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Argentina Grants an Orangutan Human-Like Rights

If other places follow along, it will change a lot of things. Zoological institutions, amusement parks, etc.
 
And I (for one) have no problem with that at all! :)

Shut those people down!
 
I'd like to see institutions that work with sentient or intelligent animals make their approach more on the animals terms.

I have no objection to people working with sentient animals, but it should be, I guess voluntary on the animal's part.

Kinda like some of the seaside places that work with wild dolphins. They are not caged, and can choose to come and go and see people as they see fit, but are not forced to do so.
 
I think if they wore born in captivity they should stay she won't now how to fend for her self. I think they should set better rules so the animals are more comfortable. On top of that with out some of these zoos some animals would go extinct. I'm pretty shore pandas are a example.
 
Zoos are good at saving large, iconic animals. The rest get thrown under the bus. We still have hundreds of new extinctions very year. If not thousands.

Not that's that entirely the fault of institutions. They are funded largely by visitors (many are non-profits) and people are not interested in seeing or conserving anything that isn't large and iconic - like apes, pandas, big cats, etc.
 
I am disgusted by zoos which cage large primates. I was very excited to see the silver back gorillas at the Como Zoo, until I actually saw them. Once I did I was no longer able to divorce myself from the idea that they are only a few chromosomes away from myself. The pity I felt was so bad I was almost restrained from attempting to crack the glass. It is absolutely abhorrent to me that these creatures are kept in captiviy, and I have had many animals in captivity in my terrariums (crabs, mantids, phasmids) but there was something about them, in their eyes perhaps, I just could not see any reason for their captivity. I have had an anti-captivity opinion ever since.
 
Funny that it took a "2nd or 3rd world nation" to make this important first step.

I bet the Argentinians will be delighted to learn they are rated 2nd or 3rd world. I wonder who qualifies in the top tier.
 
Maybe it would be better for some animals to become extinct if the other option is to be caged for peoples amusement, in England if you kept a dog in conditions that were thought to be detrimental to its well being you would be fined and have the animal taken off you.Always a difficult one as there is no going back once their gone, but as swords says it is heart breaking when you see such proud animals reduced to simply existing
 
  • #10
Fred, you didn't notice the quotation marks did you... LOL
 
  • #11
Looked at empirically, the surest was to ensure the survival and proliferation of any species is to figure out a way to make it economically valuable. Certainly there are species made extinct by economic exploitation, but looking at that group of species compared to the number of species made extinct by less direct means such as habitat destruction and introduction of non native species, the number of species bought and sold into extinction is negligible from a mathematical standpoint. Indeed many species exist today solely because of captive populations in zoos and people's homes. Since suitable habitat no longer exists for these species, outlawing keeping them in captivity would be the final nail in their coffin. Then there are the species which are not yet extinct, but on the edge. A species with which I have considerable experience is the Blue Throated Macaw, Ara glaucogularis. Endemic to a small specialized palm savannah habitat in Bolivia, its current wild population is estimated to be between 100 and 300 individuals in disjointed populations. Its habitat is being converted into farmland, and outlook is bleak. I'm on the high side of 50, but barring unseen buses and falling pianos it is likely I will see a world without wild Blue Throats. But barring any unforeseen circumstances I will die with one on top of me. She's on my shoulder as I type this. The captive population is in the thousands. No doubt collection for the pet trade initially hurt the species, but the offspring of those individuals are the only long term future the species has. This is a complex issue, but most of the complexity is strictly because of the emotions stirred up by the mere mention of the subject. The hard numbers are not difficult to understand.
 
  • #12
Looked at empirically, the surest was to ensure the survival and proliferation of any species is to figure out a way to make it economically valuable. Certainly there are species made extinct by economic exploitation, but looking at that group of species compared to the number of species made extinct by less direct means such as habitat destruction and introduction of non native species, the number of species bought and sold into extinction is negligible from a mathematical standpoint. Indeed many species exist today solely because of captive populations in zoos and people's homes. Since suitable habitat no longer exists for these species, outlawing keeping them in captivity would be the final nail in their coffin. Then there are the species which are not yet extinct, but on the edge. A species with which I have considerable experience is the Blue Throated Macaw, Ara glaucogularis. Endemic to a small specialized palm savannah habitat in Bolivia, its current wild population is estimated to be between 100 and 300 individuals in disjointed populations. Its habitat is being converted into farmland, and outlook is bleak. I'm on the high side of 50, but barring unseen buses and falling pianos it is likely I will see a world without wild Blue Throats. But barring any unforeseen circumstances I will die with one on top of me. She's on my shoulder as I type this. The captive population is in the thousands. No doubt collection for the pet trade initially hurt the species, but the offspring of those individuals are the only long term future the species has. This is a complex issue, but most of the complexity is strictly because of the emotions stirred up by the mere mention of the subject. The hard numbers are not difficult to understand.

+1
 
  • #13
Fred, you didn't notice the quotation marks did you... LOL

Well yes I did, and they looked a bit like this "...."
 
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