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Thread: No public health care = no change

  1. #9
    dashman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JRFxtreme View Post
    I know what you mean. A few months ago I slipped and hit my head and had to go to the ER. The cost of a MRI + xrays came out to over $7k. Luckily I only had to pay $200 as my health insurance covered the rest. The only problem is in a few months I'm going to have to drop my insurance since they want to increase my cost by $600 more a month to cover me.

    I guess the moral of the story is; next time I'll just have to sleep it off.
    My point exactly. Going to socialized healthcare doesn't fix the problem. You only paid $200 but the hospital got thier 7K from your insurance. Under socialized healthcare it would be the same game.

    Businesses are going to high deductible and are starting to force it upon thier employees because healthcare is getting out of hand. They can no longer afford to cover you because of the rampant fleecing going on by the healthcare profession. The problem is what doctors and hospitals charge. And they are taking a hardline. My mother works in billing for an un-nameed medical supplier. They charge in 6 months for equipment for what it would take to buy it and then some. When the Medicare runs out they remove it although they have already made a profit and start the cycle again.

    Why are we looking for the government to cover this cost? Why are we not asking the goverment to prevent the greedy from taking advantage of those in need.

  2. #10
    Lover of Mountains nightsky's Avatar
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    I came mighty close to going bankrupt two years ago due to a health condition my wife developed that required multiple and extensive surgeries. And we had 'decent' insurance also. Something has to change, the way things are now is an embarassment.

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    herenorthere's Avatar
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    Public health isn't just a question of who pays everyone's medical bills. For instance, federal policies drive the overproduction of fats, sugars and other empty calories, which makes junk food abundant and cheap in comparison with healthy food and encourages bad diets. That has to change, especially when we factor in the environmental consequences. Diet is a big part of the reason for Americans' relatively poor health outcomes despite an unbelievably costly medical system. But there's more, such as development patterns, which have an impact on public health and are skewed in an unhealthy direction by government policies and/or funding.

    Americans with good medical insurance have access to great medical care, but the number of them having it is in decline and change is inevitable. And, since so much is spent in hopeless and invasive procedures to prolong life, but not quality of life, it's also inevitable that people eventually won't be able to demand every procedure they or their relatives might want to try at the end of their life.
    Bruce in CT

    Madness is something rare in individuals — but in groups, parties, peoples, ages it is the rule. Friedrich Nietzsche

  4. #12
    dashman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightsky View Post
    I came mighty close to going bankrupt two years ago due to a health condition my wife developed that required multiple and extensive surgeries. And we had 'decent' insurance also. Something has to change, the way things are now is an embarassment.
    Again, my point. It should not cost that much for something so necessary. Yes, life is a precious gift. But the experience of a life or death situation should not feel like going to a crooked mechanic afterwards.

    Shifting the costs to the government is not fixing the situation. The money has to come from somewhere.

  5. #13
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    I doubt most of you have read the rare William Burroughs novel "Bladerunner" - not the same as the movie of that title (which came later and was originally called "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep"). Burroughs' Bladerunner is all about this very condition of health care and the lower middle class. It's quite prophetic as it was written in 1977 or so. And quite worth reading if you can somehow locate a copy. I'm just waiting for the medical riots... I've got my two man surgical saw and I'm ready to storm the hospital!

    Saying we have the best health care in the world and actually proving it are getting more and more impossible and becoming more and more just Glen Becks talking points. If I could I'd move to where they had decent medical care for their people but many of those country's make it hard to emigrate to, for obvious reasons! We have insurance companies here reaping record profits and paying out less and less for procedures (by denying they'll cover them) or making you go into debt to get fixed up, I don't fathom I can call that the best of anything. If you pay insurance at your job and actually get care take advantage of it - I wish I could. I just pay $44 a month for the privilege of having a pair of useless cards in my wallet. When I pay off my current debts I'm planning on going back into debt to get my teeth fixed. I just hope I'll still have some teeth and gums left by the time I can afford to go back in debt!

    This is precisely how the gop and many of the dems want it (let's face it), politicians on both sides own stock in these health mega-corpse. Going to a public option where we actually get the care we pay for and deserve would indeed ruin them and I am fine with that. If they can't stifle their greed and do their job let 'em sink. The money thing is all a lie as well, simply to protect the insurance corporations. The US was able to puke up uncounted billions (maybe trillions) for two pointless wars and rebuilding those countries they willfully destroyed. While bridges in our own come crashing down from lack of maintenance. The government needs to start spending some of those billions on the people they're taking it from in the first place. I don't mind paying taxes at all as long as I'm getting something out of it other than the vacuous and insignificant "national security" they chant about all the time. Obama's military budget is 4% higher than Bushes, that's a change but not one I see as for the better.

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    blokeman's Avatar
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    I have a real simple solution to all this, move to Canada!!

    Does it bother me that I pay a lot in taxes, NO! I much prefer knowing that I do not have to pay '1200$ for an ultrasound'... As for healthcare, I believe we have the best system, as EVERYONE gets served, equally and without putting someone in doubt whether they can afford to have it done... It really doesn't nbother me knowing that, even though I am blessed with great health, that my tax dollars are helping someone in dire need, get the assistance they deserve. My gf got thyroid cancer, and I can only imagine how in debt we would be if we had to cover any of the fees needed to cover the surgery, medications, procedures and employees who took care of her for a couple weeks...

    It's a sad that someone can use healthcare as a business opertunity. It downright shameful.
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    “Experience: that most brutal of teachers. But you learn, my God do you learn.” C.S. Lewis

  7. #15
    dashman's Avatar
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    I agree your level of care should not depend upon how much money or insurance you have. That is why I suggest making it affordable by dictating what is reasonable in terms of price and not by asking uncle sam to play insurance company.

    Allowing the government to manage healthcare is a grave mistake. They are historically not the best at managing money. When is the last time the US government has had a balanced budget and have spent only what they got from taxes? This is not a republican vs democrat thing as they are both equally pork. Just on different things.

    Also, it would only be a matter of time before money received for healthcare would be spent for other purposes just like Social Security. Or worse given to those who have zero vested interest in the fund. It is always easier to repurpose money already received than to raise taxes. Leave the tax raising to the next administration.
    Last edited by dashman; 08-17-2009 at 08:57 AM. Reason: can't spell

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    I agree totally that our heath care system is not spot on when it comes to funding going to the right place. And aside from that, as others mentioned, yes people will abuse of something if they don't have to pay for it. Our hospitals are always packed, and waiting 6-12 hours in the emergency waiting room (depending on the severity of your situation) is common. I can't really give any input as to where the money is going, because it doesn't interest me particularly, however I can safely say that we have something that is honestly irreplaceable, I don't have a deductible to pay for my health, the only one I have is for my house and car, which is where it should be. I find it's really sad to think that some must decide whether they get the health care they need, and then have high annual rates thereafter, OR don't claim and don't get the care you need and live with it... Like Yann said, it should be considered a right, and not a privilege. And it really is the middle class that needs it, it's our tradesmen and women, our "fresh out of school" students, our retirees that need to still keep a job to pay the bills, do I go on... Besides, you guys have much lower taxes than us Canadians, just think of the numbers, the population of Canada is the same size as the population of New York City. With your immense size alone, a tiny percentage increase would be easier to take, than to have to pay your deductible, and then higher rates after that (for those in the middle class).
    Just my 2cents.
    Grow list...
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    “Experience: that most brutal of teachers. But you learn, my God do you learn.” C.S. Lewis

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