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Thread: a history lesson on looooooooong range rifle shooting.......

  1. #1
    rattler's Avatar
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    a history lesson on looooooooong range rifle shooting.......

    during some of the discussions ive had on here some of the anti-gun types have brought up the fact of why do US Citizens need rifle capable of firing rounds that can kill a person at a mile away. the following is nothing more than to put facts to why that claim is silly.

    in 1873 the US Government decided to drop the 50-70 as the military's principle rifle cartridge and decided to use the 45-70. it also chose a new military rifle, the 1873 US Springfield, also known as a "Trapdoor Springfield". the 45-70 saw service officially for only 19 years though it was unofficially used in special military and police actions up until WWII. the 45-70 is still popular to this day giving it a life so far of around 134 years.

    in May of 1879, after the round and rifle already had extensive battle experience, the military decided to do some tests starting at Springfield Armory. the tests were to determine just how far away the 405 and 500 grain cast lead bullets could kill a man using volley fire. at the Springfield Armory rifle range the farthest away they could place the target was 1500 yards. at this distance both bullets zipped through 3 inches of hard wood and kept on going.

    since the military ran out of room at Springfield they moved the test to the beaches of Sandy Hook, New Jersey. a huge target was assembled 22 feet high by 44 feet wide. the target consisted of 6 layers of 1 inch thick hardwood boards. at a distance of 2500 yards(1.42 miles) the 405 grain bullets almost completely penetrated the targets. the 500 grain bullets zipped through the 6 inches of wood and continued on to bury themselves 6 inches into the sand.

    so they extended the range to 3200 meters(20 yards short of 2 miles) at which point the 500 grain bullets 1 and a half inches of hardwood........at 3680 yards the bullet still went through an inch of hardwood.

    it is a well known fact that the soldiers of the time, atleast those who were hunters and shooters before joined the military, could make life very dangerous for a person at 1000 yards and beyond. all this with a black powder round throwing a bullet between 1500 & 1800 feet per second depending on what bullet was used with no help of a telescopic sight.....just using iron sights.

    i do not have a Trapdoor Springfield. however for comparison here is the 45-70 round.

    (left to right) standard fingernail clipper for those not familiar with cartridges, a 22LR with a 32 grain bullet round, a 223 Remington with a 40 grain bullet, a 405 grain bullet for the 45-70(not the same design used in the 1879 tests though), a 45-70 round with 300 grain bullet, and a 30-06 with a 150 grain bullet.

    cervid serial killer
    Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety
    I didn't get stimulated but he kept his promise on change, that's about all I got left!
    http://www.wolfpointherald.com/--http://www.safety-brite.net/

  2. #2
    rattler's Avatar
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    oh yeah for comparison.....the 22 throws its bullet at 1500 feet per second , the 223 throws its bullet at 3600 feet per second and the 30-06 is at around 2900 feet per second
    cervid serial killer
    Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety
    I didn't get stimulated but he kept his promise on change, that's about all I got left!
    http://www.wolfpointherald.com/--http://www.safety-brite.net/

  3. #3
    Lauderdale's Avatar
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    My buddy shoots a Sharps 45-70 replica and that rifle gives a whole new meaning to "reach out and touch someone".
    He owns an original Sharps which has documentation that it was owned by a famous frontiersman. It is waaay to valuable to shoot. He also owns an original Hawkins.

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    rattler's Avatar
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    He owns an original Sharps which has documentation that it was owned by a famous frontiersman. It is waaay to valuable to shoot.
    and thats why i dont own any rifles like that.....no way in hell i could resist not touching it off.

    im thinking about a Sharps replica in one of the 50's though it will be a shorter, thinner barrel and such cause i want to use it for hunting and not target shooting off sticks. think it would be fun......
    cervid serial killer
    Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety
    I didn't get stimulated but he kept his promise on change, that's about all I got left!
    http://www.wolfpointherald.com/--http://www.safety-brite.net/

  5. #5
    RL7836's Avatar
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    Rattler,
    Have you read any of the books on Carlos Hathcock?
    All the best,
    Ron
    You must do the thing you think you cannot do. --- Eleanor Roosevelt

    *** Growlist / Wants / Offers ***
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  6. #6
    rattler's Avatar
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    yep.....have a few.....
    cervid serial killer
    Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety
    I didn't get stimulated but he kept his promise on change, that's about all I got left!
    http://www.wolfpointherald.com/--http://www.safety-brite.net/

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    I own a original 1873 trapdoor that I have been itching to shoot lately. Just having a hard time convincing my wife that the cost of ammo is worth it

    I have never fired it but when I was younger I saw it kick my dad's butt a few times.

  8. #8
    NICK,NICK,NICK!!!!! Indians....... likeAstone76's Avatar
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    Ah, the 30-06. The first rifle I ever shot. I shot my first deer with a 25-06 though. My Dad has a lever action 30/30 that I hope he leaves to me in his will, but I reckon I'll have to armwrestle my brother for it. Cool article rattler, thanks.
    Here's to the first of the of the day fellas!! To old, D.H. Lawrence!!!!

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