New to Venus Fly Trap Terrariums

[blsmit]

Hey guys My girlfriend got me a Venus Fly Trap, and I have been dieing to set up a Terrarium for it and probably a few more Fly Traps.

So this is what I got and ideas I have.

I have a 10 gallon aquairum. I would like more but I'm in college in a tiny apartment.

I'm going to layer the bottom with small rocks/large pebbles, then a layer of peat moss and perlite, then sphagnum moss.

My real questions are about light. There is about 5% natural light in my entire apartment. I have a window that is partially covered by desk. Where I want to grow has no Natural light. I wanted to try to get two CFL lights in the clip style, one for each side. Is this a good set up? What watt should I use?

Thanks to all who comment, and sorry if this on here (i've looked for 3 days)

Ben

 

[F R e N c H 3 z]

VFTs dont make good terrarium plant. If you keep it in there it will most likely eventually die. The plant needs full sun (6+ hrs outside) OR if you choose to grow it indoors you'll need some artificial lighting. Window sill light wont cut it. You'll need at least 12,000 lumens (minimum) I've had good results with mine under 4 T12s, 40W each, 4ft long lights. If you want to get a windowsill plant I'd go with something else such as a beginner Nepenthes or a Drosera adelae.

The reason your VFT wont do well is due to the higher humidity and lack of circulation of air which is perfect for fungus. If you can find a way to put your VFT outside, like use hooks to support a tray outside your window, it'll do really well for you as long as it gets full sun.

 

[D_muscipula]

I suggest getting a fluorescent stoplight and setting up a table or desk for sundews.

 

[blsmit]

Sun doesn't happen much here. Check weather.com for this week at 17815. here heres the apartment complex I live in. I live on the northish facing side. with little light. I understand that growing outside is best but I don't think there will be enough light and will be far to cold for North Carolina like conditions.

Any suggestions.

Ben

 

[DrWurm]

Sun doesn't happen much here. Check weather.com for this week at 17815. here heres the apartment complex I live in. I live on the northish facing side. with little light. I understand that growing outside is best but I don't think there will be enough light and will be far to cold for North Carolina like conditions.

Any suggestions.

Ben

It doesn't look like you have any balcony space at those apartments. You can always try to grow VFTs under lights, it has been done, but it's not recommended for beginners. You might want to start with some beginner sundews and nepenthes. You can find some excellently priced varieties at www.flytrapshop.com

 

[Peat]

Go to walmart and buy a two foot t8 fixture for 13dollars, bulbs included. Put that over the plant and it will be fine. If you want to buy better bulbs they sell them at lowes.

-peat

 

[blsmit]

Thanks for the fast responses. No there is no balcony (really theres hardly anything. Ill check out the sundews and nepenthes.

I'm taking a look at the t8... 13 dollars is an excellent price. Will this be enough light?

 

[scottychaos]

IMO, if you can only grow a VFT in a terrarium, because you have no where else to keep it..
well..then you really shouldn't grow VFTs at all right now..
its really not fair to the plant..it WILL die..eventually..probably in a year or less.

its not your fault..you cant help where you live right now..
you cant grow a pine tree in your dorm room either..
certain plants need certain conditions..its just nature..

I know people dont like that advice..but its just the truth..
I wouldn't get a dog or cat if I couldn't give it proper conditions to be healthy..or a fish..or a VFT..

they do very poorly in terrariums..and they cant go dormant..
which will kill them..
just wait until you can someday grow them outdoors..

meanwhile, some Nepenthes can make good windowsill plants.
and they dont need dormancy..

more: http://gold.mylargescale.com/scottychaos/CP/page2.html

Scot

(now stay tuned for all the contrary opinions!
yes, some people can grow them indoors..with YEARS of experience..
and for SHORT periods of time..not long term..
and someone will bring up "Barry Rice" again im sure....he doesnt grow them indoors year-round..only a few months at a time..)

no one has ever proved they can grow a VFT in a terrarium for more than two years..
because they cant..
meanwhile, some of my VFTs are 16 years old..
im just sayin'..

I feel its my duty to always bring this issue up..just for the good of the plants.
I do the same when goldfish bowls are discussed..its the exact same thing..

Scot

 

[blsmit]

ScottyChaos: I have read an equal amount of people stating that they can or cannot grow Venus Fly Traps in a terrarium. That being said, I have to ask what is the point of having a terrarium?

To me: a terrarium is a medium set up to grow plants in their optimum growing conditions. If a plant naturally grows in Florida but you live in NY, growing the plant in a terrarium that is set up like Florida you should be able to grow it in NY.

