Vanila

[Juan-Carlos]

Quote[/b] (rattler_mt @ Sep. 17 2005,6:23)]JC, do you have any pics of guzmania or Vanilla in the wild? i would love to see them if you do.

I do, BUT I have to look for them... I know for a fact I have a couple pics of a couple BEAUTIFUL clumps of guzmania, pics of leaf less orchids (ghost) and other orchids etc. but dont know if I ever took pics of vanila, it is like a weed out there...I might have one or two I'll have to go through my old pic disks and find them. I have the disks at work, so i'll get them on monday. When I do I'll post em here.

-Jc

 

[Starman]

Alright superimposedhope, you go find me ONE example where a Vanilla grows and flowers EVERY day(like a true happy Vanilla would) indoors in the USA or Europe. And without usign a terrarium.

And if I dont know, you dont know either. You dont realise that NO ONE has achived making a Vanilla truly happy so it makes  a few flowers every day.
So its not exactly an opinion. Its is a FACT. And you and a few others arnt accepting those facts. Tell me: What makes you think your case will be any different to the hundreds, if not thousands, of other people who have already tried the same thing? Plus those people have tried every trick in the book to tyr to make them truly happy and flower every day without using a terrarium or greenhouse, but nothing worked.


And youve just proved again that you cant do that with a Vanilla outside a greenhouse or terrarium, you said its essential for it. Point proved again: I already said you cant do it without a greenhouse or terrarium.
and by the way, 7santiago and rattler want to do it terrarium free, so you havnt got much of an argument there.

 

[Starman]

Quote[/b] (herenorthere @ Sep. 17 2005,6:25)]But I do stand by my statement that "experts [and serious growers] almost always have have ideal growing conditions for whatever it is they're experts [or serious] about.  They either live in the environment their plants prefer or provide a greenhouse or some other controlled environment for them."

Youre wrong again, all the experts I know have a house filled with orchids and they dont have any humidifiers or anything in their house to help them grow. They always tryt o make enw thigns grow in the house outside a controlled environment too.

 

[Starman]

Quote[/b] (Juan-Carlos @ Sep. 17 2005,6:19)]

Quote[/b] ]But does it flower happily EVERY day like mad like a good greenhouse grown plant does? I dont think so
A truly happy Vanilla would make a few blooms every morning

I live in Florida, sorry but vanila does not flower like mad all year around.. its actually quite rare to see blooms inthe wild...

Thats because Vanilla blooms open at around dawm and die off at midday, and they would fall off and dissapear by midday, so not many people actually see the blooms cos they dont get there very early in the morning when their flowers are sitll fresh

 

[Juan-Carlos]

Quote[/b] (Starman @ Sep. 17 2005,6:33)]

Quote[/b] (Juan-Carlos @ Sep. 17 2005,6:19)]

Quote[/b] ]But does it flower happily EVERY day like mad like a good greenhouse grown plant does? I dont think so
A truly happy Vanilla would make a few blooms every morning

I live in Florida, sorry but vanila does not flower like mad all year around.. its actually quite rare to see blooms inthe wild...

Thats because Vanilla blooms open at around dawm and die off at midday, and they would fall off and dissapear by midday, so not many people actually see the blooms cos they dont get there very early in the morning when their flowers are sitll fresh

I ussually start my days in fakahatchee strand at around 8 am, to take advantage of the cooler morning. Sorry, but if even if this where true there would be spent blooms on the vines and or on the floor. I I do keep my eyes peeled because I am not only looking plants I am also looking for diffrent fauna in the strand. Even spent blooms, would be a nice treat.. they dont just vanish in thin air.

*sigh* I sure hope I have a pic of vanila in the wild just to show you guys... if not i'll snap one when I go again.

-Jc

 

[Juan-Carlos]

ha ha this is one of those never ending debate topics... I'm off to work talk to you all tonight! Starman if your even in Miami Florida, contact me and i'll take you to see vanila in the wild. The proof is in the pudding

Take care guys,

-Jc

 

[Starman]

When I said dissapear I meant fall to the floor and get blown away etc.
But that does seem strange, as here when Vanillas are truly happy bloom every day and produce a few blooms every morning
Before that they dont really flower

 

[superimposedhope]

Ok everyone, Starman is right. We all might as well stop trying to grow any other way than what the experts say. Poor Rattler, you can't grow a tropical in Montana it's Zone 4 or something up there. Who's gonna break the news to him?
I think we've met the Botanical Dahli Lama (sp?), he's only a few years old and wiser beyond his age. Before we try to go growing condiments we might try asking Dahli first if it'll grow or not. Why try it ourselves he already knows better than us.

 

[Clint]

Not everyone grows orchid for flowers. if orchids didn't flower at all i wouldn't care; they have really cool leaves and roots.

--------------
Rude comment edited out. Stop that.
PAK

 

[herenorthere]

You're right, JLAP, they really do have cool leaves and roots. If I just wanted new flowers every day, the orchids would go to the compost and I'd fill the pots with dandelions.

 

[rattler]

i cant wait to see the pics JC. i am definatly interested in seeing any ghost orchid pics. i keep thinking that i should try growing one of those in one of my dart tanks as it seems to be an almost ideal enviro for them. havent gotten up the nerve though. quite a rare plant to be experimenting with. maybe someday

 

[rattler]

yep Joe im zone 3/4 the gal who i quoted a couple pages back that bloomed her vanilla without a greenhouse or sun room is zone 5/6 a very tropical area indeed

 

[herenorthere]

Seed-grown ghost orchids aren't rare - even Oak Hill Gardens has them - http://www.oakhillgardens.com/htm/orchid_fs_detail.php?prod=561.  It's been a few years since I ordered from there, but the selection and price are outstanding.  It's the place for someone who prefers to grow a small plant to adulthood rather than pay extra for someone else to do it for them.

