Ban-Crazy

[Clint]

Heh, I'm all for natural medicine but if I ever got cancer I wouldn't waste my time with it by it's self. That's some serious stuff. I would of course use the natural approach secondary to western medicine.

Shoot my up with chemo and radiate by butt!

Wasn't that cancer patient a kid? If so then yes, the doctors were right to intervene.

 

[herenorthere]

I was talking about sales taxes in general and not that utopian sales tax with prebate check idea. Because it'll never happen. The most important thing about relying on sales taxes is that they're more volatile than income taxes. And not easily adjusted year to year. They make budget forecasting very difficult and lead to seriously boom & bust government financing. Making that fantasized prebate check very unreliable.

 

[Finch]

Heard about that on the radio this morning.... I love NY but.. The politicians are idiots and sometimes abusive or even criminals and end up getting re-elected...

reminds me of texas... haha

 

[krochetnkat]

Wasn't that cancer patient a kid? If so then yes, the doctors were right to intervene.

He was 16.

I actually had to look him up... this is his page. http://abrahamsjourney.com/theHOMEpage.html

 

[Finch]

I think in this case he was not considered to be up to the age in which he was most mature in his decision making capabilities. If he was 18 or over, you know, fine his choice, but i dont know if kids that age really know whats best for them sometimes

 

[Clint]

Ohh 16, well I guess that's fine.

In that case I'm glad we won his case

Finch: He's 16, he's old enough to understand life and death and western vs. eastern medicine, and it's his life, I'm glad he won his case.

 

[Finch]

Yes but it is a scientific fact that the decision making portion of the brain in not fully mature untill later in life. He can know all he wants.

 

[Clint]

Finch, it's HIS life. Sure, OK I can agree with you on that, but it's HIS life and not yours and not the doctors or mine or anyone elses.

 

[Finch]

Thats what i said. Please re-read my post

If he was 18 or over, you know, fine his choice

to that i did not doubt that - i was doubting his maturity in his decision making

 

[Clint]

Ok, I see what you were saying.

Lol, we'll just have to yet again agree to disagree lol

 

[Finch]

I guess so.
Im not thinking that because of his age it was a slam-dunk in this regard- he could live to 44 and still feel the same way for all i know. Im just worried because i know i made many bad choices i regret at that age that i would not have done several years later- cept' this could be a mistake that costs him his life, and there could be no going back. That is my concern in this case.

 

[krochetnkat]

That is sort of where I am going. It is a personal choice that should be made on knowledge.

In this specific case... sure, if it were me I would have to be a little more trusting of the doctors. HOWEVER, it should be a personal decision whether to accept treatments (and a family should not be charged with neglect because they are standing beside their children's decisions...). I actually agree with the outcome, where they will be monitoring the results and he will go for medical treatment if the natural approach fails.

I will say that I am 100% behind alternative medicine and have seen it work WONDERS on both myself and others when REAL medicine either failed or made things worse. Personally, I avoid doctors at all cost because that is how I was raised... I have been on antibiotics maybe 5 times my entire life (4 when I Was a child), and the rest of the time my mom frowned on it. Do I get sick? All the freaking time hahaha If someone sneezes in Katmandu (I am in Virginia) I get their cold, but imagine how much worse it would be if I HAD been raised in a home where antibiotics were given for a common cold.Cancer is another breed of dog tho, one I personally wouldn't want to mess with, but one should have the right to make that decision.

 

[Finch]

If he were an adult that would a non-issue. I think the only reason that a issue was raised in the first place to prevent him from doing so was age only; do you have any case of this happening to a adult?

 

[krochetnkat]

If he were an adult that would a non-issue. I think the only reason that a issue was raised in the first place to prevent him from doing so was age only; do you have any case of this happening to a adult?

I don't know about legal action or specific cases, but I do know of cases where patients have been removed as patients because they refused treatment and have had difficult times finding other care because of this, even though they had serious medical problems that needed urgent assistance. I also personally know one person who tried to refuse care and the care was given anyway... and possibly at the cost of the individuals life (Still waiting to see how this story unfolds, but frankly... it doesn't appear she will survive, and if she does she will have absolutely no quality of life and I hope that you do see this on the news because it is a bunch of crap and there is no one who knows the whole story that believes it can happen in America). I have heard where families of elderly patients have been taken to court when they refused treatment (seen this personally as well) although I suppose legally they would be sort of put into the same category as children if they were unable to give their own voice.

Children on the other hand... Sad really. When an entity that really could care less about you can make a final decision on what you have done to your body.