Thats not saying I'm not going to take your advice and grow nepenthes.

Thanks

 

[D_muscipula]

There are reports of exceptions but the rule that applies to pretty much every venus flytrap is that it needs a dormancy. Without dormancy it's lifespan is reduced to about a year or two depending on other factors like light. However with a dormancy, flytraps can live for decades.

 

[blsmit]

My plan was to let it go into dormancy by moving it to my girlfriends basement (she actually lives in an apartment with a garage), just for clarification when should dormancy happen.

Ben

 

[DrWurm]

ScottyChaos: I have read an equal amount of people stating that they can or cannot grow Venus Fly Traps in a terrarium. That being said, I have to ask what is the point of having a terrarium?

To me: a terrarium is a medium set up to grow plants in their optimum growing conditions. If a plant naturally grows in Florida but you live in NY, growing the plant in a terrarium that is set up like Florida you should be able to grow it in NY.

Thats not saying I'm not going to take your advice and grow nepenthes.

Thanks

Terrariums are definitely not optimum for VFTs. They are native to North Carolina. Terrariums are only really needed for plants that have high humidity and/or heat requirements.

 

[blsmit]

Let me rephrase my question. What is the best way to set up a 10 gallon CP Terrarium?

 

[CB1099]

That's not really a simple question to answer. Each species will have its own requirements. But in general, I think most people recommend placing each plant in its own pot, so that it can be easily removed when necessary. Personally, I don't use a terrarium. I've found that my plants do well without one. Many CPs can be acclimated to normal household humidity. You're biggest challenge with growing venus flytraps indoors is going to be light and dormancy. They need a lot of light, I grow mine outside in full sun. If you must grow them indoors, use flourescent lights. Go with daylight bulbs (6500k color, its usually printed on the bulb) and give them a long photoperiod. I'm afraid I can't tell you how to do dormancy indoors. They'll need a decreased photoperiod and cool temperatures. All that being said, there's still no guarantee for long term success. As others have said, they really are outdoor plants. Don't let any of this discourage you though, there are plenty of cps that can do well as indoor/windowsill plants.

 

[BigBella]

Hey guys My girlfriend got me a Venus Fly Trap, and I have been dieing to set up a Terrarium for it and probably a few more Fly Traps.

So this is what I got and ideas I have.

I have a 10 gallon aquairum. I would like more but I'm in college in a tiny apartment.

I'm going to layer the bottom with small rocks/large pebbles, then a layer of peat moss and perlite, then sphagnum moss.

My real questions are about light. There is about 5% natural light in my entire apartment. I have a window that is partially covered by desk. Where I want to grow has no Natural light. I wanted to try to get two CFL lights in the clip style, one for each side. Is this a good set up? What watt should I use?

Thanks to all who comment, and sorry if this on here (i've looked for 3 days)

Ben

There is certainly a hell of a lot of rubbish circulating about the cultivation of Dionaea.

Sure, it would be great if we all had access to direct sun and optimal conditions, but let's consider reality for a moment. I have grown flytraps under lights in the darkest damn apartments (in college) and on south-facing windows for years in the past; and I know of a number of people who grow them successfully in terrariums -- Barry Rice, author of Growing Carnivorous Plants, among them, as well as grower, David Connor (who at least grows a few under a T5 array). It simply requires some planning on your part , a modicum of expense, and often placing the lighting elements within inches of the plants themselves. Dormancy was generally triggered by shortening the lighting hours to mimic the change of season and keeping the terrarium in an unheated room from November through February (in California). That system worked for years without a hitch.

I now generally grow mine outdoors, due to the luxury of having more space; but I always have one or two on my south-facing window, for novelty's sake, and for the doom of the odd housefly. I would also suggest that your plants remain in separate pots; its far simpler to maintain and the root systems are generally healthier with more effective drainage than would be had in a closed system. Also, overheated tanks often breed disease, and I cannot tell you how many times I have seen Botrytis spread through a terrarium -- to the demise of everything . . .

Here is my windowsill "typical" plant with 3.8 cm (1.5") and larger traps from last Fall. Looks healthy enough to me.

Dionaea muscipula "Typical"

 

[blsmit]

BigBella,

Thanks for the pictures. I'm going to try it anyway, just wanted for some advice for my plans.
Will probably be buying some plants from flytrapshop.com.

thanks,
Ben

 

[scottychaos]

ScottyChaos: I have read an equal amount of people stating that they can or cannot grow Venus Fly Traps in a terrarium. That being said, I have to ask what is the point of having a terrarium?

