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  1. #25
    herenorthere's Avatar
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    The US also harbors terrorists and and places their supporters in high level positions. And it's inevitable that more oil will be priced in Euros. I wouldn't want to be paid with Monopoly money either.
    Bruce in CT

    Madness is something rare in individuals — but in groups, parties, peoples, ages it is the rule. Friedrich Nietzsche

  2. #26

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    I'm sorry but you are completely wrong. There was no al qaeda in Iraq until the US invaded. Saddam and Bin Laden were bitter enemies. The only terrorist in Iraq were Saddam and his army.
    Sorry, but you're horribly and completely mistaken. It has never been proven that there was "no Al Qaeda in Iraq". The thought that that is a fact is an oft repeated fallacy.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6d7fHvHXeiQ
    Z polski y dumny
    Prayer - how to do nothing and still think you're helping.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F5aCUNE4Z8
    ^^^Newest vid

  3. #27
    SirKristoff is a poopiehead Ozzy's Avatar
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    I don't know what your video proved, because it didn't prove anything to me. You need to study the relationship between Saddam and al qaeda, or lack of one. I guess all the terrorist were hiding under all the WMD that saddam was producing.

    The terrorist came into Iraq after the US invaded.

    Show me one piece of evidence that says otherwise.

  4. #28

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    If it didn't prove anything to you, you must not have had the sound on. You said there were no terrorists in Iraq when Saddam was in power, which is totally fictitious. There certainly are many more terrorists in Iraq after Saddam, but you've got to be totally naive to think that there were none while he was in power. The video names 3 or 4 known terrorists that were in Iraq before the US invaded, one of which operated as an arm of the Iraqi state....I really don't see how you can not understand that, pretty simple concept.

    The terrorist came into Iraq after the US invaded.

    Show me one piece of evidence that says otherwise.
    Ok, no problem: http://bluestarchronicles.com/2007/0...80%99s-regime/
    Straight from the horse's mouth, too! Looks like you're the one that should be doing the studying
    This too: http://strata-sphere.com/blog/index.php/archives/5181


    Got some more:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ansar_al-Islam
    Was in Iraq, and allowed to operate w/ Saddam's knowledge

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Musab_al-Zarqawi
    In Iraq at least by 2002

    http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Art...7-B552C3D54A6C

    OH NO! OH MY GOD! IT CAN'T BE!:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saddam_...Qaeda_timeline
    Look at the contracts from 95 onward

    Remember in 98 when Clinton said Al Sifa Pharma plant was producing WMDs (chemical weapons) and was a joint operation between Al Qaeda and Saddam....and used that as justification to bomb it?
    http://www.espac.org/al_shifa_pages/al-shifa_4.asp

    Ramzi Yousef and his Uncle, Khalid Sheik Mohammed, bomed the WTC in ‘93. Guess where they came from? They traveled on Iraqi passports and came from Baghdad. His uncle was also part of Al Qaeda.

    UH-OH! Look at this: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/947627/posts
    and this: http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewSpecialRe...20041004a.html
    and this: http://www.nationalreview.com/murdoc...0310210934.asp

    Time to admit you're wrong.
    Z polski y dumny
    Prayer - how to do nothing and still think you're helping.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F5aCUNE4Z8
    ^^^Newest vid

  5. #29
    SirKristoff is a poopiehead Ozzy's Avatar
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    Ok I don't have time to go through all your crap. But I did look at a few of them. Here is what YOUR evidence says.


    About Abu Musab al-Zarqawi

    He was believed to have formed al-Tawhid wal-Jihad, which later became the group called Al-Qaeda in Iraq, in the 1990s, and led it until his death in June 2006.
    I know you think that is proof that he was in Iraq in the 90's, but he wasn't and that's not what it says.

    al-Tawhid wal-Jihad became Al-Qaeda in Iraq in 2004.

