage is mentioned in the bible?: http://bible.christianity.com/Online...=homosexuality

    There is no listing of gay marriage. However there is a listing of homosexuality:
    [URL=http://bible.christianity.com/OnlineS....arriage[/URL]
    Oh, now we're getting technical with words.

    Murder is also mentioned in the bible. There are laws against THAT and IT still happens. Just because some people still do it doesn't condemn us all to hell, now does it? So why do so many think medical procedure does?

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]medical procedure is not directly in the Bible but it is a termination of a living, growing human being. I guess it comes down to morals and values, which this culture continually sets lower and lower like a limbo bar.
    I'm not even getting into a BS a.bortion debate again, but I will say this: if you believe it's wrong, then DON'T DO IT. I don't care if that's your belief. That's fine. Whatever. I'll accept that and respect it. But it's none of your business to try to force your beliefs onto others.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]How hasn't Bush helped people? You mean he hasn't helped terrorists who want to kill innocent U.S. citizens?
    What the hell? How did you get that out of what I said? I'm talking about the AMERICAN PEOPLE. Yeah, that's right... those sidenotes and afterthoughts over here. How about helping your own people once in a while? What did Bush do for the hurricane victims? Drone on and on about how much of a horrible trajedy it was.. sure. But sympathizing doesn't help anybody. WE did all the work. WE raised money for them. WE collected items for them. WE brought it to them. Not the government.
    Liquid Plummer
    Warning: Do not reuse the bottle to store beverages.

  7. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (0zzy @ Oct. 18 2005,6:43)]Very well said Amori. Most of the real terriost in Iraq are from other countries. They are there because we are there because we are there. They have come from Syria, Pakistan, Afgainstan and a few other countries. No matter where we go, they will follow and attack us.
    Excellent statement Ozzy and it proves my point perfectly. Either we fight them there on their soil, have unfortunate Iraqi civilian casualties. Or we fight them here in the U.S. and have unfortunate American civilian casualties. For all you people who want to complain about us(trained soldiers, who except the riks and know how to handle the situation) being there think to yourself would you rather us be fighting them in New York, Detroit, Miami, your back yard? Because make no qualms about it, we are going to have to fight them. They will either kill us or die trying, I for one would rather put the offensive to them rather then trying to protect our civilians on our soil.

    What is the death toll of U.S. citizens (U.S. soldiers & U.S.) in Iraq now? 2000 some last I heard. Think about how many that would be if we had to fight them here. Ever think about why we have not been attacked here since 9-11? Do you think it is because the terrorist decided they got their point across and feel no more attacks are neccessary? Or could it be they are to busy running and hiding from 5.56 rounds to cordinate and attack?

    No one likes war, and war in Iraqi is HORRIBLE. That place is a hell hole. I spent 9 months w/o a shower and 4 months w/o a hot meal. Could we have had a better plan before going in? I am sure we could have, but we have adjusted and improved our stragities. As stated before this is the first war of its kind. I for one thank god every night that in this particular time in the world we had a president with balls enough to do what needed to be done even though it wasnt popular opinion. What did your momma tell you about doing what other kids to in school? Do what is right, not what is popular!
    You don't need an iron chest if you have a sharp brain and a silk tongue.


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  8. #80
    Outsiders71's Avatar
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    Sigh...

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    You cannot eliminate all terrorists. There will always be terrorists and you can't stop that. How many times do I have to say this?
    I never said ALL terrorists. Obviously we can't eliminate them all, DUH! But it only takes one to fly an airplane into a building, it only takes one to strap a nuke to their chest, it only takes one to release some kind of chemical agent....

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    YOU DON'T NEED A LINK! It's a fact! Of course, that's if you believe all the right-wing 24-hour news channels, then it's a fact.
    I thanked you for giving me the source from where you got your 52% from. You then turn around and slap me stating I shoud know this... If I DID know the statistic I wouldn't have ASKED you that question.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    Whatever that meant.
    You were off 1%. IT'S A FACT!

    [qute]
    For one, if he manages to outlaw gay marriage and [insert apparently vulgar word that starts with "a" and ends with "bortion"] as well as whatever other horribly sinful things he's against, it's not going to help the nation at all. All it's going to do is cause people to get even more P.O.ed and find illegal ways do to it (especially in the case of [insert apparently vulgar word starting with
    "a" and ending with "bortion"]... outlaw that and people will go back to dangerous, illegal methods to get it done.. ever heard of the wire coat hanger method?).
    [/quote]

