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Thread: Any construction sites

  1. #41

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    The trouble with letting only "certain people" participate in plant rescues is that ONLY these "certain people" will end up going on plant rescues, and they most likely will keep all the plants for themselves. It's usually very clique-ish.

    How do I know?

    I used to belong to Wild Ones, and our chapter did many plant rescues. I was a fully paid member, and I was never invited. The "in" crowd was, however. The "in" crowd got themselves very nice native plant gardens, for free. Did they share these plants with other chapter members? Nope. Aprilh.
    \"People place their hand on the Bible and swear to uphold the Constitution; they don't put their hand on the Constitution and swear to uphold the Bible,\" Jamie Raskin, to Senator Nancy Jacobs.

  2. #42

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    April,
    You make a very good point. However, all organizations are not the same and it is not fair to generalize. The last 'rescue' I did, I shipped 114 S. rubra ssp. gulfensis plants out across the country and when all was said and done I did not even have one of the plants left for me. I forgot to hold one back. Don't mistake this for complaining. I'd do it again in a heart beat.

    Before I get bombarded with kind requests, I do have a Crestview rubra now.
    I remain a man obsessed with a genus
    Brooks

  3. #43
    SirKristoff is a poopiehead Ozzy's Avatar
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    My opinion is that if you join an organization that saves plant to get free plants, you're just a collector that has found a cheap way to get plants. If this is what people are expecting from the NASC, then you've joined the wrong organization. This is not a find a site that's being destroyed, so grab as many plants as you can group. We are putting together a strict chain of command. We are setting rules up so that we can weed out the people that are looking for free plants. There will be no clique. Just trusted individuals with one mission.

  4. #44

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    There actually are some organizations out there that encourage their members to totally strip sites by taking plant material home even if all you do is pot it up and pass it on. After the threatened and endangered species are removed and transferred to the appropriate parties by trained volunteers that have been thoroughly screened, that still generally leaves a considerable amount of plant material that may be native. I'm referring to waste not want not in this particular situation.

    My particular Wild Ones Chapter actually wants its members to take home as much native vegetation as is humanly possible from target sites (specifically those slated to be excavated and turned into seas of asphalt or cookie cutter barefoot chemically dependent residential lawns) to keep and plant on their own properties or to distribute to friends, family, and neighbors for their properties. They want everything from herbaceous perennials to woodies removed if at all humanly possible.

    The issue for the local Chapter that April is referring to is that a long time ago a man with the best of intentions volunteered to organize plant "rescues" for the general membership. He was set up as the sole contact. Now mind you, these are actual plant rescues in the true sense of the word as all the threatened and endangered species will have already been removed and relocated to insure perpetuation of the species for future generations to enjoy... anyway, he went south so to speak.

    He receives the faxes at his home and basically sits on them. He doesn't put forth the effort to organize anything any longer and half the time he doesn't even bother visiting a site himself. What's really infuriating is when you spot a site with heavy equipment on it and ask him if he knew about it, he'll tell you that he received a fax after the permit was approved months ago and invite you to stop over any time and he'll give you copies. It's gotten to the point that the only people who have knowledge of which sites have building permits in place with secured consents are his personal friends and neighbors who stop in for other reasons. He really should resign from the position and let somebody else take over but I suppose he likes the title even if he no longer does the work. These things happen from time to time and sooner or later somebody will question why it is that no plant "rescues" have been organized for about 3 years running now.

    And yes, his neighbors and his little inner circle have some very nice native plant gardens. Sad but true and it happens all the time around here.

    Now there is another local Wild Ones that is well organized and these issues do not exist. Their volunteers are like Brooks in that they go in and remove specific species and then redistribute to approved recipients. What's rather interesting is that most of these people who do the grunt labor of removing the plants, don't provide care for them. I can't say as I blame them. After you remove about 100-200 of them in one marathon session you sure as heck don't want to look at so much as even one of them for another few years until it gets moved to a permanent location.

    Given the invasion process is well underway as well as the current state of our watersheds, sitting on any native plant material is unconscionable. The roots of native plants are very deep with many species extending 20' or greater. That was no typo as I meant 20 feet. These species, regardless of how common they may be, are desperately needed in all of our landscapes if not for anything else but erosion control as well as the sake of attempting to restore some semblance of balance to our fragile ecosystems. Barring the above, we desperately need to focus on preserving diversity as most species are co-dependent for lack of a better term.

    In addition to Wild Ones, I am also a member of a few other groups. Plants Of Concern comes to mind and they are geared to deal with endangered and threatened species almost exclusively however they provide care for any other native species that are present in the native plant community. They monitor existing communities of endangered and threatened species and make sure that exotic species are controlled, managed, and eradicated so as to insure the native species are not out competed. They want to make sure future generations don't view these species only in picture books. The INPS also has a similar program as does the North American Native Plant Society, Nature Serve, United Plant Savers, the Center For WildLife and Plant Ecology, The Wetlands Initiative, and The Lady Bird Johnson Wildflower Center and of course the North American Plant Collections Consortium. I am relatively sure The Nature Conservancy has something going on also.

