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Thread: Happy ZombieJesus Day!

  1. #41
    RL7836's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Av8tor1 View Post
    Just my humble opinion.... religion, politics, lifestyle, personal beliefs.... none of which should be the subject of jokes on "our" forum.
    +1

    When I saw this thread, I knew that it wasn't going to end well - but I didn't know how to say anything without making things worse. I'm not religious but know that if you poke a group of people with a sharp stick, many will not like it. If you respect those individuals ... why go there?

    Quote Originally Posted by Heli View Post
    But in the real word I think religion should be able to be criticized as anything else is.
    Our 'Free Speech' guarantees the ability to do this, but should you want to exercise that right, this is not the venue - very much not conducive to maintaining the atmosphere we appreciate.
    All the best,
    Ron
    You must do the thing you think you cannot do. --- Eleanor Roosevelt

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  2. #42
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    I try avoid these type of threads when they get into these type of debates, but...

    The problem with trying to rationalize with analogies to other 'similar' scenarios is a difficult one as it really doesn't lend itself to such analogies well. It is difficult, if not impossible to compare things of this nature. Apples and oranges I say. Personally, I'm not offended, but heck, who are we to dictate how others feel or perceive things.

    Now to contradict myself and provide a bit of an analogies scenario anyway. Growing up, I had friends who would on occasion use what many would consider very derogatory terms towards Asians. In context, I knew it to be in jest, and really took no offense to it in the slightest. That said, strangers or acquaintances saying the same thing to me would likely not have been perceived the same way by me. Just put into perspective that the audience of the forum is larger than just the more 'active' members and that audience has a right to their opinions and feelings. No one really has a right to dictate how another should feel about the subject matter.

    As for religion being open to criticism like everything else, absolutely, but this does not apply to the scenario at hand. There has to be substance to the criticism and a valid argument must exist. Jokes are not a valid criticism. Jokes are simply meant to amuse and or offend on occasion but have no place in a serious debate of religion, politics or the like.

    The internet is certainly not a place for censorship so I would agree that if someone truly believes in Jesus being a zombie, than by all means, they should have the right to say so, but lets not make this out to be more than what it is, a joke and not so much a belief. There are plenty of places on the internet to discuss zombie Jesus' I'm sure, though I don't believe the intent of this forum was ever for that. If it was meant to be a lighthearted good willed gesture, than I say have a mod change the title and move on. To tell people to ignore the thread doesn't change the fact that they can still see it and be offended by the title, in spite of what else may be in the thread.

    Just my 2 cents.
    --------
    z

  3. #43
    ALGEBRAIC! Crofthulhu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thez_yo View Post
    Telling someone you've just offended to stop being offended is like apologizing by saying "I'm sorry you think I'm a jerk."
    I don't really feel that's the case here... what do users expect entering a thread with this title? Obviously if you're easily offended or a believer of Jesus, you're going to be offended. My point is, being offended is pointless. There are other beliefs in the world beside yours, you should expect threads like this. And it's unfair for people to come in this thread and complain about it, as if it shouldn't be allowed?

  4. #44
    Tastes like chicken! Exo's Avatar
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    If I remember correctly....it's against forum rules to post offensive material in the first place...and if enough peeps complain about it..it's pretty much offensive.
    Some days it just isn't worth chewing thru the restraints.

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  5. #45
    ALGEBRAIC! Crofthulhu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zlookup View Post
    I try avoid these type of threads when they get into these type of debates, but...

    The problem with trying to rationalize with analogies to other 'similar' scenarios is a difficult one as it really doesn't lend itself to such analogies well. It is difficult, if not impossible to compare things of this nature. Apples and oranges I say. Personally, I'm not offended, but heck, who are we to dictate how others feel or perceive things.

    Now to contradict myself and provide a bit of an analogies scenario anyway. Growing up, I had friends who would on occasion use what many would consider very derogatory terms towards Asians. In context, I knew it to be in jest, and really took no offense to it in the slightest. That said, strangers or acquaintances saying the same thing to me would likely not have been perceived the same way by me. Just put into perspective that the audience of the forum is larger than just the more 'active' members and that audience has a right to their opinions and feelings. No one really has a right to dictate how another should feel about the subject matter.

