User Tag List

Informational! Informational!:  0
Likes Likes:  0
Page 5 of 9 FirstFirst 123456789 LastLast
Results 33 to 40 of 66

Thread: San Francisco considers injection room

  1. #33
    Doing it wrong until I do it right. xvart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Zone 8
    Posts
    5,594
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Outsiders71 View Post
    This isn't comparable to birth control...or homeless shelters or battered wives.
    And is there anything to support your opinion?

    Quote Originally Posted by PlantAKiss View Post
    BTW...not all drug addicts are street junkies shooting up heroin. Many are sitting right beside you in your office hard at work...or its your bus driver...a teacher...or the mother of three next door...
    Sounds very much like Fight Club. I totally agree with everything that you have said, PAK. Again, the problem already exists. What can we do to help ease the problem or manage the current situation? Just keep everything the same? Sounds good. I would think that after all the disgust that has been expressed with alternative ideas here that we would be more open to trying to problem solve instead of just sitting back and doing nothing.

    Nobody is saying this is the one solution to rule them all and nobody is saying that an injection room is going to solve the drug problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauderdale View Post
    After you see the real horrors of drug addiction…
    Some of us have seen the "real horrors" of drug addiction and realize why it's important to make some sort of effort.

    xvart.
    "The tragedy of life is not that every man loses; but that he almost wins."

    "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"

  2. #34
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Metro Atlanta Area
    Posts
    9,681
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I don't think there IS one single solution. NA works for some people and not others (of course they'll tell you it'll work for anyone if you "follow the steps", therapy works for some people and not others, methadone and disulfram treatment works for some and not others, and some can beat it themselves or use a combination of all of the above and even new age things like Iboga therapy and acupuncture can help. Trying to beat addiction halfheartedly is always a waste of time, for sure. One think I've always thought is that an addict has to really hit rock bottom before they can kick their habit. I don't think everyone's rock bottom is on the same level, and I also think the word "addiction" is a really gray word that can have several interpretations. A person can be a hardcore addict or completely sober but there are so many intermediate levels between those two extremities, and people forget that and can get themselves into trouble that way. It's pretty sad. What I find REALLY sad is people who become addicted to legitimate medications completely by accident because their pain is just. that. bad. I guess that's where the difference between addiction and dependency comes into play.

    It's presumptuous to assume that people who you don't REALLY know have or have not seen something. One of my old friends died because he was a junkie and didn't use good judgment and put himself in a dangerous situation with dangerous people. You and I can see the same things and have totally different experiences and opinions about it. You might think he got what he deserved; I don't.

  3. #35
    rattler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    missing, presumed dead
    Posts
    8,554
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    ive been minorly addicted to prescription pain meds......can really see how one gets to a certain point....i have a hell of alot of will power....others dont....i took myself off my drugs......went through 4 days of hell doing it.......and as i said mine was a minor addiction....even just cutting what your taking in half can cause you hell.......ask my wife, she watched me go through it..........4 days of shakes, headaches, literally feeling like the skin was trying to walk off my back......i understand why ppl with less will power and tougher addictions choose to stay addicted and not take themselves off the drugs. i also have MAJOR issues with the current war on drugs.........

    that said, find someone to donate to keep a place like this open....dont rely on tax dollars.....dont supply the drugs and dont hold the nurses accountable if the ppl bring in crap that kills them..........
    cervid serial killer
    Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety
    I didn't get stimulated but he kept his promise on change, that's about all I got left!
    http://www.wolfpointherald.com/--http://www.safety-brite.net/

  4. #36

    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Ft. Worth, TX
    Posts
    2,251
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    It must be very chic to defend these poor downtrodden people
    No joke. I'm so sick of how its a trend to be so PC to the point of causing yourself distress just to look more accepting. People these days constantly try to guilt trip each other into being so accepting of everything, i.e. other traditions/cultures, even if it means they have to give up or ignore their own. Makes me sick. Lift up your skirt and grow a pair, status quo.
    Z polski y dumny
    Prayer - how to do nothing and still think you're helping.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F5aCUNE4Z8
    ^^^Newest vid

  5. #37
    Outsiders71's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    1,005
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by xvart View Post
    And is there anything to support your opinion?
    xvart.
    Can you tell me how they are the same? Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the issue at hand here is that there is: A) Drug abusers and B) A clinic or safe house that allows A to come and legally abuse drugs, with a nurse on hand in case they OD. No other form of treatment is offered, so you must OD to get any.

    Tell me how this is comparable to using a birth contraceptive? They are not analogous.

    Homeless shelters, at least the ones I've been too offer A) Shelter B) Food and C) Programs to help the homeless get jobs and residence.

