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Thread: Id my dewy!

  1. #17

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    I'm not so sure the word "typical" can really apply to so widespread and varied a species. This appears to be the Kanto form, and is typical in regards to that form.
    "Grow More, Share More"

  2. #18
    Moderator Joseph Clemens's Avatar
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    Sure looks like Drosera x tokaiensis to me. Isn't the "Kanto" form supposed to look almost like a miniature Drosera aliciae?



    Joseph Clemens
    Tucson, Arizona, U S A

  3. #19

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    Hi Joseph,

    Well, the Kansai form has more distinctly spoon shaped lamina I think, and much longer and narrow (1-1.5 mm) petioles without a cover of stalked glands. The tentacles in the photo here extend nearly to the plants center, and the lamina are both broader and more spathulate which brings to mind more of the Kanto form in my opinion.

    No way could I ever say that any D. spatulata looks like D. aliciae, whoever wrote that must have been a wee bit uninformed. I have on occasion confused D. capillaris and D. spatulata, but never have I ever mistaken it for anything from South Africa!
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  4. #20
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    what type of spatulata is the kind you typically find in garden centers?

    i think it's the same type PFT sells.

  5. #21
    Moderator Joseph Clemens's Avatar
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    I wrote that Drosera spatulata "Kanto" looked like miniature Drosera aliciae because every "Kanto" I ever saw looked like a tiny Drosera aliciae.

    I do not mean to say that if the plant does not look like a miniature Drosera aliciae that it is automatically Drosera spatulata "Kansai".

    [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/smile_m_32.gif[/img] After all these designations "Kansai", "Kanto" are not even valid names for taxonomy or horticulture, they are just something we CP growers use to help decide what we are growing. Old names that if they were officially described and published, especially with photographic standards, could really help us all to understand more precisely what we are growing.
    Joseph Clemens
    Tucson, Arizona, U S A

  6. #22

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    I totally agree. The term "Kanto" is way too vauge. I agree as well that the wedge shaped forms are likely to be whatever whomever refers to as the Kanto form. The way I interpert it, if the plant has the long, thin, stalkless petioles giving it a distinct wheel shape, then it is the Kansai form. I can accept "Kansai" as a descriptor since I can always recognize it. "Kanto" threfore becomes a "catch all" term for those species which don't meet the Kansai criteria. Although some of these forms, notably the Queensland and NZ alpine forms from Mt. Ruahepu have wedge shaped leaves, they still are not reminiscent (to me at least) of D. aliciae. Some of the alpine NZ forms approximate D. montana var tomentosa (from some localities like Morro do Jambiero, as does your own D. 'Ruby Slippers') since the wedge shape has a more or less similar tapering, but all very different from D. aliciae.

    These variability issues have continually affected taxonomists dealing with this complex. The complex is a frustratingly complex one, with much variation across its range. I have seen typical rosettes smaller than a dime and as large around as a teacup. I have seen wedge shaped, spathulate, truncate, and subrotund lamina. I have seen glabrous scapes and scapes with stalked retentive glands. Although stipule details, seed testa and sepals remain remarkably consistent throughout the complex, with only a few exceptions - notably the hairy sepal form from Gympie, Queensland.

    Due to the extreme variation within the complex, I feel the taxonomy and phylogeny of this complex would be best assayed through L-ribosomal gene markers. In the case of S. spatulata, the lumping of these plants is self defeating. It is the same within the D. indica complex, but that is another can of worms.

    After browsing through some D. spatulata photos, the form from Melbourne, Australia is very similar to the one shown in this photo.
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  7. #23

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    L-ribosomal gene markers. Are they nuclear or mitochondrial genes?

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    Any updates? [img]http://www.**********.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/new/confused.gif[/img]
    Carnivorous plants growlist:http://www.**********.com/cgi-bin....t=17597
    Onda je sultan pao mrtav do kostura

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