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Sand related question.

Hello all,

Sorry if this has been asked before:

I have always used Silica sand, also sold as Quartz silica sand in my CP mix. The main reason for this being that it is readily available, as it is sold in 50lb bags under many brands for a host of different applications. The other reason being I know it is free of unwanted contaminates.

The silica sand is very very fine, is their any benefit to using a courser sand? The bulk of my sand usage is for Drosera, however I am interested in hearing thoughts on other forms of CP's as well (Dionaea, Cephs,Sarrs...).

Thanks for letting me pick your brains,

Andre
 
Theoretically, coarse sand would have less chance of compacting. I've heard rumors that silica sand can lead to phosphate buildup, but those rumors were never substantiated to my knowledge.

I just buy builders playsand in 50 lb. bags. Dunno what's in it and really don't care
smile.gif
I've never had any problems. Just don't use calcareous sands such as aragonite in brands like SouthDown.
 
I tried the fine sand (It's finer than sugar) and didn't like it. I still have a 5 gallon pail full of it and I bought it ~2½ years ago. It makes the soil mix very heavy and tends to compact easily. It is also difficult to prevent it from washing through the holes in the pot. I definitely recommend a coarser sand for CP mixes.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (JustLikeAPill @ Oct. 05 2006,10:53)]Theoretically, coarse sand would have less chance of compacting. I've heard rumors that silica sand can lead to phosphate buildup, but those rumors were never substantiated to my knowledge.

I just buy builders playsand in 50 lb. bags. Dunno what's in it and really don't care
smile.gif
I've never had any problems. Just don't use calcareous sands such as aragonite in brands like SouthDown.
Unless you're using it (the aragonite) for your Pinguicula gypsicola media/mix.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (BigCarnivourKid @ Oct. 05 2006,2:42)]I tried the fine sand (It's finer than sugar) and didn't like it. I still have a 5 gallon pail full of it and I bought it ~2½ years ago. It makes the soil mix very heavy and tends to compact easily. It is also difficult to prevent it from washing through the holes in the pot. I definitely recommend a coarser sand for CP mixes.
A couple of decades ago I was able to obtain and use some 90 and 120 grit silica sands, and even some 12 grit, they were clean looking and white as milk. These days I'm lucky to obtain 30 grit that looks like a white teeshirt that was washed together with black clothes - kinda a dirty gray. It works suitably where sand is warranted, but I sure miss the option of using finer grit sands and would enjoy having some again. Back then, in Southern California there was also a milk-white quartz gravel, about 1/4 inch particle size, worked nicely as a top-dressing to supress moss growth and stabilized the media in the pots.
 
The only thing I could find here at lowes and home depo was builders sand and play sand. Now I haven't tried any pool places yet. I have started playing around with play sand for some mixes and it listed as bing silica sand, but it does seem fine, and would like a courser mis myself. I should be ok with it being quartz sand right? JUst being a little fine?
 
Quartz is fine.
 
I've been using play sand for a while, of course you need to wash it a bit, but the plants don't seem to mind. But yeah, it does seem to compact the soil a bit. Though, why use sand at all for plants like Utrics or water-loving species of Drosera? I say, when in vain, forget the sand and use pure peat. Though, I haven't tried pure peat yet, but I don't see why not.

-Ben
 
I used pure peat for nearly everything for a couple of years. But since I like to keep everything very wet, I had problems with anaerobic decomposition (sour soil) which helped me to lose a few plants.
 
  • #10
Presently I'm also using a vertical layering technique, and have been for several years now, this technique has helped eliminate the problem of sour soil (anaerobic activity). I vary the exact procedure depending on the genus of CP being planted, and modify how I create the layers in each pot, just to avoid being too monotonous. It seems to suffice just to have a vertical layer of entirely porous mineral matter. With this technique, I often create two layers of porous mineral such as perlite, pumice, vermiculite, or various combinations of these and a few other porous mineral ingredients.
 
  • #11
That's really interesting. So, you just have a random sort of "tower" of porous material standing in the pot surrounded by peat? As a substitution for pure peat, I'd think pure shredded LFS would work just fine, right?

-Ben
 
  • #12
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Drosera36 @ Oct. 06 2006,9:05)]That's really interesting. So, you just have a random sort of "tower" of porous material standing in the pot surrounded by peat? As a substitution for pure peat, I'd think pure shredded LFS would work just fine, right?

-Ben
Actually it evolved into a pillar of sphagnum peat surrounded by porous mineral media (pumice). Since then I have taken to doing it as illustrated in this drawing, quick and easy to do. Here is an image to help illustrate the concept. There are many variations of this technique that are possible. I've tried many of them and they all seem to work equally well.

vertical_layering_plus.png


If you use pumice or perlite for the porous mineral media, it not only increases the aeration of the media, but also reduces the amount of media needed per pot, and lightens the pot as well.
 
  • #14
I'm stupid.

What's the grit size mean? Does a smaller grit (like 30) mean the grains are larger? Or does a larger grit (like 100) mean it's larger?
 
  • #15
Cool idea Joseph, Thanks for detailing it as I was having a hard time picturing it as you'd described.. looks like I got some re-potting to do
biggrin.gif
 
  • #16
Joseph, where do you buy your pumice? I had been looking for some for my cacti, but couldn't find any sources.

-Ben
 
  • #17
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Drosera36 @ Oct. 07 2006,8:35)]Joseph, where do you buy your pumice? I had been looking for some for my cacti, but couldn't find any sources.

-Ben
I get it by the pickup truck load from a local supplier. My friends at "Plants for the Southwest", a local cacti-succulent nursery gave me the contact information.
 
  • #18
[b said:
Quote[/b] (JustLikeAPill @ Oct. 07 2006,7:37)]I'm stupid.

What's the grit size mean? Does a smaller grit (like 30) mean the grains are larger? Or does a larger grit (like 100) mean it's larger?
Yes the larger the grit size; the smaller the particles. In general it can be described, by example = 12 grit are particles that are the size that will just fit through screen wires that are spaced 12 to the inch. So, 12 particles of that size placed end to end + the combined length equal to the width of 11 wires used in the screen should equal an inch.

Here is a link that may help, some: Grit Size Conversion
 
  • #19
[b said:
Quote[/b] (mabudon @ Oct. 07 2006,7:51)]Cool idea Joseph, Thanks for detailing it as I was having a hard time picturing it as you'd described.. looks like I got some re-potting to do
biggrin.gif
You're welcome. I came up with this potting method in self-preservation and plant perservation. It really helps reduce root/crown rot problems for those of us who really like to grow their CP, wet. Nothing covers all possible permutations, but it is a step in that direction.
 
  • #20
This potting method makes me think of how the Mexican pings grow in the wild. The porous material would be the rock on the side of a hill, with a little crevice filled with soil, and the plant would grow in that.

-Ben
 
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