birdie bread works good too. get corn bread mix and make it with egg and water instead of milk. you can put cinnamon in it they love it. you could also put mixed veggies in it too. don't give up patience and routine. they will eventually get used to it! [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/smile.gif[/img] i've got 8 birs and it took and is taking a long time to get them all to do exactly what we want them to do. wing clipping is also a good idea until trained for safety.