    Following Zarqawi's October 17, 2004 pledge of allegiance to Osama bin Laden's al-Qaeda network, the group gradually became popularly known as al-Qaeda in Iraq (official name Tanzim Qaidat al-Jihad fi Bilad al-Rafidayn)
    Abu Musab al-Zarqawi (Arabic: أبومصعب الزرقاوي‎, ’Abū Muṣ‘ab az-Zarqāwī, Abu Musab from Zarqa)) (October 30, 1966June 7, 2006), born Ahmad Fadeel al-Nazal al-Khalayleh (Arabic: أحمد فضيل النزال الخلايله‎, ’Aḥmad Faḍīl an-Nazāl al-Ḫalāyla) was a Jordanian militant Islamist who ran a militant training camp in Afghanistan. He became known after going to Iraq and being accused by United States and Jordanian officials for a series of bombings, beheadings and attacks during the Iraq War.
    Saddam Hussein was distrustful of al-Qaeda and viewed Islamic extremists as a threat to his regime, refusing all requests from al-Qaeda to provide material or operational support
    Postwar findings have identified only one meeting between representatives of al-Qa'ida and Saddam Hussein's regime reported in prewar intelligence assessments. Postwar findings have identified two occasions, not reported prior to the war, in which Saddam Hussein rebuffed meeting requests from an al-Qa'ida operative. The Intelligence Community has not found any other evidence of meetings between al'Qa'ida and Iraq.
    As a result of the Senate report, many believe that the entire connection between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaeda constitutes an official deception based on the "cherry-picking" of only that intelligence that bolstered the case for war with Iraq regardless of its reliability. The BBC reports the reaction to this report;
    Thank you so much for providing evidence that proves what I have been saying.

    I think a quote from the first youtube video somes it up the best.

    Christopher Hitchens : "How can you know so little about this and mumble, mumble"
    Sorry I couldn't understand what he said at the end.

    Ronald Regan Jr. : "I guess because I listened to the 9/11 commission and read their report and they said that Saddam hussein was not supporting terror"

    Now I never said there has never been a terrorist in Iraq. There are terrorist in every country. Saddam was no danger to the US in any way, including through terrorism.

  6. #30

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    I know you think that is proof that he was in Iraq in the 90's,
    I never said that, I said 2002. Read before you attempt to misrepresent me, it makes your argument look weaker than it already is. Just an interesting side note though; can you PROVE he was never in Iraq in the 90s? Do you have a play by play analysis of his entire life? I'm going to assume you don't.

    Maybe you should have actually read the article on Zarqawi I posted, hmm? This isn't going to do wonders for your argument either:
    When our coalition ousted the Taliban, the Zarqawi network helped establish another poison and explosive training center camp. And this camp is located in northeastern Iraq. He traveled to Baghdad in May 2002 for medical treatment, staying in the capital of Iraq for two months while he recuperated to fight another day. During this stay, nearly two dozen extremists converged on Baghdad and established a base of operations there. These Al Qaeda affiliates, based in Baghdad, now coordinate the movement of people, money and supplies into and throughout Iraq for his network, and they've now been operating freely in the capital for more than eight months.
    WHOAH! That PROVES he was in Iraq in 2002, just like I said! Imagine that!
    the Iraqi regime was, at a minimum, aware of al-Zarqawi’s presence in Baghdad in 2002
    Bingo! I said he was in Iraq in 2002, and not surprisingly, I was right.
    Sensitive reporting indicates senior terrorist planner and close al Qaeda associate al Zarqawi has had an operational alliance with Iraqi officials. As of October 2002, al Zarqawi maintained contacts with the IIS to procure weapons and explosives, including surface-to-air missiles from an IIS officer in Baghdad. According to sensitive reporting, al Zarqawi was setting up sleeper cells in Baghdad to be activated in case of a U.S. occupation of the city, suggesting his operational cooperation with the Iraqis may have deepened in recent months. Such cooperation could include IIS provision of a secure operating bases [sic] and steady access to arms and explosives in preparation for a possible U.S. invasion. Al Zarqawi's procurements from the Iraqis also could support al Qaeda operations against the U.S. or its allies elsewhere
    Uh oh...looks like Iraqi officials were giving him weapons. Kinda totally nullifies the claims that he wasn't there and terrorism didn't exist under Saddam.
    As to the report you quoted, 1) it said that it didn't find evidence that they had ties, not that there wasn't any. Just because you can't find evidence of something, especially at a given time, doesn't mean it doesn't exist, or may not be eventually proven true. 2) "it also recognizes that there are still unanswered questions and gaps in knowledge about the relationship.""
    "...by the spring and summer of 2002, more than a dozen al-Qa'ida-affiliated extremists converged on Baghdad, with apparently no harassment on the part of the Iraqi government. They found a comfortable and secure envirnonment in which they moved people and supplies to support Zarqawi's operations in northern Iraq."
    Your "evidence" is speculative, at best.

