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Thread: Hypothetical question regarding wild plants and trespassing

  1. #33

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    I truly can't imagine someone saying "No, you can't relocate the plants I'm about to destroy" unless they had some sort of delusional vendetta against carnivorous plants. I mean, it would be ridiculous, wouldn't it? As a matter of fact, if I were ever in a position to develop a large tract of land, I'd probably want to have it examined for plants worth saving and ask someone with the expertise to do so, to come collect them. Probably only because I'm conscious of the danger many CPs are in from habitat destruction.

  2. #34
    Flip_Side_the_Pint's Avatar
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    just ask, at the very worst they say no and just move on. At best they say yes have at it, or they may want a small fee at that point you just decide if these plants are really worth it... But stealing is stealing wether its from ones home or property I don't see a distinction...

  3. #35
    Whimgrinder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trout View Post
    I truly can't imagine someone saying "No, you can't relocate the plants I'm about to destroy"
    No? I can! I have no difficulty imagining some surly oaf shouting "Get off my land you Greenpeace hippy weirdo or I'll call the cops!"

  4. #36
    BS Bulldozer SubRosa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whimgrinder View Post
    No? I can! I have no difficulty imagining some surly oaf shouting "Get off my land you Greenpeace hippy weirdo or I'll call the cops!"
    Cutting your damned hair could prevent that!
    Judge not lest ye be judged creates a cesspool. Judge others and prepare to be judged by them.
    Just know when to keep the verdict to yourself.

  5. #37
    Subsurface Lurker gnathaniel's Avatar
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    Interesting discussion, albeit a little hidden under a lot of bluster. I 100% agree with asking a landowner first, in every instance, though after that I think things potentially get murkier, depending perhaps on what plants are present, their ecological importance, and other questions even harder to answer or even ask in the first place. Yes, I am a landowner, and no, I don't like when anyone else does, or tells me to do, things with my land without my advance knowledge and informed consent. Some questions I think could help elucidate part of what's being discussed here:

    --What ARE 'property rights'? What do they mean? Are they positive, negative, or combination rights (I'm defining here positive rights as rights TO do something, negative as being the ability to prevent others from doing something; other sensible definitions exist but this is what I'm asking about)?

    --Where do property (or any other) rights come from? Does it matter? Do their sources potentially affect their boundaries and exercise?

    --Where do property rights begin and end? Do I have a right to do something on my property that my neighbors view as a nuisance? Who gets to define what 'nuisance' is?

    --Do the people of the US (or any smaller but included collectives like citizens of a state, town, corporation, etc.) as a whole have 'property rights' to any spaces? Designated common spaces? Public lands? When do, or should, the rights of trans-individual collectives (if you acknowledge such rights to exist) be allowed to interfere with or intrude on the rights of individuals?

    --Will I get any serious, thoughtful, non-aggressive responses to these sincere questions, or am I just fanning the flames/feeding the trolls?

    PS has anyone else read the Kelo v City of New London case, and what are your thoughts on it? What if the development was of, eg, a hospital the area needed, rather than the (IMO) boondoggle it ended up being?
    Last edited by gnathaniel; 10-29-2015 at 11:21 AM. Reason: added a semicolon, okay?
    --Nat--

  6. #38
    I Am the Terror Of the Night! NemJones's Avatar
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    There is no diffinitive proof if sentient plant life, however,
    There ARE a number of studies poiinting in that direction.

    One in particular, there was a group of scientists hooking up electrographs and
    All those sticky pads they use in hospitals for body readings and such, to plants.
    The scientists thought about harming the plants, hit them, and so forth.

    The readings came up similar each time, a pattern Was hidden in the reaction. Not all the same, but similar.
    The one that surprised me the most is when the scientists thought about harming the plants,
    The electrographs clearly showed activity from the plants. Ill see if i can finnd it. Either way,
    He plants are probably concious, but just not in the sense that people think about it. They are living afterall
    Last edited by NemJones; 10-29-2015 at 11:20 AM.

  7. #39
    BS Bulldozer SubRosa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gnathaniel View Post
    Interesting discussion, albeit a little hidden under a lot of bluster. I 100% agree with asking a landowner first, in every instance, though after that I think things potentially get murkier, depending perhaps on what plants are present, their ecological importance, and other questions even harder to answer or even ask in the first place. Yes, I am a landowner, and no, I don't like when anyone else does, or tells me to do, things with my land without my advance knowledge and informed consent. Some questions I think could help elucidate part of what's being discussed here:

    --What ARE 'property rights'? What do they mean? Are they positive, negative, or combination rights (I'm defining here positive rights as rights TO do something, negative as being the ability to prevent others from doing something; other sensible definitions exist but this is what I'm asking about)?

    --Where do property (or any other) rights come from? Does it matter? Do their sources potentially affect their boundaries and exercise?

    --Where do property rights begin and end? Do I have a right to do something on my property that my neighbors view as a nuisance? Who gets to define what 'nuisance' is?

    --Do the people of the US (or any smaller but included collectives like citizens of a state, town, corporation, etc.) as a whole have 'property rights' to any spaces? Designated common spaces? Public lands? When do, or should, the rights of trans-individual collectives (if you acknowledge such rights to exist) be allowed to interfere with or intrude on the rights of individuals?

    --Will I get any serious, thoughtful, non-aggressive responses to these sincere questions, or am I just fanning the flames/feeding the trolls?

    PS has anyone else read the Kelo v City of New London case, and what are your thoughts on it? What if the development was of, eg, a hospital the area needed, rather than the (IMO) boondoggle it ended up being?
    The nature of rights is inextricably intertwined with the nature of force. Stay tuned for an explanation of both.
    Judge not lest ye be judged creates a cesspool. Judge others and prepare to be judged by them.
    Just know when to keep the verdict to yourself.

  8. #40
    katya_dog1's Avatar
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    Whoa, this exploded fast. Thread closed until I can look through it, and then it will be opened again.
    Sarracenia Addicted... Lover of all toothed Nepenthes.
    The right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed. ~ The Second Amendment

    Keep it that way.

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