\"There is nothing here of interest to any nation, as a matter of fact there is nothing here but humans!\"
That is because you listen to Motley Crue "Smoking in Boys Bathroom". [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/smile_n_32.gif[/img]Originally Posted by [b
\"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go.\"
-- Oscar Wilde
Oh, man....I see this in the future, I do. Don't look forward to that one bit, I don't.Originally Posted by [b
Spanking...Sheesh. Tough one. MHO is that it depends on the kid, and the age of that kid. For a three year old, the ability to see circumstances like "you'll hurt someone's feelings," or "it's just not the right thing to do" are just a little to cerebral. They need a more "real" reason to behave. At that age, they really haven't developed the ability to "put themselves in someone else's shoes." So I think that a spanking is sometimes warrented. My mother used to make me write (and before that say in at least 50 words, or something of that nature) exactly WHY I'd gotten spanked, and why what I did was wrong.
Remember, the real world is not NEARLY as forgiving as parrents. Cussing someone out at home may get you sent to your room without dinner....Try that in public and see if you don't come home all banged up.
We punnish for two reasons. One, to make sure they understand right from wrong. Two, to make sure the understand there are consequences to bad behaviour.
17 Nash Rd.
North Salem, NY 10560
YOU! Outta my gene pool!
I know how ya feel Scott. My 4 yr old LOVES picking flowers. I've had her pick a few U. primalaflora flowers and bring them to me. Fourtuanately, I rarly get seed from these and was not all that upset. It allowed me the oportunity to exp. to her that I did not want any of MY flowers picked. However, my dog did get into one of my bog planters and, Nep pots, and wreak havoc. I no longer own a dog. I gave him to a friend who wanted him. If I was living in the country.......
I always suspect everything could be a trap... thats why I'm still alive
N.A.S.C. Region 9 Head Grower
My father hit me.
I was around 4 or 5 years young.
My father, my uncle and my cousin and myself were going to the store. When we got there we were told to stay in the car.
The door to the store had not even finished closing and we were out of the car. We ran around the small building time after time.
On one unlucky revolution...a large left hand grabed me arm. The right-belted hand delivered, one home run swing.
Not an easy swing. Not one that left a whelp either. Sorta like a "Goldilocks" type of blow.
That was the only time me Da hit me.
I think at this age a child lives in a dream world. I know I did.
Testing limits of the parent? I think testing the limits of life in general. Exploring this strange world into which we are thrusted.
Later infractions were dealt with by words.
Me Da had this gift of explaining things that just made sense to me. We were a lot alike.
I am not sure that it was an issue of wether I was a good or bad child. I do know that my father was my best friend and I would have done anything to please him.
The main thing about him was - he took the time to talk to me like an adult and explain things to me. I responded to this method. Every person is different though.
Funny, most children are embarassed by their parents. All of my friends loved my father. He had a gift.
My uncle had 5 children. 3 boys and 2 girls - in that order.
The first two received brutal whippings. The middle child was never disciplined and the two girls never were a problem.
The one that was never disciplined is the worst to this day. He has stolen tens of thousands of dollars from his family, sold his father's valuable gun collection, sold his mother's diamond ring valued at $10,000, stole his other brother's and sister's money and valuables and wrecked several brand new cars. One wreck was so bad that he was in the hospital recovering physically for a year.
He is in his mid thirties and sitting in drug rehab at this very moment.
I think that most professionals would say that his behavior is a cry for attention that he never received and a plea for help.
I do not know if punishment would have worked. Who can now? All I know is that he was not punished and he is suffering and the ones around him are too.
Am I traumatized today for my father hitting me with a belt - one time? No.
I remember the hundreds of times he took the time to explain the ways of the world to me.
My response to his explanations was always, 'Why?'
He never tired of the hundreds of times he kept on explaining the 'why' to me.
Talk to your daughter Scott. Better yet, buy her, her own flytrap. Teach her the right kind of water and soil for it. Take her to a bog. Explain the niche of CP to her. Tell her they may not be there for her children. Include the whole of Nature, not just CP. She may love water lillies instead. Buy her a CP book. She is the future. She may find a way to save, not just CP, but the whole festering world.
My father bought me my first CP book by Randall Schwartz. He bought me a pithcer plant. I was ruined for life. Both, for CP and reading.
I still have that first CP book.