    Thank you so much for providing evidence that proves what I have been saying.
    Yes, because hard evidence against your claims (with little, speculative support) totally supports your position. Let's not be silly.

    "This December will mark three years since United Nations inspectors last visited Iraq. There is no doubt that since that time, Saddam Hussein has reinvigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam continues to refine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a licit missile program to develop longer- range missiles that will threaten the United States and our allies." -- From a December 6, 2001 letter signed by Bob Graham, Joe Lieberman, Harold Ford, & Tom Lantos among others
    ["Whereas Iraq has consistently breached its cease-fire agreement between Iraq and the United States, entered into on March 3, 1991, by failing to dismantle its weapons of mass destruction program, and refusing to permit monitoring and verification by United Nations inspections; Whereas Iraq has developed weapons of mass destruction, including chemical and biological capabilities, and has made positive progress toward developing nuclear weapons capabilities" -- From a joint resolution submitted by Tom Harkin and Arlen Specter on July 18, 2002
    "Even today, Iraq is not nearly disarmed. Based on highly credible intelligence, UNSCOM [the U.N. weapons inspectors] suspects that Iraq still has biological agents like anthrax, botulinum toxin, and clostridium perfringens in sufficient quantity to fill several dozen bombs and ballistic missile warheads, as well as the means to continue manufacturing these deadly agents. Iraq probably retains several tons of the highly toxic VX substance, as well as sarin nerve gas and mustard gas. This agent is stored in artillery shells, bombs, and ballistic missile warheads. And Iraq retains significant dual-use industrial infrastructure that can be used to rapidly reconstitute large-scale chemical weapons production." -- Ex-Un Weapons Inspector Scott Ritter in 1998
    "Every day Saddam remains in power with chemical weapons, biological weapons, and the development of nuclear weapons is a day of danger for the United States." -- Joe Lieberman, August, 2002
    Maybe, just maybe, you'll be able to temporarily stop ignoring fact, just for a few moments, and read this:
    http://www.nysun.com/foreign/report-...st-ties/72906/
    This one might help clear some things up too: http://www.husseinandterror.com/

    Here's some other interesting info: http://www.cfr.org/publication/7702/

    http://www.globalpolitician.com/2323-iraq

    http://www.northstarwriters.com/dc159.htm

    I could go on, but anyone with an inkling of logic can see that I've already torn your embarrassingly weak argument to shreds. I love proof, especially when the balance is heavily, well ok, totally, tipped in my favor.

    Z polski y dumny
    Prayer - how to do nothing and still think you're helping.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F5aCUNE4Z8
    ^^^Newest vid

  7. #31
    herenorthere's Avatar
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    Quoting a bunch of hacks proves what? al-Zarqawi’s presence in northern Iraq means nothing, other than that the US was OK with him being there, since the US had much more influence in Kurdish territory than Hussein did at that time. The US supposedly decided it would be more damaging to target him than to leave him alone. That doesn't support him being seen as a pivotal player. He certainly became one, alligning with al-Quaeda after the US attacked Afghanistan and preparing to take on the expected US invasion of Iraq. Many believe his image was boosted by US propaganda, which sought to portray him as having great strength, inflence and general evilness, when he was actually just one of a number of self-indulgent, interchangeable murderers.

    But I'm lost; what does this have to do with the topic? Last I heard, neither al-Zarqawi or Saddam Hussein or anyone else from the Middle East has ever been accused of forcing even a single American to a buy big car to drive to and from a big house full of big appliances too far from everything. Much of the pain at the pump is self-inflicted.
    Bruce in CT

    Madness is something rare in individuals — but in groups, parties, peoples, ages it is the rule. Friedrich Nietzsche

  8. #32
    Doing it wrong until I do it right. xvart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by herenorthere View Post
    But I'm lost; what does this have to do with the topic? Last I heard, neither al-Zarqawi or Saddam Hussein or anyone else from the Middle East has ever been accused of forcing even a single American to a buy big car to drive to and from a big house full of big appliances too far from everything. Much of the pain at the pump is self-inflicted.
    Wrong, Bruce. Saddam sent me a personal email explaining the benefits of driving a Hummer. I'll never forgive him for deceiving me and now he's dead; so I guess he got the last laugh.

    xvart.
    "The tragedy of life is not that every man loses; but that he almost wins."

    "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"

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