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Thread: Story of how Satan came to be found in the bible?

  1. #113
    JRFxtreme's Avatar
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    Man, this thread is really turning into a headache for me..

    But in the interest of continuing the debate..

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Yeah... I had the same experience. It was people like you saying things like that.
    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]All those silly orders from your god to kill everyone for the silliest little things.
    It was comments like these that made it seem as if you were picking on outsiders personally. Doesn't it seem that way to you? Afterall, we're debating the christian God.


    As far as the flood goes, the fact that God promises he would never do something like that again shows he felt what he did may have been too harsh. If this is true it means that he has regrets and if he were truely perfect then his actions would not cause him to have regrets. I beleive this is undisputable because of his promise it shows that even if the same scenario were to happen, he would refrain from flooding the earth again.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]"While the people of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man gathering sticks on the Sabbath day ... And The Lord said to Moses, "The man shall be put to death; all the congregation shall stone him with stones outside the camp." (Numbers 15:32,35 RSV)'
    I find that funny. So does God consider the act of stoneing work or recreation?

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]"If a man finds a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found; Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days Deuteronomy 22:28-29)."
    Does God consider that a fate worse than death?

  2. #114
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    I spoke up because he spoke about my friend and he doesn't even know him. Those killings are silly. I've said it before and i'll say it again.

    Personally, I can't wait to be stoned to death. I think i'll get started right now...

  3. #115
    Outsiders71's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (JustLikeAPill @ Dec. 07 2006,9:03)]I spoke up because he spoke about my friend and he doesn't even know him. Those killings are silly. I've said it before and i'll say it again.

    Personally, I can't wait to be stoned to death. I think i'll get started right now...
    I don't understand how knowing Josh as you claim to know him matters? The sake of debate isn't to form and proclaim clicks.
    James 1:17

    "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

  4. #116
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    I was sticking up for him. You made assumptions that I thought were pretty rude.

    clicks? I don't know what you're talking about. Really I don't. I left that HS crap behind.

    Why don't we go back a step and you tell me how all the murderous orders from god are just and loving? You pretty much ignored it. You gave me two links that only tried feebily to justify it.

  5. #117
    Outsiders71's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (JustLikeAPill @ Dec. 07 2006,9:39)]Auctually, no what you said also applied to me since I have such a distaste with the church. I was sticking up for him. You made assumptions that I thought were pretty rude.

    Why don't we go back a step and you tell me how all the murderous orders from god are just and loving? You pretty much ignored it. You gave me two links that only tried feebily to justify it.
    I quoted you word from word... this was clearly about your friend Josh and the fact that I don't know him.

    Sticking up for him? I'm sure Josh can stand on his own two feet. Give him some merit.

    If you were to read the two links I provided in it's fullness I'm sure you can find the answer to what you're looking for. Maybe you're just ignoring the answer?
    James 1:17

    "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

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    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    your right, sticking up for people is probably a sin, too.

    I read them TWICE dude! It's bs! Word for word!

  7. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (JustLikeAPill @ Dec. 07 2006,9:45)]your right, sticking up for people is probably a sin, too.

    I read them TWICE dude! It's bs! Word for word!
    How many more examples of argumentative immaturity are you going to show? There's no fight going on here, simmah down. This was a friendly debate until you took it upon yourself to take everything at a personal level. Once again if Josh wants to defend his argument he will. All your doing is ruining whatever argument he had. Can you please try to keep on topic and quit dragging this thread through the mud? Otherwise PM me and spare everyone else.
    James 1:17

    "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

  8. #120
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    Well I'll just have to go through it pretty much paragraph by paragraph if you don't believe I read them.

    "thou shalt not murder" ok. That's cool. i can accept a bad translation.

    ""Do not put anyone to death without cause."2 The Hebrew word used here is ratsach,3 which nearly always refers to intentional killing without cause (unless indicated otherwise by context). Hebrew law recognized accidental killing as not punishable. In fact, specific cities were designated as "cities of refuge," so that an unintentional killer could flee to escape retribution.4 The Hebrew word for "kill" in this instance is not ratsach, but nakah, which can refer to either premeditated or unintentional killing, depending upon context.5 Other Hebrew words also can refer to killing.6-8 The punishment for murder was the death sentence.9 However, to be convicted, there needed to be at least two eyewitnesses.10"

    I don't believe that those absurd reasons for stoning to death are "with cause". Rebeling against your parents, wearing flashy jewely, and "working" on the sabbath are not reasons to kill someone.... Call me crazy...


    "According to the Bible, God killed every human except Noah, his wife, his sons, and their wives in the flood. Were any of these people killed unjustly? The Bible says specifically that all people (except Noah and his family) had become corrupted.11 Not only had all people become corrupted, but they were continually plotting evil!12 Is it possible that an entire culture can become corrupted? You bet! Recent history proves the point rather well. When the Nazis took over Germany before WWII, opposition was crushed and removed. When they began their purging of the undesirables (e.g., the Jews), virtually the entire society went along with the plan. Further examples are given on another page. So, the Bible indicates that no innocent people were killed in the flood."

    One must ask if the children who were raised to be "corrupted" are at fault. If it's all you know, it's all you know. Doesn't matter, god "killed them with "cause" anyway. This "corruption" was compared to nazi's here. Something tells me it's not on the same level....

