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Thread: Wal-mart vs. the pyramids

  1. #9
    Metal King
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    http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0218-10.htm

    an article called "the race to the bottom"

    Ditto to what Scottychaos said, our town has basically been ruined by big box stores, our downtown is pretty much just boarded-up stores, and the city council has basically given up on maintaining our infrastructure in favour of developing outlying areas where huge parking lots are more feasible
    It's not just Wal-mart, but still, it spells a lower quality of life for everyone.

    F'rinstance, just a week or two ago the protections for the textile industry limiting imports from China to a certain percentage were lifted... this will bankrupt the already bottomed-out economies of countries like Haiti (which certain North American countries set up to be a textil-based sweat-shop already) and will no doubt have a huge impact on the already ballooning trade deficit now enjoyed by North America

    And Scotty, I hate to set foot in Walmart, but on rare occasions I sort of have to (most local businesses are gone and I don't drive a car, and since our area is one big stupid sprawl I sometimes don't have a choice) But a good strategy to "rage against the machine" is to only buy loss-leaders....

    And no I'm not a massacheusetts liberal, I'm more of a communist [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif[/img] (you know us Canadians)
    Da Growlist

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  2. #10
    Tony Paroubek's Avatar
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    oh a good debate..

    US companies have been shifting production jobs overseas for many years, not just for walmart's sake. Walmart may have increased the rate but it is not rocket science that less production cost = higher profits. I would even argue that walmart at least passes on a large portion of the reduced production cost to the consumer. So yes it stings when lots of production jobs are lost here but on the upside consumers pay a lot less for many items. Which keeps more cash in their pockets to use for other endevours, boosting other aspects of the US economy.

    Nothing is simple black and white.
    Tony
    Is that a Nepenthes in your pocket or you just happy to see me?

  3. #11
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    So am I supposed to blame walmart when My IT position get's outsourced to some kid out of bombay? I think not, I have had 2 positions outsourced to foriegn labour in the last five years, do I blame the companies that I worked for it? no, they have to stay competitive. We live in a capitalist society, and like it or not, companies will do whatever they can to stay afloat and provide for not only their employees, but certainly the silk lined pockets of their shareholders.

    I never said I loved walmart, I said I think it gets a bad rep, and admitted, that like all companies it makes bad decisions. News Flash, I try not to shop at walmart, but for different reasons, (such as shopping there for my wifes office at 11PM coming out with a 2,000$ receipt and having every bag searched by a rude employee searching for 20 dollar day planner that didn't get it's RF tag turned off at purchase.)

    I have been affected first hand by outsourcing, what did I do? I studied, boned up my skills, widened my job search and continued being employed in my chosen field for less money, worse hours, and less pay, so I am the last person you need to recruit for a fight against outsourcing labour. but the plain fact is, people won't buy a 20.00 rubbermaid bucket, or a 15.00 widget that can be made for 15 cents and sold for 2 bucks. America is increasingly a hi-tech society, producing complex products that are the fruit of educated and complex labour. That is a factual shift I never thought would burn me, until my job became one of those that could be done on the cheap.

    The plain and simple truth, is if you are going to condemn walmart for it, you have to condemn every large company in existence, they all take cost saving measures, or buy from someone who does.

    Like I said, I don't want an argument, I took issues with the "walmart is an evil company' tone of the article (my interpretation) because I don't think the company is inherintly evil, they have a succesful business model they stick to, and whether or not the company displaces jobs or not, it DOES employ good decent hard working people who are proud of what they do.

    Now, I am going to go to bed.
    \"Maybe in order to understand mankind, we have to look at the word itself: \"Mankind\". Basically, it\'s made up of two separate words - \"mank\" and \"ind\". What do these words mean ? It\'s a mystery, and that\'s why so is mankind.\" ~ Jack Handey

  4. #12
    Capslock's Avatar
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    Nah, Walmart has issues. They are a classic predatory business, seeking to bankrupt local competitors and basically continue their strategy of growth until they're the only retail store on the planet. It's just the nature of the beast. Plus, they're hostile towards their worker's attempts to unionize, and seek better pay and benefits, all the while the executives drive Bentleys.

    But my biggest problem with them is the lack of conscience in seeking the cheapest possible products with little or no oversight into the conditions of the workers who produce them, or their overall impact in the world economy.

    I think that they have to do what they do, as they're tied into this ponzi scheme model of continued growth, mostly for the benefit of stockholders. What needs to happen is a revamping of our regulations on companies doing business overseas to guarantee that goods are not sold in the US which use unsafe or unfair labor practices, or insufficient environmental controls. It's really out of Walmart's hands; they are a corporate freight train with no brakes. We just need to put it on the right tracks. IMO.

    Casplock
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  5. #13
    apple rings.. what more can i say? FlytrapGurl's Avatar
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    The minimun wage crap is bull. My grandmother knows someone who has worked at WalMart for 20 years or somethin', and he talks very highly of his job, loves it, and gets paid alot.

    I agree with what RamPup said... if you're going to bash WalMart, then you might as well also bash BJ's, Publix, Sam's and every other large department store on the continent.
    Liquid Plummer
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  6. #14
    Whats it to ya? Finch's Avatar
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    thankyou all for the lectures. i wont read them but the look well written [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/smile_n_32.gif[/img]
    that makes no logic

  7. #15
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    Hmmm, pard my saying that was thouroughly pointless. no one is lecturing, this is a discussion.

    Capslock, What you said about a corporate freight train with no brakes is dead on, and plays into the equalization of world ecenomics. When south east asian countries raise their standard of living and labor becomes more expensive, import costs alone will bring labour back to the US.

    An interesting thing is happening with IT outsourcing to India (and btw, people in the IT community can get very hostile over this topic! [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/smile.gif[/img] ) is that the Indian companies have already started pricing themselves out of the market, and it's happening far faster than anyone thought it would.
    \"Maybe in order to understand mankind, we have to look at the word itself: \"Mankind\". Basically, it\'s made up of two separate words - \"mank\" and \"ind\". What do these words mean ? It\'s a mystery, and that\'s why so is mankind.\" ~ Jack Handey

  8. #16
    Metal King
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    Ah yes, but if you look into it, the money being demanded by the Indian IT firms is not being funnelled intpo the pockets of the workers, it's being demanded in order to continue "growth" (meaning higher profits for the shareholders) while the people doing thework see no improvements to their lot....

    Interesting aside to this... I am a Canadian, and just this week Wal-Mart closed a store in Quebec, the first store closing EVER for them (not counting location-change closings)

    The store was just like any other Wal-Mart, but with a twist- the employees successfully formed a legitimate union [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/smile_k_ani_32.gif[/img]

    Spokepeople for the company have emphatically stated that this is not union busting......

    Under our laws the company can be legally challenged for unfair business practices and if precedents are set.........

    Anyways, I third the "freight train" thing.... and honestly, the concept of "unlimited growth capitalism", despite the fact that it is the status quo, is totally silly ..... finite resources - infinite greed/expansion = [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/confused.gif[/img]??
    Da Growlist

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