 

[rattler]

thanks Bruce. thats half of what ive seen freashly deflasked ones on ebay go for. i may have to try one.

 

[Alvin Meister]

Okay guys, I've been alerted to this thread and have read through it all.

I'm just going to say that firstly I think you've got to agree to disagree about this and let it rest.

Dino - I know nothing about vanilla and have no doubt you know your stuff. But, let anyone who wants to experiment have a go. Britain and America have different climates and not everything about plants is 100% prescriptive.

Rattler and co - go ahead and have a go. Like I say I know nothing about vanilla and have no doubt you know what you're doing. Let us know if what you plan doesn't work though.

Tolerance is what's needed here.

 

[PlantAKiss]

Yup. What he said.

Sorry it took me so long to get here but I was out of town looking at CPs in a bog.

Dino...its possible you are right. But nobody knows everything and its possible that some where, some one is doing exactly what you say can't be done. Sounds like the odds are against it, but you never know. Even the "experts" may not know since no one knows everything.

Rattler and others have the right to try to grow whatever they want...how they want. They will learn from the experience. If they enjoy the plant as a pretty vine...who cares if it flowers. If he wants to TRY to flower it...fine. If he fails. Fine. He had fun doing it.

As I've said a million times...its best to say "in my opinion", "from what I've read", "as far as I know", "in my experience" instead of "you can't", "that's impossible", "you're wrong." I wouldn't recommend using the word "impossible"..."not likely" would be a better choice.

State your opinion, give the reasons supporting your opinion...and leave it at that.

BUT...nobody needs to making person digs at anybody. JLAP...I'm deleting your rude comments. Not appropriate in public. Same goes for you as everybody...state your opinion but leave person slaps out of it.

Continue discussing this if you can keep sarcasm and rudeness out of your posts. Opinions are fine...quotes, articles, experiments, etc.

But anyone can grow anything they want to, HOW they want to. There is no harm in trying to break the rules.

Now...y'all go play nice.

 

[herenorthere]

I don't know why I should be nice; it's obvious no one here knows anything about growing vanilla.  I planted vanilla and provided the exact conditions people are recommending and ... nothing happened.  Hmmm, I wonder if I should have stratified that little bottle before planting it.  Maybe I'll get a nice, carefree plant if I use a bottle of artificial vanilla flavoring.  No worries about light or humidity - we'll just need to dust now and then.

 

[ImportedCrabJuice]

me

 

[Juan-Carlos]

Quote[/b] (herenorthere @ Sep. 19 2005,9:34)]I don't know why I should be nice; it's obvious no one here knows anything about growing vanilla.  I planted vanilla and provided the exact conditions people are recommending and ... nothing happened.  Hmmm, I wonder if I should have stratified that little bottle before planting it.  Maybe I'll get a nice, carefree plant if I use a bottle of artificial vanilla flavoring.  No worries about light or humidity - we'll just need to dust now and then.

BUA HA HA!! Try fertilizing the bottle a litte bit, and plant it cap facing down.. thats the key;P

Very funny and creative, I must admit I didnt get it at first... I even smacked my forehead saying Oh god here we go again.. LOL.

I'll post those pics soon! Spent the whole day preparing for huricane Rita :/ Its gonna hit us *blah* one right after the other first Katrina now Rita *sigh* man I love Florida

Take care,

-Jc

 

[Pyro]

I am not going to talk about vanilla any more because I already had my say and it was perfectly relevant.

Re: Heliamphora.

Find me one expert that would say that Heliamphora could be grown outside in GA. You wont'! But I was growing one outdoors in Atlanta for 8 months and the reason it died had nothing to do with conditions and everything to do with the kids from the apartment complex taking it off my patio and playing kickball with it. So, who is wrong? The experts? or was I just hallucinating for 8 months?

Re: Tamlin as an "expert".

Arguably I have known Tamlin longer than anyone on this forum, I was the one who brought him here. The last thing Tamlin would say is that he is an expert and Tamlin never really puts any real weight to what "experts" said because he knows that nothing is set in stone. One example would be Tamlin's D. graminifolia. Fernando is arguably the world expert in S. American Drosera, when he heard Tamlin was growing D. graminifolia basically as a sub-aquatic Fernando told Tamlin that it should not be possible. A little while later Tamlin posted pics of a huge blooming plant and Fernando was awed and said that he never would have thought it possible but the proof was right there. So the "expert" was wrong and Tamlin turned out to be right. This does not mean that Tamlin is now more of an expert than Fernando, it just means that Tamlin was willing to try what the experts said could not be done. FWIW, I have never been able to get my graminifolia to grow Tamlin's way. That said, I have a few that are growing unprotected outside on my deck which is, like the Heliamphora, not supposed to be doable because of the heat.

Re: "Experts" in general

In my experience there are two kinds of experts. Those who say they are the experts and those who say they are not but everyone else says they are. The ones you should listen to more often are the latter. I can think of dozens of names I could toss out here but I am not going to bother because everyone of them would scoff at me calling them an expert. The point is that what really makes someone an expert is not how loud they crow about how great they are but how much other people actually listen to them.

So whoever wants to listen to Dino is welcome to and whoever wants to listen to Sheridan is welcome to and whoever wants to listen to me is welcome to and whoever wants to listen to Juan-Carlos is welcome to and whoever wants to listen to their dog is welcome to and whoever wants to listen to the wind is welcome to. Listen to whoever you want, we all chose our own experts.