    "What about when God ordered Joshua and his people to kill every man, woman and child in Canaan?13 What crime could be so great that entire populations of cities were designated for destruction? God told Moses that the nations that the Hebrew were replacing were wicked.14 How "wicked" were these people? The text tells us that they were burning their own sons and daughters in sacrifices to their gods.15 So we see that these people were not really innocent. For these reasons (and others16), God ordered the destruction of the peoples whom the Israelites dispossessed."

    Yeah.. sacrificing people is bad and today is punished by death. That's justice to many many people. But once again, the children with killed. Did ALL of the children sacrifice people? You mean ever last person, man woman and child did this? what about the disabled and very old? Nah, they were prolly sacrificed too.

    "Surely God could have spared the children! People tend to assume that children are innocent, even if their parents are doing bad things. The assumption is unfounded. For example, Palestinian Muslim children are officially taught in grammar school to hate their Jewish neighbors.17 They are so well indoctrinated that some of them give up their lives in suicide bombings as children.18 Corruption literally does breed corruption, which is why God did not want the Hebrews tainted by the other corrupt cultures of the Middle East."

    BS once again. In this example, the kids are only taught hate in these middle eastern schools. This is ignorance, not corruption. It's not the fault of the children.

    "Surely there must have been other innocent adults in those cities who were destroyed with the wicked! There actually is an example of a time when God was asked if He would destroy the innocent along with the wicked. Prior to destroying Sodom and Gomorrah, Abraham asked God if He would destroy the righteous along with the wicked.19 God replied that He would spare the entire city for 50 righteous people.20 Abraham kept reducing the possible number of righteous people, asking God if He would destroy the entire city along with those number of righteous people.21 God's reply in each case was that He would not destroy the righteous along with the wicked. The lowest number Abraham asked about was ten righteous people, although the answer would likely be the same with as few as one righteous individual. How do we know this? God sent two angels to warn the four righteous people in Sodom to flee before He destroyed the city.22 It is quite convenient that such details are usually left out of atheistic sites complaining about the "evil" perpetrated by God. In fact, God saved certain people from being killed in cities such as Jericho.23"

    50 turns into 4? Man! I hope i'm invited to that party!


    "The commandment "Thou shalt not kill" is really not as general as the King James version would indicate. The commandment actually refers to premeditated, unjustified killing - murder. Although God ordered the extermination of entire cities, He did so in righteous judgment on a people whose corruption had led to extreme wickedness, including child sacrifice. Did God destroy the righteous along with the wicked? In an exchange with Abraham, God indicated that He would spare the wicked to save the righteous. He demonstrated this principle by saving righteous people from Sodom and Jericho prior to their destruction. The charge that God indiscriminately murdered people does not hold to to critical evaluation of the biblical texts."

    This is all dandy. however I never said indiscriminately.




    "If you were to read atheist's websites, you will often find complaints that the God of the Bible arbitrarily ordered the destruction of entire cities, such as Jericho, just to allow the Jews to have a homeland in the Middle East. How could a loving God command the destruction of all those innocent people? The argument sounds good, but it is utterly false. The unstated assumption is that the people who God ordered destroyed were morally equivalent to the Jews, who replaced them. However, this is what the Bible says about the people who were destroyed:

    "It is not for your righteousness or for the uprightness of your heart that you are going to possess their land, but it is because of the wickedness of these nations that the LORD your God is driving them out before you, in order to confirm the oath which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. (Deuteronomy 9:5)

    Okay, how "wicked" could those people have been? How about killing their own sons and daughters by burning them in sacrifices to their gods:

    "You shall not behave thus toward the LORD your God, for every abominable act which the LORD hates they have done for their gods; for they even burn their sons and daughters in the fire to their gods. (Deuteronomy 12:31)"


    ALL of those people did this? I find it SO hard to believe! Children......

    "The wickedness of these people is confirmed in other verses of the Bible.3 So we see that these people are not quite as innocent as the atheists would like you to believe. Then again, maybe those atheists believe that killing your children is not all bad. After all, killing viable pre-born babies is legal in this country (it's called a choice, a.k.a. medical procedure). For these reasons (and others4), God ordered the destruction of the peoples whom the Israelites dispossessed."

    I support womens rights and i'm d amn proud of it! you support medical procedure, apparently you deserve to die. Thanks, god.

    "In order to maintain His righteousness, God must judge sin - everything that goes against His character. If God let everyone into heaven, then He would have to allow in people such as Stalin and Hitler. Obviously, heaven would not be a good place to be with the likes of those people there. Therefore, God's righteousness requires the judgment of all sin. Only those people who agree with God and are willing to allow themselves to be changed into sinless beings can enter into heaven. For information on how to do this, click here."

    He would keep stalin and hitler out. That's good. He'd also keep Ghandi and Thomas Jefferson out. tom cruse, too! Then again... I'm not sure heaven would be heaven with tom cruse.. just kidding guys!

    Another thing, when someone hates someone else, things are made up. things are blown out of context. Ask a radical muslim and he'll tell you a jew was born of an animal or something stupid like that and has horns. Doesn't mean it's true.

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