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Thread: Where does everyone stand in regards to...

  1. #329
    Capslock's Avatar
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    I'll answer Jeremiah's question: I don't know where matter came from, nor why time is how we experience it. I do not believe, however, that it's sufficient to say that God created them, as that simply begs the question of who or what created God. To simply assert God is a "first cause" is also insufficient, as "first causes" are precluded by the notion all things need creation.

    What makes the Biblical explanation less compelling as a scientific explanation is the lack of a scientific basis for any god or gods, much less the Christian God. One is simply skipping hundreds of thousands of steps ahead in proving something by assuming Biblical truth absent empircal or mathematical data.

    Further complicating the assertion is the vast array of evidence of anancient earth, including human civilizations prior to the asserted date of origin.

    Nevertheless, I don't believe science is able to provide an adequate explanation of the origins of matter at this time. One thing we know is that matter exists, though! LOL! In any case, the theories and facts surrounding evolution are based purely on observable, testable, and falsifiable hypotheses and data. This is the basis of scientific knowledge.

    OK, my question for the young-earth proponents: Why would there be billions of fossils that all date to ancient dates, neatly arranged sequentially according to when they developed and inhabited earth?

    For AE (I think, who asked before about observed speciation
    Observed instances of speciation

    Capslock
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  2. #330

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]There are plenty of references for the existence of Jesus other than biblical references. Josephus, Titus and other historians at that time spoke about him. You also have to look at the lives of the Apostles (Jesus' followers) and why they chose to give up their own way of life to the point of being put to death for what they believed in
    What about muhammed? he fits all of what you say.
    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]God demonstrated his existence and love for you about 2,000 years ago at the cross. Whether or not you choose to come to a relationship with him is your choice
    yeah... thousands of years before I was born. I only have a book that to me is inconsistant and goes against science (unless I make some stuff a metaphor... how do I know which is which?)
    Like I said, God made me a skeptic and he knows what it takes to make me a believer. I still haven't gotten anything that even proves to me there IS a god, let alone which god.
    PS. That was me capslock
    wow... thanks!
    what more proof could anyone want?
    Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish-Euripides
    wikipedia rocks! (except for species info)(CPers-add your vast knowledge of CPs to wikipedia&#33
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  3. #331

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    Alpha wolf,
    Muhammed was merely a 'prophet' in Islam, jesus was more than that. He set himself apart by claiming he was the way etc and other religious leaders tend to have the stance 'thats the way..'

    God still does perform miracles and its only your point of view from interpreting the bible that goes against science. I see no conflict between science, geology and the bible at all.
    Best Regards

    Mike King

    NCCPG National collection holder of Sarracenia

    http://www.carnivorousplants.uk.com

  4. #332

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    Evolution cannot be regarded has fact. After all it is only a theory, which might be possible but cannot be proven. And it is scientists only explanation if they refuse to beleive what is written in the Bible. Creationism can't be proved. However, I know for a fact that God exists, and if i denied that I would have to deny everything else I know as well. I don't just talk to a brick wall. He talks to me too, he guides me in whatever I do, and through him I know myself, and understand the purpose of my life.
    God is not bound by science, as he created the world and everything in it. He works supernaturally as well as naturally. It's pretty simple if you are willing to beleive that you did not evolve from premordial slime.

    Peter

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  5. #333

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    all I'm gonna say is that I'm a christian and don't believe in evolution
    Join the CCPS, you wont regret it: http://s4.invisionfree.com/CCPS

  6. #334

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (Rubra @ Jan. 01 2005,1:41)]Evolution cannot be regarded has fact. After all it is only a theory, which might be possible but cannot be proven. And it is scientists only explanation if they refuse to beleive what is written in the Bible. Creationism can't be proved. However, I know for a fact that God exists, and if i denied that I would have to deny everything else I know as well. I don't just talk to a brick wall. He talks to me too, he guides me in whatever I do, and through him I know myself, and understand the purpose of my life.
    God is not bound by science, as he created the world and everything in it. He works supernaturally as well as naturally. It's pretty simple if you are willing to beleive that you did not evolve from premordial slime.
    Evolution is a fact. A scientifically provent fact. We KNOW for a FACT species EVOLVE (microevolution) the course that they take over long periods of time (macroevolution) is the theoretical aspect of evolution. The process in itself is fact.
    God... talks to you? Are you sure it's god talking?
    They say if you play a Microsoft CD backwards, you hear satanic messages. Thats nothing, cause if you play it forwards, it installs Windows.

  7. #335

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]God still does perform miracles
    If you're looking for something hard enough, you will find it. Some people say that God appoints presidents and stuff. Well, don't WE have a choice? I mean... if HE appoints presidents/gets people in love/ interferes with nature then how can we have choice? or does he make us choose? (edit: cough cough... never mind then-what I had written before-)
    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ] I see no conflict between science, geology and the bible at all.
    well, of course not. When it does, it's a metaphor.
    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Evolution cannot be regarded has fact. After all it is only a theory, which might be possible but cannot be proven.
    If I hear that one more time in this thread I'm going to explode.
    (emphasis mine.. from http://magma.nationalgeographic.com/...e1/index.html)
    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ] If you are skeptical by nature, unfamiliar with the terminology of science, and unaware of the overwhelming evidence, you might even be tempted to say that it's "just" a theory. In the same sense, relativity as described by Albert Einstein is "just" a theory. The notion that Earth orbits around the sun rather than vice versa, offered by Copernicus in 1543, is a theory. Continental drift is a theory. The existence, structure, and dynamics of atoms? Atomic theory. Even electricity is a theoretical construct, involving electrons, which are tiny units of charged mass that no one has ever seen. Each of these theories is an explanation that has been confirmed to such a degree, by observation and experiment, that knowledgeable experts accept it as fact. That's what scientists mean when they talk about a theory: not a dreamy and unreliable speculation, but an explanatory statement that fits the evidence.
    and it HAS been proven. Look at capslock's link. That's what evolution IS! species becoming other species. (VERY simplified... OVERsimplified actually)
    Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish-Euripides
    wikipedia rocks! (except for species info)(CPers-add your vast knowledge of CPs to wikipedia&#33
    A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it
    Get all the fools on your side and you can be elected to anything

  8. #336

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ] He talks to me too, he guides me in whatever I do, and through him I know myself, and understand the purpose of my life
    Well I'm sorry but he does NOT talk to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]the course that they take over long periods of time (macroevolution) is the theoretical aspect of evolution. The process in itself is fact.
    we have even seen macroecolution (speciation) so that is a FACT too.
    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Creationism can't be proved
    hmm... what to believe... something that CAN be proved or something that can't?
    tough choice.
    why are you even arguing with us anyway?
    Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish-Euripides
    wikipedia rocks! (except for species info)(CPers-add your vast knowledge of CPs to wikipedia&#33
    A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it
    Get all the fools on your side and you can be elected to anything

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