To me: a terrarium is a medium set up to grow plants in their optimum growing conditions. If a plant naturally grows in Florida but you live in NY, growing the plant in a terrarium that is set up like Florida you should be able to grow it in NY.

Thats not saying I'm not going to take your advice and grow nepenthes.

Thanks

the point of having a terrarium is to grow plants that will do well in a terrarium!
a VFT is simply not one of those plants..

VFTs and Sarracenia need it significantly colder than Florida..they are not "tropical" plants by any means..most terrariums are good for "tropical house plants"..plants that are literally from the tropics and require no dormancy at all...The large family of "house plants" fall into this catagory..they do so well as "houseplants" because they are native to tropical regions that are so warm that they don't go dormant..basically there are no seasons as we know them...every day of the year is warm...just like the inside of a house..

VFTs and Sarracenia are simply not members of this category..they are not tropical..
A ficus tree grows well indoors year round..a maple tree doesn't..a VFT doesn't either.

so thats basically why VFTs are not good terrarium plants..because they are not tropical house plants..

Scot

 

[scottychaos]

My plan was to let it go into dormancy by moving it to my girlfriends basement (she actually lives in an apartment with a garage), just for clarification when should dormancy happen.

Ben

Ben,
the main reason a terrarium shortens the life of a VFT is because the non-changing environment inside a terrarium doesnt allow the plant to slowly and gradually go dormant..

rather than type lots of stuff out, I will simply copy and paste from my webpage!
much easier..

The reason I have to do the fridge method at all is because I have VERY cold winters, and they last a long time..(5 months).. Here in Western NY, we have brutal winters, sub-freezing temps for weeks on end, tons and tons and tons of snow.. its way too severe for Sarracenia and VFT's to survive outside all winter. VFT and Sarracenia need a COOL winter..not a freezing artic winter. VFTs and Sarracenia (all except S. purpurea) are native to the South East USA..where they get a definate winter season, but a cool, somewhat mild winter, with temps in the mid-30's up to the mid 50's.
(+2 to 12 Celsius) sometimes they get snow and a light freeze, but when they do, it only lasts for a day or two and it quickly warms to above freezing again. Its a much less severe winter than here in Rochester.

Those south east USA winters are the conditions that need to be replicated. So..since I cant keep them outdoors, and I dont have a cool basement or an unheated room..what to do? the FRIDGE!
its perfect. temps very cool, but just *above* freezing..about 35 degrees fahrenheit. (2 degrees C)

My plants go into the fridge in the late fall. late October or early November.
whenever the nightime temps begin to seriously fall below freezing. (32F, zero C)
They stay in the fridge all of November, December, January,
and they usually come back out in Mid February..Valentines Day. 3 and 1/2 months dormancy.
but..Mid-February is still the dead of winter here! still far too cold outside.
So they sit indoors in front of a bright window to slowly come out of dormancy.
then, by April or May, they can go back outside for the season..
they remain outside ALL Summer, and then into Autumn..
I keep them outdoors all through August, September and into October, as days and nights
gradually fall into the 60's, 50's, 40's.. (15..10...5C)

I wont even consider bringing them inside unless its going to fall below freezing
or if there is a heavy frost forecast for overnight.
This way, nature creates a natural dormancy for me!
I dont have to do a thing about "making them go dormant"..
they go dormant naturally through all of late summer and into autumn..
then, by the time they are ready for the fridge,
they are already fully "asleep" and are ready to continue that sleep in the fridge..

Please note that the fridge does not cause or create the dormancy!
it simply maintains the dormancy that was already started naturally by keeping the plants outdoors all season..the plants need to be already dormant before they go in the fridge.

In my opinion, VFT's and Sarracenia should never be grown indoors or especially in terrariums..
the climate inside a terrarium is just all-wrong for them..
the climate is fine for a few months...but VFTs and Sarrs need very different climates at different times of year..

Keeping VFTs and Sarrs in a terrarum is the same as trying to grow maple tree bonsai in a terrarium..
you can replicate June-July-August ok in a terrarium..sunny and warm..but what about the other 9 months of the year?

Maple trees need a gradually warming spring to come out of dormancy, a gradually warmer and sunnier summer, a gradually cooler and darker autumn, then a cold and dark winter to be fully dormant.

...cycle repeats...

so do VFTs and Sarracenia.
its not an option..its a necessity.

If you grow a maple tree indoors it will die within a year...the non-changing environment of a terrarium will also eventually kill a VFT.

VFTs need it warm and REALLY sunny in the summer..DIRECT sunlight..
where can you find that? outdoors in the summer!
Nature provides the perfect light for free..
then you need gradually decreasing photoperiod and gradually decreasing temps from summer into autumn..
where can you find that? outdoors..again nature does all the work for us.