    Before you compare a homeless man to a drug abuser you must first identify the root cause of each. Are the drug abusers mentally handicapped? The majority of the homeless suffer from mental illnesses such as Schizophrenia. This isn't surprising since when state mental institutions were closed down, many ended up in the streets and many can be found in prisons. So yeah while some homeless cases are hard to treat and may share little to no improvement just like a drug abuser, it's not analogous. They are for the most part mentally handicapped and sometimes do abuse drugs as well but the underlining factor is they are mentally handicapped. Please don't even ask me to compare how a mentally handicapped person is different than a non-mentally handicapped person who's abusing drugs.

    The silliest comparison made was about the battered wives. In fact I'm not even going to comment on it, I'm sure everyone here is capable of figuring out how being a battered wife is different than being a drug abuser who gets to legally abuse drugs.

    I'm sure you could have figured out all of the above xvart without having me explaining it.
    James 1:17

    "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

  6. #38
    Outsiders71's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    1,005
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by phissionkorps View Post
    No joke. I'm so sick of how its a trend to be so PC to the point of causing yourself distress just to look more accepting. People these days constantly try to guilt trip each other into being so accepting of everything, i.e. other traditions/cultures, even if it means they have to give up or ignore their own. Makes me sick. Lift up your skirt and grow a pair, status quo.
    There's a difference between having compassion for drug abusers and giving them a clinic that enables them to abuse drugs, LEGALLY, w/o any kind of treatment programs offered besides OD treatment.

    Maybe we should just one-way fly them all to Amsterdam, wouldn't that be the same thing? That way they could abuse whatever they want legally, plus have free health care, and to top it off probably have the world's most experienced doctors and nurses when it comes to drug abuse! That way we'd have 100% of drug abusers seeking treatment, no abandon needles, and a 100% reduction of crime related to drug abuse.
    James 1:17

    "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

  7. #39
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Metro Atlanta Area
    Posts
    9,681
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Excuse you. Heroin, cocaine,amphetamines, etc are all illegal there. Are YOU high outsiders? You seem to be talking out of your head without any basis in fact AT ALL, which leads me to believe you're either very ignorant or very high. May I ask who you get such good dope from to come up with these silly, fictitious ideas of yours? Jimmy on the corner of Maple and 3rd, perhaps?

    The police there are very busy fighting drugs, they are just smart enough to pick their battles instead of the "all or nothing" policy of the US.

    I can fully agree that treatment options should be available. Would your opinion change if it was?



    EDIT: since we are talking about harm reduction, anyone can feel free to visit this website to learn how to be safer. Remember kids, safety first!
    http://www.dancesafe.org/

  8. #40
    endparenthesis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Northern VA
    Posts
    1,262
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    It's a sad fact that we can't help everyone. If we could, I might go for a program like this, but things being as they are I'd rather the resources be directed to people who actually want help. Someone who's that reckless with his own life will lose it. That's how gambling works. One day, you lose. The possibility of losing is what you signed up for. If an addict wants help, he has rehab and various other programs available. If he wants to keep gambling, well, he's on his own.

    I'd only consider supporting this if it helped people besides the addicts. PAK's comment a few posts back about paramedics, for example. I can agree with that for the same reason I don't have a problem with helmet laws or the seemingly silly illegality of suicide. They help keep the gamblers from taking up some ER doctor's time who can't favor one patient over another. Helping the people who revere life should be the primary focus... if it also happens to help the people who squander it, all the better, but it's an auxiliary benefit. It doesn't look like we have enough information yet to know if this program fits the bill.

    I'm also not convinced that this doesn't enable. Creating a place like this isn't the same as condoning, but it does put a more attractive veneer on drug use that I don't think it deserves. Drug evangelists are always complaining about the media demonizing drugs and filling people's heads with propaganda. Well, it goes both ways. Is there really a such thing as a safe place to do heroin? Making something so insidious appear somehow manageable is just another deception... a more destructive one at that. A place like this may send a subtle but powerful psychological signal to its patrons, who are already not exactly known for their critical thinking skills. The illusion of safety can lead people to become more complacent about the terrible situations they're in. If they don't have to change their lives, they usually won't. If muddying already-muddy waters with this illusion isn't enablement, it's certainly one of its cousins.

    Maybe it's a good thing that drugs are scary. Maybe all those horrors help more people quit than any clinic ever could. Maybe it's better for someone to be thinking, moments before shooting up, "Will this kill me?" rather than, "Ehn, this won't kill me. I've got nurses." It's that brutal honesty that, every once in a while, wakes a person up. Is making it slightly easier for these people to just keep sleepwalking through their lives really what they need in the end?

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •