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  • #61
I have also seen people make separate accounts from their real one, and drive the price of bids up.

I certainly hope you aren't insinuating this is something the merchant you singled out in the original post has done, because that particular seller is one of the most reputable, honest and genuine suppliers in the hobby. You wouldn't want to suggest he's doing anything as dishonest and underhanded as that, would you?? Because that sounds like what you're implying.
 
  • #62
also who's to say the people that can spend the big bux also haven't spent the big bux to create an appropriate grow area. So I guess you can't really judge either way. I know personally if I spend 500 bus on a plant I want it to live weather or not I can just buy another if it dies....

Case in point: my Nepenthes greenhouse cost over $14K to build and equip. I insisted that it be done right, and done to last 20 years. As the saying goes, build it and they (Nepenthes, Orchids, etc.) will come.
 
  • #63
I have personally been attacked once on eBay. I was breeding a rare species of beetles at the time, and someone really wanted them alive. I however knew the person had a bad reputation as a breeder and dismissed his offer on another site.

So you get to be the Breeder Police, huh? Deciding who can and cannot have Beetles for breeding?! Now I understand where your attitude about who is or isn't fit to grow expensive Nepenthes comes from!
 
  • #64
If it puts your mind to rest I am referring to several known instances in the insect hobby that occurred many years ago. You should realize I know who most of the nepenthes sellers are on ebay, and I am not accusing anyone of anything (as I have not stated directly).

And yes, I will decide who my beetles go to if that means their survival...

Like I said earlier you should think before you speak. It makes you look bad when you ( in specific) try to single someone out for comments they never said. You're trying to put words in my mouth again

Copyandpasted what Whimgrinder said in case he removes his comment:
I certainly hope you aren't insinuating this is something the merchant you singled out in the original post has done, because that particular seller is one of the most reputable, honest and genuine suppliers in the hobby. You wouldn't want to suggest he's doing anything as dishonest and underhanded as that, would you?? Because that sounds like what you're implying.
 
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  • #66
When He won the auction (obviously) at $1024, he then deactivated his account.


Its worth pointing out that the OP is complaining about prices being driven too high on fleabay, and yet read the above! *introduces the pot to the kettle*
 
  • #67
Its worth pointing out that the OP is complaining about prices being driven too high on fleabay, and yet read the above! *introduces the pot to the kettle*

You seem to make an argument and then drop it completely for another when I shut it down.
If you could read I clearly state that while the prices are ridiculous on eBay, I have a problem with the fact that anyone can purchase a live rare plant.

If you could read (again) I also state that the beetle sold on eBay was a dead insect with no further value in the breeding hobby.
 
  • #68
So you get to be the Breeder Police, huh? Deciding who can and cannot have Beetles for breeding?!


This nearly made me spit my coffee out Paul, I found this line way funnier than I should have :-))
 
  • #69
Kat, the problem here is EXACTLY what you're saying. Because they have no reputation, no information, no background in the plant-growing world, you CAN'T know whether the plant you're sending out (assuming you care what happens to it) will end up dying because of neglect, or malign schemes, or whether it will be given the chance to thrive in a well-regulated, properly set up environment.

For this same reason, if you've never used a credit card or taken out a small loan or anything like that, There's almost NO way you're getting a Loan for a car or house from any bank, because they know nothing about you, and have to wonder whether you'll actually pay them back or not. It seems the OP is frustrated with the possibility that someone could be buying "Only the best for little Johnny" and 2 weeks later, little Johnny will be crying for a new one because he killed the poor thing.
 
  • #70
You seem to make an argument and then drop it completely for another when I shut it down.
If you could read I clearly state that while the prices are ridiculous on eBay, I have a problem with the fact that anyone can purchase a live rare plant.

I'm guessing you didn't get the plant you were bidding on? :confused:
 
  • #71
I certainly hope you aren't insinuating this is something the merchant you singled out in the original post has done, because that particular seller is one of the most reputable, honest and genuine suppliers in the hobby. You wouldn't want to suggest he's doing anything as dishonest and underhanded as that, would you?? Because that sounds like what you're implying.
He didn't, stop freaking out.

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  • #72
So you get to be the Breeder Police, huh? Deciding who can and cannot have Beetles for breeding?! Now I understand where your attitude about who is or isn't fit to grow expensive Nepenthes comes from!
My sister is a German Shepherd breeder. So allow me to shed some light on a subject I know much about.

I assume everyone here knows what backyard breeders are? They breed dogs to death and give them little in the way of food or good care which results in cheap yet inferior dogs. Thousands of naive people end up buying said dogs because their cheap and the professional breeders and animal populations as a whole suffer greatly because of it. While plants may be a tad different this is how it works for animals. Considering how rare his beetles are he also reserves the right not to create his own competition by selling to known breeders.

So, even though we have completely derailed the thread I hope you learned a few things about the fine art of animal breeding.

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  • #73
Given how rare and critically endangered many of these plants are it is our duty to preserve them in cultivation. So I think it is in fact a good thing to have some information about who your selling to, not necessarily that they be an expert but that they truly love and will care for their plants as best they can. However, this is ultimately the sellers responsibility and we don't have any authority to say or do otherwise.

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  • #74
I think it is in fact a good thing to have some information about who your selling to, not necessarily that they be an expert but that they truly love and will care for their plants as best they can. However, this is ultimately the sellers responsibility and we don't have any authority to say or do otherwise.

Vetting your buyers is wishing for the impossible. The only "responsibility" is that of the buyer, in that he/she should recognize the serious nature of what they are taking on if they purchase an endangered species, and be truly, fully committed to growing (and distributing whenever possible) that plant for the foreseeable future. How many people in the CP community have planned accordingly and have sufficient follow-through to make that commitment, do you suppose? I'd wager the number is small. You would find out by polling the community to see how many people still have the rare and treasured plants they bought ten years ago. Maybe 5 years would be sufficiently telling!
 
  • #75
I think the bottom line is if you're selling it on Ebay you clearly have no interest in "preserving" the well being of that plant. Ebay is a place to get quick cash, not a place to sell to reputable growers. If you were interested in keeping a plant alive you might as well not even sell it at all, instead give it to a trusted grower, that is a much better way to go about that.


If you're trying to run a business rather than preserving a plant, then selectively selling to only people who are reputable growers is a bad bad business plan. Hence why anybody who is actually selling a plant likely will not do this.. Because they want money. Not the plant.

Attempting to force the preservation ideal on someone who is here to make a living off of selling CPs is silly.
 
  • #77
I think the bottom line is if you're selling it on Ebay you clearly have no interest in "preserving" the well being of that plant. Ebay is a place to get quick cash, not a place to sell to reputable growers. If you were interested in keeping a plant alive you might as well not even sell it at all, instead give it to a trusted grower, that is a much better way to go about that.

Congratulations on your sanctimony and the luxury of living in an economic vacuum where the very narrow margins of commercial nurseries and the realities of running micropropation laboratories don't affect you, or your free opinions on a hobbyist's forum; and that you are fully capable of employing people and timely paying your creditors, based upon your lofty conservational ideals . . .
 
  • #78
I believe that a person spending big bucks on living plants would know at least a little bit on how to care for them.

I mean, come on, not everyone has $300 laying around to spend on thing that can perish, like for example, buying $300 live beetle without knowing how to care for it.

And again, prices are high could mean good thing, separating those who actually has a means and equipment of caring for them compared to those who just have enough for the rare plants without adequate living conditions for them.
 
  • #79
I'm just gonna bow out now since those commenting on this post don't appear able or willing to have a civil discussion.

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  • #80
You seem to make an argument and then drop it completely for another when I shut it down.
If you could read I clearly state that while the prices are ridiculous on eBay, I have a problem with the fact that anyone can purchase a live rare plant.

If you could read (again) I also state that the beetle sold on eBay was a dead insect with no further value in the breeding hobby.

Having a problem with anyone being able to buy a rare plant is bewildering to me. How should such plants be allocated if not by fair trade? And more importantly, who should do the allocating?
 
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