The only tricky season for those of us in the Northern states is the winter..Spring, Summer and Autumn are a breeze..just keep the plants outdoors April - October.
but the plants need a COOL winter..the winter of South Carolina..
but winters in the northern states are too severe and will kill them if the plants are left outdoors..

If you have a cool basement or attic, or a garage that stays in the 40's (4-10C) all winter, thats fine
for dormancy..or ideally, if you live in the southern US where winters are mild, just leave your plants outside 24/7/365! but right now I lack any of those conditions..hence, they are going in the fridge!

http://gold.mylargescale.com/scottychaos/CP/page2.html

you cant take a VFT that has been in a terrarium all year and just "make it go dormant" by moving it somewhere else....
it needs to be outside August through October, at least, so that it will go dormant naturally..

if your plant is in the terrarium all this year, until November, then you try to put it in the basemet..it wont survive...because the plant will not be dormant when you put it in the basement..because it has been in the terrarium..

Think of your VFT as a Maple tree..
maple trees make lousy houseplants..and lousy terrarium plants..
VFTs require the same seasonal changes as a maple tree..the only difference is the VFT cant take winters quite as cold as the maple tree..but the VFT requires a definate spring, summer, autumn and winter season..
its just needs winters around 40 degrees F for 2 or 3 months...cool, but not freezing..

Scot

 

[cmm889]

Hey Everyone,

I tend to wind up being "the other person" scottychaos refers to when speaking about how some people tend to disagree as far as whether its impossible to grow them indoors in terrariums for extended periods of time...

everyone by now is clear on the fact that it is MUCH better of an option to grow them outdoors,
but now that thats out of the way...

when that is absolutely not possible. Such as the last year and half where I took lived in a small college apart complex with absolutely no outside light accessibility...so I feel your pain

I've managed to grow VFT's indoors in terrariums for 2 solid years... thats 2 dormancies that were entirely inside and I have good growth this season after the 2nd completed dormancy.
it is possible to do it, i've done both CFL's and Tubes... I've done dormancies by fridge technique AND by basement and garage technique as well,...

when it comes to lighting up vft's indoors you'r going to need WAY more than just 2 CFLs, and honestly probably more intensity than 4 -T8's are going to give you... i've got 4 T-8's and 6 CFLS over my one tank where I grow most of VFTs at the moment.. and your going to need them at a pretty close distance to the plants itself... keep that in mind. ( if you have questions on how I did my lighting setup just PM me )

your pretty much not going to be able to actually do a planted terrarium, in that... you literally use your 10 gal aquarium as the planter... its a much better option for many many reasons to have them in their own individual pots... if you ever had to repot or move for dormancy reasons you dont want to lug around a 10 gal. aquarium that's filled with wet peat and your VFT's... not to say that you couldnt create an aesthetically pleasing scenario for your planted VFT's to sit in if thats what your going for?


the hard part of growing VFT's indoors is going to be the dormancy period...it requires alot more work than just throwing pots into the fridge for a couple months and forgetting about em, just the same as... moving them from where they were growing all year to a cold basement with no light wont work either... it requires a more gradual process, both with lighting cue's and temperature cues... and thats not exactly always easy to pull off... the over winter health of your VFT's is incredibly important, otherwise you'll lose everything over the winter due to the most likely cause of death being rot, from probably keeping it too wet with no light. its a pretty common occurance that tends to pop up when beginners grow indoors without a REAL understanding of exactly what needs to happen in order to grow them successfully.

just trying to show you the otherside, not becuase I think you've heard bad advice because thats not at all true...

I just have to show up in these threads because I don't want you to think that its impossible because its not. ( and because I know scottychaos loves to see me here )

if you have specific questions on my set up or anything that I didnt explain very well just PM me and I'll try to point you in the right direction as far as whether this is really the approach you wanted..

-Chris

 

[Halt]

you can put your plants on the window with lights that way they'll get a natural dormacy (shortening of photoperiod) and you can always turn off your lights during the dromacy months to stimulate dormacy. eg. when dormacy monthes come (november and such) do not turn on your light and let the window do the dormacy work. hope this helps (for the lights you can hang them from those chains and maybe 5"-7" away from the plant, and the window will help too, lightwise, and dormacy wise.) After your plant stops growing (that is a sure tell their in dormacy) you can put them in an unheated garage, the fridge, cold room, or you can even keep it growing just make sure you give them dormacy though! i think they can go 2 years w.o dormacy.