 

[Bugweed]

Sigh. Doctors. Antibiotics. Medicine. Pharmaceutical Companies. I will stick with natural herbal remedies. They work. When folks start pooh poohing herbal remedies, where the hell do they think medicines started? It was in the best interest of the medical community to ridicule it so you would rely on them exclusively. And what did we get? No doctors anymore. Front men for the pharmaceutical outfits, with an emphasis these days to close down Natural Health shops. Cannot remember the name of the plan at the moment, but I watch everything the Government does as it is all in their best interest where money is concerned. I still cannot understand why the people still vote for the rich They have absolutely NO concept as to what it is like to be in our shoes. They vote for self interest, and NOT the will of the people. BTW, I am running for President on a write in basis. And I have no money to finance it. The people should vote from among their own if they really want a Government For the People, of the People, and by the people. Our "leaders" (and I use that in incredibly loose terms) have lost that vision in their greed for money, and a lust for power. Sorry, but the only power IS God, and not much else counts, especially money.

 

[krochetnkat]

Sigh. Doctors. Antibiotics. Medicine. Pharmaceutical Companies. I will stick with natural herbal remedies. They work. When folks start pooh poohing herbal remedies, where the hell do they think medicines started. It was in the best interest of the medical community to ridicule it so you would rely on them exclusively. And whatdid we get? No doctors anymore. Front men for the pharmaceutical outfits, with an emphasis these days to close down Natural Health shops. Cannot remember the name of the plan at the moment, but I watch everything the Government does as it is all in their best interest where money is concerned. I still cannot understand why the people still vote for rich They have absolutely NO concept as top what it is like to be in our shoes. They vote for self interest, and NOT the will of the people. BTW, I am running for President on a write in basis. And I have no money to finance it. The people should vote from among their own if they really want a Government For the People, of the People, and by the people. Our "leaders" (and I use that term in incredibly loose terms) have lost that vision in their greed for money, and a lust for power. Sorry, but the only power IS God, and not much else counts, especially money.

Wonderfully put and I agree with you 100%.

Unfortunately I don't believe Americans are put into a position to vote for the best person. We are stuck in this two party system and told that additional parties are "bad for the USA". American's, for the most part, refuse to do their own research on the topics and the people and wont make their own educated decisions based on facts, but on what they see on one-sided, television which is hardly accurate... ignorance is bliss.

I would vote for you.

 

[Bugweed]

Like I said, Kat, write in. Would the Powers that Be be shocked to realize they didn't "OWN" us anymore!!! I have the interest of the people and this country on my mind, and this Bogus War, started by President Shrub, is a killer. Plus, they blow so much smoke up our rears, they keep our attention diverted elsewhere so they can do something else illegal over here, knowing your attention is somewhere else. I love my country, and do not respect what this Government has become. Too much power in the hands of those who think they deserve it, and know better than us. I say, That is purely Bullsh**!!!!!!!!! Do not rely on parties. They want the same thing (POWER) without having to really deserve it. Different parties with the same agenda. To RULE the People. I believe Hitler had a similar plan.

 

[krochetnkat]

Like I said, Kat, write in. Would the Powers that Be be shocked to realize they didn't "OWN" us anymore!!! I have the interest of the people and this country on my mind, and this Bogus War, started by President Shrub, is a killer. Plus, they blow so much smoke up our rears, they keep our attention diverted elsewhere so they can do something else illegal over here, knowing your attention is somewhere else. I love my country, and do not respect what this Government has become. ,QUOTE]

Exactly, and when we voice our distaste for these things we are called "Freedom haters", when in reality it is the total opposite. I love my country, I love God, and I will defend either if called to do so.

I wish it were so simple to just write in... in reality, what is the odds of a write in ever being elected as long as the country is caught in this two party system? The individual would have to be someone who was known by the whole country. Then again... in the age of the internet and the state our country is in... I suppose it is possible. Am I debating myself here I think I need food.

 

[Bugweed]

It is a problem with change, seeing what really IS happening, and wanting to do it differently. Change is what made this country great, and change is needed again. The psychological ploys used by the "Elite" in Government works because it helps if you have blind sheep to follow the Judas Goat. Only good thing is that King Shrub has pretty much destroyed the Republican party in his immense greed. I know sooo many ex-republicans that have become independant because of this dumb S.O.B.

My platform: The Constitution of the United States of America
Live by: The Declaration of Independance
Backed By: The Bill of Rights.

Get rid of the power for the rich. MAKE them pay their fair share. Tell the Corporations they cannot contribute ANY money to campaigns. Toss out the lobbyists, and run the country by our written word.

 

[krochetnkat]

It is a problem with change, seeing what really IS happening, and wanting to do it differently. Change is what made this country great, and change is needed again. The psychological ploys used by the "Elite" in Government works because it helps if you have blind sheep to follow the Judas Goat. Only good thing is that King Shrub has pretty much destroyed the Republican party in his immense greed. I know sooo many ex-republicans that have become independant because of this dumb S.O.B.

My platform: The Constitution of the United States of America
Live by: The Declaration of Independance
Backed By: The Bill of Rights.

Get rid of the power for the rich. MAKE them pay their fair share. Tell the Corporations they cannot contribute ANY money to campaigns. Toss out the lobbyists, and run the country by our written word.

Amen. I think that is actually one of the most beautiful things I have ever seen in print.