    I might as well add that my property is certified "Acres For WildLife" so any and all plant material used in my upland and lowland woodlands or wetlands is approved and sources disclosed and documented. The vast majority of what I have is purchased from State nurseries but I also purchase from NP sales and NP nurseries that maintain local genotype lines. Other than that, I get seed from my own property and from fellow Wild Ones Members with location and source data and I do just fine. I currently have no material growing on this property from any plant rescues although I actually help with NP plant rescues as well as a NP seed bank. I do have several species that I purchased that will ultimately be used for restoration projects in the local area. We need to collectively hoard these species for our grandchildren. Nobody needs to field collect other than for the sake of pure and unadulterated greed and possessiveness in my humble opinion. There is absolutely no reason to reduce one's self to the level of a field collector as it has been my experience that most CP people are comparable to most Native Plant people in that they all share. With so many sources out there that are legit, why do it.

  5. #45

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    Change of plans I dont get to go bogging
    Join the CCPS, you wont regret it: http://s4.invisionfree.com/CCPS

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]My opinion is that if you join an organization that saves plant to get free plants, you're just a collector that has found a cheap way to get plants. If this is what people are expecting from the NASC, then you've joined the wrong organization. This is not a find a site that's being destroyed, so grab as many plants as you can group. We are putting together a strict chain of command. We are setting rules up so that we can weed out the people that are looking for free plants. There will be no clique. Just trusted individuals with one mission. Ozzy

    Ozzy,

    1) From what I see, the disorganization, the lack of a business model or plan, etc., etc., etcÖ..tells me the NASC doesn't really exist at this time. I volunteered a while ago, and never heard anything back. And I'm really not interested in being, nor can I or anyone be, a member of something that doesn't exist.

    2) I have been involved with prairie restoration and land conservation since around 1978 or 1980. I have been a volunteer at the Wolf Road Prairie restoration, the West Chicago Prairie restoration, and am now a volunteer involved in Prairie/Woodland/Wetland restoration and maintenance at a local State Park.

    3) Up until the time I volunteered at the local SP, 3 years ago, I never received a free plant. Ever. At the local SP, if there are plants that have sprouted up in the wrong area in the nursery beds, volunteers are allowed to take these strays home, because if they were re-planted in the nursery beds, they would die because there currently isnít a volunteer to take care of the nursery beds. I have taken 4 plants. They are: Tradescantia Ohiensis, Aster Laevis, Sorgastrum Nutans, and Schizachyrium Scoparium. These are all very common prairie plants.

    4) I have been on many, many, many, many state and federally permitted, legal rescues (20+), including, yes, the S. Purpurea Purpurea, and I didnít take anything. Not a twig. Didnít give a ratís about Sarracennias back then, outside of their being one of the indicator plants for high quality wetland. I have already purchased, from reputable sources, the native plants I wanted, OR dug them from friendís land before the land was logged. I donít go for common prairie or woodland plants(though I have lots of those, too). I go for the stuff thatís endangered, for the purpose of propagation and hopefully restoration to its native habitat, if any can be found. Until that time, they sit contentedly blooming safe and sound, making seed and new little plants that I SHARE. And not with just a select inner circle, either. I put plants and seed up for SASE and trade on Garden Web every year. Not too much in the way of CP seed or plants up for trade there, Iíve noticed.

    I really donít need to join an organization to get free plants. And Iím happy and content with the amount of CP I have now, most of which were given to me free by really, really nice people. I joined Terra AFTER I BOUGHT plants. I joined Terra to find out how to take proper care of them, not score freebies.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ] We are setting rules up so that we can weed out the people that are looking for free plants. There will be no clique. Just trusted individuals with one mission.
    Who will administer these rules? Who is "we"? A board? Elected or appointed? Trusted individuals chosen by whom? The same people who chose Casper?

    I donít appreciate having my motives, or anyone elseís, impugned.

    Have a nice day, Ozzy, and best of luck with the NASC.

    April H.
    \"People place their hand on the Bible and swear to uphold the Constitution; they don't put their hand on the Constitution and swear to uphold the Bible,\" Jamie Raskin, to Senator Nancy Jacobs.

  7. #47
    SirKristoff is a poopiehead Ozzy's Avatar
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    April, I replied to what you said. You made a comment about people using the wild ones (I think) to keep all the plants for themselves and their friends. I was refering to people like them, I never made any reference to you. You lumped yourself into that catogory, not me.
    You said the NASC don't exist. You're almost right. We are not up and running yet, and we don't have the ablity to save many plants, YET. There was some people that wanted to put the horse before the cart and start going out and save plants, get our name out before we really even existed. The first thing we need to do is to get non-profit status. Then we can move forward. If you don't want to be part of this there is nobody forcing you to. We don't need somebody hanging around telling us what we're doing wrong when she don't have a clue to what's going on behind the scene.
    The board members were elected. I don't know who choose Casper, that was before I was a real part of the NASC. Again this is another thing where you're running your mouth but don't know any facts. Casper had or has a teminal disease. We don't know if he's even alive. He was an honest man, that had no need to steal any money. You have no right to drag his name through the mud, when you don't have a clue who he is or his physical condition.

  8. #48

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    Let's all just stop please as we will all begin reading into what is typed and without the body language and the inflections in our voices to go along with the typed words, it is difficult to discern how to interpret posts such as these. Please, let's not read more into what is typed than what may be there.

    In my heart I do not believe that Casper is all that he led others to believe he was and I would have to agree with the comments Bugweed made about him previously. I believe we all read those comments. April's comments were benign by comparison.

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