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Thread: Ron Paul 2008 Revolution

  1. #97
    Californian in DC DrWurm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rattler_mt View Post
    .....chances are the kid who comes out of it will be alot more grounded than most
    That's true. One trend I do like about the US, is that every new generation is more tolerant than the previous.

  2. #98
    Outsiders71's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rattler_mt View Post
    cant be any worse than some of the straight households ive seen............a normal man and woman marriage can f'up a kid pretty bad..............the idea of a marriage be tween two ppl of the same sex doesnt even raise my eyebrow........and i do believe they can take care of a kid atleast aswell as a f'ed up heterosexual couple, hell they can prolly do alot better than some. i live on an indian reservation and have seen some of the most screwed up family values out there..........if a gay couple love each other, want to get married and raise a kid as their own? what the hell why not.......a loving environment can only be a good one......chances are the kid who comes out of it will be alot more grounded than most
    Sure there are bad marriages and divorces like I stated. I was just waiting for those to pop up as a reason why gay couples should raise a child. However the same issues will occur for gay couples, I don't understand why everyone thinks they are immune from them.

    Rattler: Do you believe men are different from women or are we all the same?
    James 1:17

    "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

  3. #99
    Outsiders71's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finch View Post
    Who said anything about the law, i was talking about perception. And the law is inherently about perception, interpertation. Judicial history tells that tale. I dont have a problem not calling at marriage. do or dont, if you get the same legal rights why do you need it to be called marriage? perception, thats why. They want to be seen as married in they eyes of people and the law, and thats why many feel that 'civil union' is not good enough. Frankly i dont really give a hoot one way or the other because it does not affect me, but i understand where they are coming from.
    We're not talking about perception here, we're talking about legal equality! Thanks for confirming my premise that it is about being accepted more than having the same rights.
    James 1:17

    "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

  4. #100
    Doing it wrong until I do it right. xvart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outsiders71 View Post
    I believe the ideal family should consist of one man and one woman as the head of the family.
    Two points here: first, you say "I believe." Second, you say "ideal family."

    No family is ideal, in my opinion. That's what makes a family a family. Through thick and thin, a family are the people that love and support you, no matter what. It doesn't matter what the combination or makeup of the family unit is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Outsiders71 View Post
    Rattler:

    Do you believe gay couples can provide a healthy environment for developing children?
    By no means am I rattler, but I will answer this question, too: I believe that each family unit has to be judged on it's own merit and you can't answer this question generally. I know there are poor husband/wife couples that do not provide healthy environments for developing children just like I am sure that there are husband/husband or wife/wife couples that do not provide healthy environments. In fact, if I were to wager a guess, there are probably many many more (on the order of magnitudes) husband/wife families that provide poor environments than gay couples; but, that is because there are many many more straight couples with children than gay couples. I would guess that if there were equal number of gay and straight couples, we would see about an equal number of good family environments and poor family environments between the two.

    xvart.
    "The tragedy of life is not that every man loses; but that he almost wins."

    "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"

  5. #101
    Californian in DC DrWurm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outsiders71 View Post
    We're not talking about perception here, we're talking about legal equality! Thanks for confirming my premise that it is about being accepted more than having the same rights.
    The perception develops that they are unequal. With that, they become unequal. Equality is nothing more than a perception. You can choose to not accept them as loving people even if they're "married." Although, I hope that some day, you finally realize that it's just better if you accept people for who they are.

  6. #102
    Whats it to ya? Finch's Avatar
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    re not talking about perception here, we're talking about legal equality! Thanks for confirming my premise that it is about being accepted more than having the same rights.
    I feel that legal equality cannot be separated from perception, because everything a person does is affected by their own perceptions of the matter. We can minimize it and almost eradicate it if we try enough, but it will rarely be eliminated. How many time have you found people show a sudden case where they let their biases get the better of them? Even if the know better, even if they said differently? Laws must go through people.

    On the same stream, I feel being accepted as such is inseparable and inherently a part of having the same rights. I feel this is backed up in history many times.
    that makes no logic

  7. #103
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    As far as the comment of why we compare our movement to the AA's fight for their rights, it's because, while it pales in comparison, it's similar enough to compare it to. If you believe it's not appropriate for gays to raise a child, do you believe it's inappropriate for a single parent to raise a child? Neither have both sexes involved. Do you believe it's better for a child to be bounced from foster home to foster home, than to be adopted into a loving family by a gay couple?

    PS: I'm still working on not getting angry lol. So far I think I'm doing OK!

  8. #104
    Californian in DC DrWurm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustLikeAPill View Post
    PS: I'm still working on not getting angry lol. So far I think I'm doing OK!
    Tough, isn't it? I vent to friends on AIM, then post calmly.

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