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  1. #97
    Cardiac Nurse JB_OrchidGuy's Avatar
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    Bruce you have No clue what your talking about. You obviously have not read the book and just relied on things you hear on TV. Because that is the same spiel everyone claims that the rich would pay a lesser % of their income, but that is UNTRUE.

    OK Let me break it down for you with what I recall from the book OK?

    First off EVERY head of household would receive a prebate check from the government each month to cover the taxes they would normally pay on good up until the poverty line. A 4 person household would get more than a 2 person since the poverty line is less than that. OK so there that pays for all the taxes a poor family would need to spend to sustain themselves. SO bamm they pay no taxes on food and cloths because the government already gave them money to pay those taxes.

    Second unless it was a new good or service then you would not pay national sales tax on it. You buy a used car No tax. You buy a used home NO TAX!! You buy a new shirt your taxed. You buy a new house your taxed. And the prices of goods already have the national sales tax figured in. So if something costs 5 bucks you do not add the 23% to that 5 bucks it is already figured up into the price. So the way I see it is the poor folks already buy used cars and houses so they would not pay taxes on those. No rich person is going to buy a used car unless it is something they want to restore. No rich person is going to shop at goodwill. The fact of the matter is EVERYONE would be better off. I know from my standpoint if I was not being taxed to death on my paycheck I would be sitting rather pretty. I have a used home and all my cars are used. Smart shoppers like most of the NON-wealthy people are would see a decrease in their tax burden. The wealthy ware not going to cut back on their spending, and they are not going to buy used. So in actuality they would pay MORE in taxes than they currently are paying now. Since you know it and I know it Bruce, they do not pay much in taxes now because they shelter a lot of their wealth.

    Now IF we were to do the nation sales tax it would eliminate all corporate taxes. This means the US would become the worlds LARGEST tax shelter for businesses and corporations. Remember when Chrysler and Mercedes merged ( I think it was Mercedes) Any who when they merged they moved the company headquarters to Germany because the taxation was less. If we were to have the national sales tax in place they would have setup shop here because it would have been cheaper to do business here. Bringing with it all the jobs needed at the building.

    Lastly Everyone things that this would increase the costs of goods. ANOTHER FALLACY. Those corporate taxes I was talking about earlier, Those companies do not pay it anyway!! It gets passed on to the consumer. So in actuality you are paying around a 22% markup on everything you buy to pay those taxes the government charges the companies. If you take away the taxation on the companies they can lower the price roughly 22%. Then you tack on 23% to pay for the national sales tax and your in essence only paying 1% more for goods and services.

    i know what your going to say though. The companies are just going to tack on the 23% and not lower the price since they know people are used to paying. Yada yada yada. Well, this is when the free markets everyone loves comes into play. There was an instance a few years ago. I cannot remember the date, but there was a federal tax on all airline tickets purchased, and congress let it laps. Many companies continued to keep the extra built into the tickets and pocketed the extra money. This went on for a few weeks or so until ONE airline dropped that cost off the tickets to gain market share, and sure enough EVERYONE else dropped the extra tax off to compete.

    Now I also believe that 23% national sales tax is a little high, and I believe if it was implemented and worked they could lower it to 10% in 5 years. They would still be making a killing IMO. You have to think of all the money lost to the government due to people working under the table, drug dealers, and tourist. Just to name a few. Everyone who buys a good or service would pay the taxes INCLUDING those that normally skip out on paying taxes. All the illegal immigrants over here not paying taxes but sucking up the resources would pay when they bought something. The tourists would pay taxes when they came over to our country. The people working under the table as construction or farm hands or selling drugs or flea market things would pay taxes when they bought something NEW. Remember the tax would only be on NEW things or services. The government would see a HUGE increase in revenue, and everyone would have less of a tax burden. I know I would.

    And Bruce I am around a 50K a year household between my wife and I know. I am middle class I would say. My house is only a 70K fixer upper. The national sales tax would help me a lot. I don't see how it would place more of a burden on the poor when everyone got a prebate check. Even though we are a middle income family we still shop at goodwill and other places. All my cars are used and my house was used. So if I know it will help me then I KNOW it will help people who make less than me. And at the same time the rich would be contributing more and more to the government because they are the ones who have to buy new and the latest and greatest.

    It would even help my friend who neglects his house repairs to buy his son a PSP and himself an Xbox 360. He would have extra money to repair his house and still play his games. Since the prices of things should remain about the same, he would be increasing his bring home money.

    People really should read the book of the proposed national sales tax and find out all the details before you go spewing back all the stuff said on TV about it. The taxes really only come into affect when you start living above and beyond your means in the first place.
    JB
    Friend me on facebook with JB_orchidguy@yahoo.com.
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  2. #98

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    http://www.wnbc.com/news/10948106/detail.html

    apparently a senator from Brooklyn doesn't feel that people are smart enough to walk and do something else at the same time...

  3. #99
    quogue's Avatar
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    Heard about that on the radio this morning.... I love NY but.. The politicians are idiots and sometimes abusive or even criminals and end up getting re-elected...

  4. #100
    The Yarn Nerd aka VFT Gal krochetnkat's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Bugweed;809665]Quogue, If they can force you to wear a seatbelt, disguising in the form of "It'll save lives!", and take away your choice to live through an accident , or die in one (no seatbelt), then freedom of choice no longer exists. QUOTE]

    Heck, what about freedom to get decent medical care. I am sure you all saw the story about the cancer patient whose doctors took him to court when he made the decision to lose traditional medicine and take a holistic approach to healing! Amazing!

    I haven't heard anything else about this case (I am really not a TV person, news or otherwise so I tend to miss a lot of information) to see if the holistic approach was working... however... we would never know. They would never let people believe there may be a way they could actually survive by doing anything the natural way.

    This is my area of extreme emotion hehehe
    The Yarn Nerd

  5. #101
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    Heh, I'm all for natural medicine but if I ever got cancer I wouldn't waste my time with it by it's self. That's some serious stuff. I would of course use the natural approach secondary to western medicine.

    Shoot my up with chemo and radiate by butt!

    Wasn't that cancer patient a kid? If so then yes, the doctors were right to intervene.

  6. #102
    herenorthere's Avatar
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    I was talking about sales taxes in general and not that utopian sales tax with prebate check idea. Because it'll never happen. The most important thing about relying on sales taxes is that they're more volatile than income taxes. And not easily adjusted year to year. They make budget forecasting very difficult and lead to seriously boom & bust government financing. Making that fantasized prebate check very unreliable.
    Bruce in CT

    Madness is something rare in individuals but in groups, parties, peoples, ages it is the rule. Friedrich Nietzsche

  7. #103
    Whats it to ya? Finch's Avatar
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    Heard about that on the radio this morning.... I love NY but.. The politicians are idiots and sometimes abusive or even criminals and end up getting re-elected...
    reminds me of texas... haha
    that makes no logic

  8. #104
    The Yarn Nerd aka VFT Gal krochetnkat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustLikeAPill View Post

    Wasn't that cancer patient a kid? If so then yes, the doctors were right to intervene.
    He was 16.

    I actually had to look him up... this is his page. http://abrahamsjourney.com/theHOMEpage.html
    The Yarn Nerd

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