    As for religion being open to criticism like everything else, absolutely, but this does not apply to the scenario at hand. There has to be substance to the criticism and a valid argument must exist. Jokes are not a valid criticism. Jokes are simply meant to amuse and or offend on occasion but have no place in a serious debate of religion, politics or the like.

    The internet is certainly not a place for censorship so I would agree that if someone truly believes in Jesus being a zombie, than by all means, they should have the right to say so, but lets not make this out to be more than what it is, a joke and not so much a belief. There are plenty of places on the internet to discuss zombie Jesus' I'm sure, though I don't believe the intent of this forum was ever for that. If it was meant to be a lighthearted good willed gesture, than I say have a mod change the title and move on. To tell people to ignore the thread doesn't change the fact that they can still see it and be offended by the title, in spite of what else may be in the thread.

    Just my 2 cents.
    Sorry but, racist term is not the same as celebrating Easter in a non religious manner. What we're seeing here is not only a joke, but an expression of belief, or lack thereof. So yes, this is a thread where people are expressing their beliefs. If you disagree, stay away, be strong in your faith and move on.

    As human beings we face things we don't believe in everyday. I see people loudly yelling out things I completely disagree with, yet I don't complain to them, tell them they are wrong for believing what they believe, and tell them to stop. Because that's both unfair and wrong.

    ---------- Post added at 04:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:19 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Exo View Post
    If I remember correctly....it's against forum rules to post offensive material in the first place...and if enough peeps complain about it..it's pretty much offensive.
    I see, if that's the rules of the forum then so be it.

    I do think that's pretty unfair... seeing as if someone wanted to make a thread about Jesus and Easter, and enough people were offended by it, it could be taken down.

  6. #46
    i dont do pots. amphirion's Avatar
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    @croft: i believe CONTEXT determines what is acceptable speech and what isnt. in this case, the main purpose of this forum is for carnivorous plant discussions. other topics may be included under the general discussion, but for the most part, because this is a CARNIVOROUS PLANTS discussion, and that all sorts of people from all walks of life come together here, for the purpose of discussing CARNIVOROUS PLANTS, talk about all sorts of subjects if you wish, but be aware that not everyone has the same beliefs/values as yourself.

    as Ron mentioned, having a cohesive atmosphere is beneficial in maintaining community here. you want to talk about zombie jesus? there's a forum for that too--- it's just not this one. and i also agree with zlookup about how the internet shouldnt censored, agreed 100% but again, TF is a CARNIVOROUS PLANT forum, and NOT the internet as a whole---again, you want to find a place where your view points on religion, beliefs, jokes of, and values are appreciated? there's a forum for that, just not this one.
    " You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." -Inigo Montoya
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  7. #47
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    Yes, I believe that this thread was meant in a light hearted manner, but if people find it offensive, it should be removed. I certainly laughed when I saw it, but if it offends others, I would like for it to be removed just like I would like for a thread I found offensive to be removed.

    "Give unto others what you want to be given to you"

    ~I don't believe my quotation was 100% accurate.~

    *Wanders off to read threads that actually have something to do with CP's*

    ---------- Post added at 05:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:23 PM ----------

    Apparently, I type far too slowly...
    <Av8tor1> as big as peat is, the bear runs not him

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  8. #48
    zlookup's Avatar
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    @croft:

    Think you missed the point of my story a bit. It was meant to express that things can be perceived by people in different ways depending on scenario and context and perhaps familiarity with a person. I wasn't making an analogy of racism to the title.

    I don't think I was telling anyone they didn't have a right to believe what they wanted. I just didn't like the tone people were taking to defend the thread. Many seemed to suggest people were wrong for feeling insulted and told to lighten up. I fail to see how their right to feel and believe what they believe is any different than your attitude towards the right of the thread to stay up at the moment.

    In any case, feel free to believe what ever you like. As I stated, its your right and I'm not here to tell you otherwise.
    --------
    z

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