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Thread: A Hike Through the Tongass (DUW)

  1. #9
    Sarracenia Collector Adam's Avatar
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    Rotund!!!!!!
    I love the Red Spaghnum, too!
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    Quote Originally Posted by lizasaur
    Minor x Purp I actually have. Well,technically it's Minor Okee x Psitt Green.

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    rattler's Avatar
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    Alaska isnt all frozen tundra, actually where i am in Montana averages significantly colder than southeast Alaska....

    as for the stunted ceders in the bog being over 100 years old.....they are likely 500 years old or more, we have junipers around here that were likely good sized when Lewis and Clark went through....

    as for hating the clear cutting, where do you think you toilet paper comes from? the cardboard boxes that we ship plants back and forth in? the books we by? if you like using any of these products dont complain........
    cervid serial killer
    Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety
    I didn't get stimulated but he kept his promise on change, that's about all I got left!
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  3. #11
    Aristoloingulamata Dexenthes's Avatar
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    Having counted the rings on other trees of similar size I'd say 500 years might be a stretch for that one, but 100 years was a humble estimate.

    As far as the clear cutting goes, these sorts of trees are not turned into toilet paper, or cardboard. You can see the truth in that they are actually mostly still just laying on the ground where they fell, only the largest have been taken. Clear-cutting is completely non-sustainable.

    I'm not opposed to logging, because of course, we do all use paper products and nobody is innocent. But there are better ways to do it. Clear-cutting absolutely destroys an ecosystem. In temperate regions like here, it takes over a thousand or more years to restore back to the forest that you would recognize.

    There are many logs laying on beaches, already laying in clear cuts like these, or drifting in the ocean, ENOUGH logs, this I know. I don't condone clear cutting on any level. Selective logging is the only way to do it remotely sustainably and it's the only we had been doing it for hundreds of years until now.

    That being said, I don't condone the logging of Yellow Cedar at all. I find these trees much too powerful and ancient to cut down. I don't think I would be able to have that resting on my psyche. Now a hemlock is a different story...
    LOOKING FOR: N. (argentii x bicalcarata) x {[(lingulata x edwardsiana) x (naga x hamata)] x [(klossii x undulatifolia) x (aristolochioides x rajah)]} Growlist: http://www.terraforums.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=124586

  4. #12
    rattler's Avatar
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    actually many areas in the PNW has shown clear cutting to be sustainable as some tracts have been cut, replanted and clear cut again several times.....

    and if the trees in that bog are only 150 years old than that aint a very old bog as it takes a good amount of nutrients for a tree to grow to good size in that short of time....we have junipers around here out in the badlands that stand 8 foot tall that are 300 years old due to them growing in clay soil with lil nuits and less than a foot of precip in a year.....would be curious to see how old the 12 footers are.....
    cervid serial killer
    Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety
    I didn't get stimulated but he kept his promise on change, that's about all I got left!
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  5. #13
    Aristoloingulamata Dexenthes's Avatar
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    Well maybe you can't tell but that tree was only about three feet tall, not really a big guy. Could 200 years though or so, I wouldn't be surprised.

    Ok, sure though, trees can be replanted, and harvested again and turned into toilet paper. But that is a totally different concept than clear cutting an old growth forest composed of trees like Yellow and Red Cedars. Even a replanted clear cut or one that has grown back "naturally" (like the one I showed in the end) there is no understory, there are no berry bushes and wild life rarely utilize these areas. Basically what you speak of could just be considered a tree farm. It's not a true forest and the trees are nowhere near the size of the originals and those size trees wont reoccur for many many of our lifetimes.

    Areas that have already been clear cut, should obviously be the subject of clear cuts again, as the ecosystem has already been destroyed. But when you see areas like the one I have pictured, those yellow cedars and the forest they are in had been functioning for thousands of years, and now will not probably ever grow back into a similar forest. It would be one thing if every single log and branch was taken, but as it stands, there are four or five hundred year old yellow cedars just sinking into the mud.

    I actually went up there and filled my VW Rabbit with logs for firewood, I couldn't bear seeing the trees go to waste.
    LOOKING FOR: N. (argentii x bicalcarata) x {[(lingulata x edwardsiana) x (naga x hamata)] x [(klossii x undulatifolia) x (aristolochioides x rajah)]} Growlist: http://www.terraforums.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=124586

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    rattler's Avatar
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    well ofcourse they dont have the biodiversity of normal growth forests but by allowing some areas to be clear cut and replanted and harvested again natural growth forests can be left alone....or you dont get your TP and such......

    nothing wrong with cutting down red cedar which does have a moderate growth rate and is extremely useful and limited logging of yellow cedar is fine aswell....it aint endangered by any stretch of the imagination.....slow growing? yes its one of the slowest but limited logging means there is an interest in preserving it as ppl that use the wood want it to be around for a long time.....if a living thing has amonetary value there is alot more interest in keeping it around long term........
    cervid serial killer
    Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety
    I didn't get stimulated but he kept his promise on change, that's about all I got left!
    http://www.wolfpointherald.com/--http://www.safety-brite.net/

  7. #15
    dashman's Avatar
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    Incredible pics!

    Stupid Question...
    I am from the midwest and we don't have to deal with animals like bears. Do you have to do anything special for bears? Do you normally pack heat when going into the forests?

  8. #16
    rattler's Avatar
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    "Due to the frequency of human-bear encounters, the B.C. Fish and Wildlife Branch is advising hikers, hunters, fishermen and any persons that use the out of doors in a recreational or work related function to take extra precautions while in the field.

    We advise the outdoorsman to wear little noisy bells on clothing so as to give advanced warning to any bears that might be close by so you don’t take them by surprise.

    We also advise anyone using the out-f-doors to carry “Pepper Spray” with him is case of an encounter with a bear.

    Outdoorsmen should also be on the watch for fresh bear activity, and be able to tell the difference between black bear feces and grizzly bear feces. Black bear feces is smaller and contains lots of berries and squirrel fur. Grizzly bear feces has bells in it and smells like pepper."

    cervid serial killer
    Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety
    I didn't get stimulated but he kept his promise on change, that's about all I got left!
    http://www.wolfpointherald.com/--http://www.safety-brite.net/

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