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Thread: T5 Bulb Brands?

  1. #25
    Let's positive thinking! seedjar's Avatar
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    Um, I don't mean to be a jerk but I've had a really hard time finding information about bulbs and out of all the threads I've started across five forums this is the first one to start yielding useful information. Please try to keep this about bulbs, quality of bulbs, and places to buy bulbs.
    There are already several threads discussing T5 light fixtures in the recent months, several of which I started. There are literally hundreds of threads discussing people's terrarium setups and conditions. Or you can start your own thread.
    Thanks,
    ~Joe
    o//~ Livin' like a bug ain't easy / My old clothes don't seem to fit me /
    I got little tiny bug feet / I don't really know what bugs eat /
    Don't want no one steppin' on me / Now I'm sympathizin' with fleas /
    Livin' like a bug ain't easy / Livin' like a bug ain't easy... o//~

  2. #26
    Av8tor1's Avatar
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    I dont know how accurate these numbers are, but here are some 54w T5 VHO PAR values that were listed on a planted aquarium website back in 2006

    ATI

    Sun Pro 357
    Aquablue 336
    Blue Plus 311
    Actinic 137

    D&D/Giesemann

    Midday 325
    Aquablue 324
    Actinic Plus 264
    Pure Actinic 157

    UVL

    Aqua sun 345
    Actinic White 293
    Super Actinic 210

    AquaZ

    Sun Pro 285
    Ocean Pro 323
    Blue Pro 266

    Helios

    Daylight 309
    Super Blue 225

    Current Sun Paq

    Daylight 10K 272
    Blue 252

    GE Daylight 340


    But there is more to it then PAR or even PUR...

    Ive got some of the Giesemann 6000k Midday on order. Im wanting to try these for a several reasons. One, if you look at their spectral performance they emit wavelengths over 700nm and have a very broad spectrum with a high CRI (5 phosphor IIRC)
    Second, I found them at a great price from a reef supply that is going out of business
    (diyreef.com)




    As you can see, there is even a wide variance in PAR (and PUR) values even among bulbs designed for plant/reef use... and the GE starcoat Daylight is a very strong bang for the buck and has a proven track record.
    http://bluegrasscarnivores.com/t5/28..._t5_linear.pdf

    GE 6500k Daylight (IIRC)


    GE 3000k (IIRC)


    I would not buy a bulb based on any one value alone... but I will use a single value to eliminate a choice. There are many variables at play when it comes to plant lights. You have photosynthesis, accessory pigments, wavelengths that inhibit phytopathogen growth, wavelengths that inhibit plant growth, etc etc etc..

    I have piles of "good" bulbs that I have bought and tried only to swap out in a month or two

    While most bulbs will grow plants, all bulbs are definitely not created equal

    Av

  3. #27
    RL7836's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Av8tor1 View Post
    Ron, I havent looked at any of the most recent models.... but up till about 6 months ago white leds were for the most part almost "red-less" (not desirable LOL)

    we would be talking "top shelf" with proper optics... so we are a ways off yet
    Av,
    Have you checked out this thread? Some people are playing with Cree LEDs. The Fenix flashlight that elgecko has is powered by a single Cree Q5 LED and is impressive from both a lumen output & color perspective. It didn't have the 'difficult-to-see' perspective that I have with other run-of-the-mill LEDs when I played around with it. I read somewhere that Cree has a newer LED with 30% higher output than the Q5 - but I haven't seen any appear in new products.
    All the best,
    Ron
    You must do the thing you think you cannot do. --- Eleanor Roosevelt

    *** Growlist / Wants / Offers ***
    (with Pics)

  4. #28
    Av8tor1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RL7836 View Post
    Av,
    Have you checked out this thread? Some people are playing with Cree LEDs. The Fenix flashlight that elgecko has is powered by a single Cree Q5 LED and is impressive from both a lumen output & color perspective. It didn't have the 'difficult-to-see' perspective that I have with other run-of-the-mill LEDs when I played around with it. I read somewhere that Cree has a newer LED with 30% higher output than the Q5 - but I haven't seen any appear in new products.

    Ron, the cree is very impressive indeed... but they are not there just yet.

    Here is their spectra (cree's documentation)


    Here are some fluorescent bulbs for comparison:


    Here are some of the spectral curves for for photosynthesis and aux pigments:


    Here is the bulb Im using (just for ref, notice the performance above 600nm):


    As you will notice, while good elsewhere the red performance of the Cree still drops off proportionally above 600nm (and below 450nm btw)
    Of course you could take the white Cree and supplement the red (and blue)...but then you are back to the blending and optics issues

    Interestingly, to get the white LED they take a typical Blue LED and add a yellow fluorescent "phosphor" If I understand the technology correctly, sort of a hybrid between the two formats. Once perfected, they will have the best of both worlds.

    They will be the light of choice, just not yet IMHO. They still have to overcome the red performance and the cost issue.

    Close, but no cigar just yet... but cost is increasingly becoming more of the limiting factor then the technology.

    I wouldn't be buying stock in any manufacturer of "traditional" lighting technologies

    T5 still has a good 5 year run as king

    Of course these are just my personal opinions, I am no expert on lighting...

    Av

  5. #29
    Av8tor1's Avatar
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    Here is an interesting quad color module from Cree:


    Now if they combine this 6000k module with the 5000k white module (and bumps up the upper and lower perf) then we have something that gets mighty close to nirvana

    one day in the not too distant future...
    Av

  6. #30
    DaJimmer's Avatar
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    Is it true that you need a range of "k" to grow well cuz i got 2 daylight cfl's over 1000 lumens each running at 6500K. i heard that light leaning toward the red spectrum helps with flowering or something.


    Its been running for about 6 months and it seems to do fine but Prolly could be better

    ---------- Post added at 10:16 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:12 AM ----------

    you posted before i could
    but can you put that in english?

    ---------- Post added at 10:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:16 AM ----------

    what should i improve?

  7. #31
    Let's positive thinking! seedjar's Avatar
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    K is a unit of measurement - Kelvins - not a measurement itself. Kelvins represent temperature. When a bulb is labeled as 6500K, it means that the bulb emits the same color light as a black body heated to a temperature of 6500 kelvins.
    ~Joe
    o//~ Livin' like a bug ain't easy / My old clothes don't seem to fit me /
    I got little tiny bug feet / I don't really know what bugs eat /
    Don't want no one steppin' on me / Now I'm sympathizin' with fleas /
    Livin' like a bug ain't easy / Livin' like a bug ain't easy... o//~

  8. #32
    Av8tor1's Avatar
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    DaJ,

    The question you ask is not something that can't really be answered in a sentence or two... there are many variables, the amount of light, the light spectra, the efficiency of the fixture, the photo-period, etc etc etc

    While CFL such as yours are a good choice for small set ups, they are inherently inefficient. If you look at the bulb you will notice that the bulb has a lot of "re-strike". This re-strike is the portion of the bulb that is not pointed at or reflected to the plant, but back to the bulb itself.

    They can never be as efficient as a linear bulb, but for small set ups this is a perfectly acceptable inefficiency.

    This web page is older (prior to T5 and LED) but is probably the single best page on plant lighting. But even it is only focused on plant growth.... there is much more to it then just the photosynthesis curves. I have bulbs that grow plants great, but lack color and disease resistance etc etc

    Dont get too lost in the red/blue fog....there is more to it then just that IMHO

    http://www.aquabotanic.com/lightcompare.htm

    HTH's
    Av

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