    You made the case that it won't help the nation at all. How will it help it? There has never been such a thing as gay marriage before. If people want to be gay that is their business, but they shouldn't be asking for marriage. Would it be safe to say that you are ok with gay couples adopting and raising an orphan? A.bortion has existed since the age of time, does that mean we should legalize it? No. What about all those potheads should we legalize marijuana? Should we legalize cocaine? Should we legalize theft and violent act? We need to set standards in this country, not lower standards because it PO the few and the immoral. There's a difference between attempting to enforce religious beliefs and moral beliefs. Morality is a seperate entity, and therefore there is nothing wrong with supporting it.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    When did I say I didn't have faith in Christ? I do. And I think the Bible is great. It's a great religious book. But nothing proves anything better than prophetic humans wrote it.
    I never said anything about having faith in Christ. I said faith.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    Based on...?
    If I'm wrong prove me wrong. Don't ask me a question. It's common knowledge those religions believe the bible is the word of God. If you can come up with a source that can backup your argument, then I'll stand corrected.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    When did I say I didn't have faith? Why the hell do you have to worship the Bible like it's God itself to have faith?
    Ok let me get this straight. You have faith, you believe in Jesus Christ but you will not accept the bible as the word of God? [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/confused.gif[/img] It is obvious you don't believe in the Bible based on your views of a.bortion and gay marriage but do you realize that you also do not believe in the same Jesus Christ that I believe in? The Bible was written by a human hand, but it was not written by human-being alone. If you believe it was, then the God you believe in and the Christ you have faith in is nothing but a fictional book. A fiction you don't take seriously in your heart.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    Doesn't matter how old I am. Find out for yourself, it's not that hard to find. My age isn't the question. The only reason you want to know is so you can automatically disregard everything I say only due to my age anyway.
    Yes it does matter how old you are based on what I was stating. You were stating that Bush doesn't give tax cuts to the middle-class, and only to the rich. Well obviously you didn't get one entitled to "Flytrapgirl" because you are still living with your family. You kind of gave yourself away on the last sentence but there really is no reason to go there it is self evident in what you type.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    That's because there are too many level-headed people who won't pass it. If he could, he would.
    Lets not go off on a tangent here, accept that you were wrong. Bush didn't pass any of those laws that you gave examples to, the question was not would he if he could.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    Therefore it doesn't even matter. If ridiculous laws get passed that help nobody, the Congress sucks for passing it and GWB sucks for signing it.
    Therefore you go off on a tangent again and are wrong again. It does matter because if you can't understand simple concepts on how our gov't works then you shouldn't be claiming something when you have no idea what you're talking about.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    Prematurely? Why would it be premature?
    Read the next sentence I wrote. The insurgents would take over Iraq without our support at this point of time. In the future when they are enough well trained Iraqi soldiers, they will be able to handle it themselves. This isn't the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    It's not that I don't care about the Iraqis... I do, really. But we never signed anything stating what happened in other countries was any of our business. They set up that kind of government, they can deal with it.
    We didn't have to sign a contract, we went in there and freed them. Now we have to protect them until they are established and can handle it themselves. You honestly believe the Iraqi's setup that Gov't? You mean to tell me they liked living how they were under Saddam. You must be crazy and a crappy believer in Christ. What kind of person who believes in Christ would say, "oh well it is on them"? It doesn't matter really because it was already established that you have faith in a different Jesus Christ.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    Putting words into my mouth again. I did NOT say "ignore". I said STAY OUT OF. As in, DON'T throw the first punch. If they're not screwing with you, it's not your problem. Keep an eye on it, but don't jump right into war assuming the worst is going to happen if you don't. If they screw with you, fine. Fight it. War should NOT be a preventative action. It should be a DEFENSIVE action. If you use war as a preventative action, you might as well go to war with half the countries on the planet.
    Stay out of ~= ignore. How else can you prevent a terrorist attack? I can tell you that it is not by leaving them alone in their terrorist cell camps. Once again you have nothing to support your view because there's nothing to support it.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    Nothing. Not until Bush was elected.
    That just proves you are ignorant to what happens here:

    In 1993, the first World Trade Center bombing killed six people.

    In 1998, the bombing of two U.S. embassies in Africa killed 224.

    Both were the work of al-Qaida and bin Laden, who in 1998 declared holy war on America, making him arguably the most wanted man in the world.

    In 1998, President Clinton announced, “We will use all the means at our disposal to bring those responsible to justice, no matter what or how long it takes.”

    Source: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4540958/

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    Oh, now we're getting technical with words.

    Murder is also mentioned in the bible. There are laws against THAT and IT still happens. Just because some people still do it doesn't condemn us all to hell, now does it? So why do so many think medical procedure does?
    You like to forget what you say don't you? I am not getting "technical" with words. You made the claim stating that gay marriage is in the Bible. Stick to your claim instead of worming around the fact you are wrong. There is nothing in the Bible about gay marriage. I never said anything about murder. What are you trying to prove? Your arguments are as stable as balsa wood supporting an elephant. Everyone knows all the laws that were ever made get broken, not matter if it is law or not. What does some people breaking the law have to do with "condeming us all to hell". First off breaking the law and your salvation have nothing to do with eachother. Secondly how can someone else do something that makes everyone condemned to hell? Why do so many people thin a.bortions are wrong? IT IS IMMORAL! YOU ARE KILLING LIFE, A LIVING HUMAN BEING! Put the religion aside, it is still wrong, it's called morals! You can never convince someone that it is moral to have a.bortions. Once again how can someone who believes in the Son of God believe in immoral things as a.bortions.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    I'm not even getting into a BS a.bortion debate again, but I will say this: if you believe it's wrong, then DON'T DO IT. I don't care if that's your belief. That's fine. Whatever. I'll accept that and respect it. But it's none of your business to try to force your beliefs onto others.
    A BS a.bortion debate? There's no BS here. It is none of my business that someone is taking someone elses life? Well if you happen to be walking the city streets one night and get killed by a hangar I will remember your belief. I will accept and respect that that murderer had something against you and thought it would be best that you were killed. When people start saying how wrong it was for you to be killed I will tell them not to try to force their beliefs on me, and to mind their own business.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]
    What the hell? How did you get that out of what I said? I'm talking about the AMERICAN PEOPLE. Yeah, that's right... those sidenotes and afterthoughts over here. How about helping your own people once in a while? What did Bush do for the hurricane victims? Drone on and on about how much of a horrible trajedy it was.. sure. But sympathizing doesn't help anybody. WE did all the work. WE raised money for them. WE collected items for them. WE brought it to them. Not the government.
    So wait your saying that the humanitarian effort to help the people out in New Orleans was soley non-government support? Our Gov't did nothing? You are seriously clueless.
    James 1:17

    "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

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