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Thread: Close to ocean?

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    SpyCspider's Avatar
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    Close to ocean?

    Hi,

    Not sure this belongs in this section, but I would like to talk a little about habitat. We've all read that American CPs grow mostly in cedar swamps, sphagnous bogs and wet savannahs where the water is usually acidic and sterile, with the exception of the slightly basic marl fens. Having been on a few "bog" expeditions myself ever since I was a child and discovered a true bog in Acadia N'tl Park, I find it suprising that most of the habitats that supported CPs were strangely close to the ocean. On many occasions, I would strike out when attempting to find plants in inland bodies of water, but as soon as I get close to the beach, I would find them. This occurred from Maine to Jersey to Florida to somewhat the Texas coast. And what makes me confused is why wouldn't that water be brackish? Aren't salt-water marshes usually what rivers turn into upon entering into the sea? Instead, I find a good habitat for CPs (where I assume the water's perfectly fresh) and the ocean would sometimes just be a few blocks down.

    Eh, I was browsing through Schnell's book and it got me wondering. I took one ecology course on watersheds back in college and that's it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by spycspider2 View Post
    Hi,

    Not sure this belongs in this section, but I would like to talk a little about habitat. We've all read that American CPs grow mostly in cedar swamps, sphagnous bogs and wet savannahs where the water is usually acidic and sterile, with the exception of the slightly basic marl fens. Having been on a few "bog" expeditions myself ever since I was a child and discovered a true bog in Acadia N'tl Park, I find it suprising that most of the habitats that supported CPs were strangely close to the ocean. On many occasions, I would strike out when attempting to find plants in inland bodies of water, but as soon as I get close to the beach, I would find them. This occurred from Maine to Jersey to Florida to somewhat the Texas coast. And what makes me confused is why wouldn't that water be brackish? Aren't salt-water marshes usually what rivers turn into upon entering into the sea? Instead, I find a good habitat for CPs (where I assume the water's perfectly fresh) and the ocean would sometimes just be a few blocks down.

    Eh, I was browsing through Schnell's book and it got me wondering. I took one ecology course on watersheds back in college and that's it.
    Well, many bogs are not far from shores but they are generally not associated with estuaries -- watercourses where salt and freshwater meet to produce brackish conditions, sometimes saltier (through evaporation) than the ocean itself. Where those particular watercourses empty out at sea would certainly be brackish. In SW Australia, many marshlands are very close to the beaches; and for a long time, it was even thought that salt was required to successfully cultivate species such as Cephalotus and some other allied Australian marsh-plants . ..
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    SirKristoff is a poopiehead Ozzy's Avatar
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    I moved this to general discussions.

    I have always wonder the same thing. Most of the cp's I've found are located within 10 miles of the ocean. I have found them within feet of the ocean.

    I never find them along rivers close to the ocean though. They are always located in wet areas that never touches salt water. So I don't think that the brackish water reaches them.

    I've also wondered a lot about this myself. But I have also found them as far as 80 miles inland.

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    SpyCspider's Avatar
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    Yea there are definitely some stranded nowhere near the ocean shore, and usually that's where I would start looking. But many a times I would keep searching until I find a spot and then a little bit further would be the blue waters of sea. Maybe it has something to do with the ocean wind keeping taller shrubs down? What about sand? I'm pretty sure the white sand that many CPs grow in isn't the same as beach sand, but again that's what I find pecuiliar...because they literally flow into each other.

    And what irritates me is when I spot what looks like a perfectly good bog from afar...with tea-colored water and dead or stunted trees...short sedges along the shores. I would be 99% convinced it was prime CP habitat, but then as soon as I get close..nothing. The lack of sphangum is usually the first sign and then seeing fish in the water is the second for me.

    What really tripped me out when I was younger exploring the Jersey Pine Barrens were how intensely bright blue some of the waters were. Usually those were cranberry bogs I think, and my dad and I would drive around them, but here and there you would see the tips of submerged dead trees rising out of the clear blue waters. The water would be totally still--no ripples. And it was eerily silent. Even during the noonday sun, I would get chills because it looked like such an image of death.

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    dude...cut down stream not across radjess331's Avatar
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    well the ocean would provide high humidity like most cp's like....also with the ocean there there should be breezes instead of standing air.
    PaRtY hArD rOcK'n RoLl We'Re ThE ClAsS yOu CaN't CoNtRoL ThE gUyZ aRe HoT ThE GiRlS aRe FiNe We'Re ThE ClAsS oF 2009!!!!

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    Focusing on Sarracenias, only S. purpurea ranges far from the coast. Most of the S purp. habitat I knew in Maine was away from the ocean, although obviously not that far, but no matter where I looked, pretty much every place likely to have Sarrs did have them. The only time I can remember seeing them along flowing water was along muskeg streams, which don't deposit sediment the same way as other streams. Alluvium isn't a good home for Sarrs.

    Maybe Sarrs used to be present in more upland areas in the south but, without glaciers to restart the clock, most upland landscapes long ago matured into unfavorable habitats. Even the few thousand years difference between Maine and Connecticut makes a big difference. Many of the appropriate upland habitats that still existed in the South a couple hundred years ago were drained for agriculture or were other otherwise affected by it, leaving S. jonesii, etc. clinging to whatever they can find. The remaining suitable marshes and wet savannah are mostly along the coast where, until recently, development pressure was much less. The north's much younger landscape provides many more opportunities for Sarrs.
    Bruce in CT

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    SpyCspider's Avatar
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    cool, Bruce. That made a lot of sense to me. =) Just hope they don't get pushed all the way to the edge with nowhere else to go in few years...sigh.

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    Hello, I must be going... Not a Number's Avatar
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    There are plenty of Sphagnum bogs in Wisconsin and Canada with Sarracenia purpurea ssp purpurea, Drosera rotundifolia, Drosera anglica, and Drosera linearis that are nowhere near the ocean.
    Grand Hotel... always the same. People come, people go. Nothing ever happens.

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