\"The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those who look on and do nothing.\" - EInstein
Spanking is a tough issue. *Personally, I'm not too much for it. *I think it teaches children that violence is a way to solve a problem. *Not to mention the confusion that happens when the child then resorts to solving a problem the same way (i.e. smacking a kid at school) and then gets punished for doing it. *How do you tell a young child "YOU can't hit anyone but its OK for me to hit you."? *[img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/confused.gif[/img]
Discipline is VERY important...it just doesn't have to involve striking a child. I think the best way is talking to the child and a punishment involving the loss of something they like. *I do agree that many of us older folks were spanked and certainly weren't damaged for life by having been so. *A little "pop" on the butt of a 2-3 yr old often scares them more than hurts them. *Still...I think its hard to explain to a child why adults can hit and they can't.
I agree with Phil though...although I can only remember being spanked once, some of the things I see kids do in public (stores, restaurants, etc.) APPALLS ME! *I would have been "killed" for doing such things! *Running and shouting in stores, playing with merchandise, etc. *I would never have even THOUGHT about it much less done it. *It does seem that many young kids today have NO discipline.
Just this weekend I was at a garden center and I saw two kids running hellbent for a massive mound of mulch. *(hehe...alliteration!) *I knew what they were going to do...and sure 'nuff they scaled the mountain and started playing and throwing the mulch. *I thought to myself..."I would have been killed for doing that!" Where was the parent? *Off browsing plants not giving one thought to where her kids were and what they doing. *The garden shop owner had to come out and find the mother and ask her to get her kids off the mulch. *She should have been embarrassed! I would say it was obvious she gave no *behavior instructions* to the kids before setting them loose as she enjoyed shopping for plants.
"Fox terriers are born with about four times as much original sin in them as other dogs." - Jerome K. Jerome
Some of you suggested that Scott do something different next time,instead of spanking,but he said that his daughter is not fazed by the other stuff,like taking toys away or no dinner,and whatever,so what is he supposed to do?Also I'm just wonder(not trying to be mean here)but TunaSuprise if you don't want to participate in this discusion then why did you even post here in this thread saying that you didn't want to participate?That just didn't make sense to me [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/smile_n_32.gif[/img] Also Phil,you know your username...I think you spelled your name wrong,lol.I think it would be a great idea if Scott bought his daughter a VFT or even just let her help out with the plants!I think she would definetly understand then that they are special,and not for picking cause they are much prettier and nicer when still alive.Yeah,teach her everything from what kind of water to use to medium and all the other fun stuff.I totally agree with that idea!Good luck!Scott,have you talked about this with your wife yet?*Niki*(Trapper7) [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif[/img]
Great Googly Moogly!
Beware of the yellow snow!
One reason my wife was so upset is that she didn't see anything but the aftermath. Rather than let me deal with it, she whisked the kids away, to play Good Cop. My older daughter lied and said i spanked her, too, for no reason. So my wife thought I was out of control.
I wasn't going to spank her until she lied to me. That is what brought it over the edge.
I found out about my older daughter's lying to my wife too long after the fact to spank, so I gave her the "I am *very* disappointed and hurt" speech. She's 5.5, pretty empathic, so that's all i needed to have her in tears and running to tell Mommy the truth.
The younger one doesn't get that yet. She doesn't understand any real world consequences except those imposed by us. And, in my experience, she is unaffected by times-out and loss of toys. It takes her too long to notice she is being punished, and by the time she does, she's forgotten why.
And I do allow them to help with the plants, such as they're able.
Neither of them has a carnivorous plant of their own yet... we're still working on keeping small pots of grass alive.
My Grow List
"We are just an advanced breed of monkeys on a minor planet of a very average star. But we can understand the Universe. That makes us something very special." -- Stephen Hawking
Well since the issue is not about spanking but whether you and your wife agree on the punnishment. I suppose I could suggest that you send your kid somewhere on a time out that is NOT her room or somewhere she will play, but before you send her let her know that you and mommy will be discussing punnishment. Let the kid stew while you and your wife agree whats propper. Its old fashioned but lets face it some of the good old fashioned punnishments have been lost thru time. This way your wife is included on the decissions of punnishment to save the peace in the house. Kids shouldnt have to hear mommy and daddy arguing over parenting problems it separates the household and taking sides on whos the good and bad parent takes place. Remember you and your wife are a team! You not consulting her has left her out of the decission making so that could be part of the reason she is angry.
I am the weirdo who sits next to you on the bus!
One more thing I can suggest. Kids love to pick flowers!!! they love to give them away to show you that they love you and its so adorable! who were they picking them for anyways?
Have you told them that the plants send up flowers because this is they way that plants make seed that eventually turn into babies? Kids so love babies Im sure thatll get their attention!
Since its still early in the year you could also get a bunch of sweet pea seed and have them make thier own flowers for picking. I love sweat peas cause they smell so nice, they are also very colorful for the kids and either they can string them up and learn how plants take work to grow or they can make great hanging plants.
I am the weirdo who sits next to you on the bus!