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Thread: Heliamphora + utricularia

  1. #9
    Two flies one pitcher. Minus the crap eating. obregon562's Avatar
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    two (long) words: Utricularia humboldtii. SHOWY SHOWY flowers, a very unique seed system (make for a nice little snippet for the museum info plaque), and i believe U. humboldtii and Heliamphora heterodoxa grow together in the wild.

    Maybe keep the heli all by its self as a focal and plant the U. humboldtii in a nice Broncchinia (i know this happens in the wild, a la Barry Rice's book?)?


    Hey Jeff,

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    lambdlth's Avatar
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    Obregon - I have looked all over the internet for U humboltii (for my personal collection) to no avail. They seem to be available everywhere but the US. I believe that U. humboltii and U. quelchii(?) are the only Utrics that I have made a positive connection to Helis in the wild. The museum is on a budget though, therefore I have been seeking more readily available plants.

    Jefforever - You may recall, you are one of the people who nurtured me through the stress of a recently acquired U reniformis (which is leafless again, although the tuber(?) has quadrupled in length and looks very healthy). I actually purchased that plant for this exhibit, but decided to keep it, as it has proven to be really finicky. I thought about U nelumbifolia but feared it might have an erratic growth habit like the reniformis. For all I know, U longifolia has the same habits. I did think longifolia would be an interesting addition to show the diversity of foliage in the Utric family (and that plant definitely has impressive foliage). If it flowered, well, that would be awesome, but I am focussing on the leaf structure, being (I've heard, LOL) these plants can be tricky to flower. By the way, those picture blow my socks off.....amazing!

    Thank you all for your help, if anybody has more to say, please include it. I'm not done till I've heard it all.

    Jeff I will PM you, thank you very much.

  3. #11
    N=R* fs fp ne fl fi fc L Pyro's Avatar
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    Alright, I have a lot to cover here and not a lot of time so I am just going to dive in and I apologize in advance if I come off terse

    Quote Originally Posted by Crissytal View Post
    I don't believe U. longifolia requires a dormancy period to survive long term.
    You are correct, it does not.

    The dormancy is required for flowers.
    In some cases yes in others no. There are at least 4 distinct clones of this species in cultivation. One clone (var. forgettiana) is very free blooming and does not require a rest phase (I do not like the term dormancy cause the plants are never in a state of inactive growth, just slowed growth.) Two of the remaining clones do require this rest phase to consistently flower and the last one is squirrelly, behaving differently in different peoples collections.

    The only problem I see you having with growing a Heli with U. longifolia is that the U. longifolia will take over and fill the pot. This may or may not have an impact on the Heli.
    This will not be much of a problem

    You also may never be able to completely separate the Utric from the Heli when it's time to repot.
    If the goal is to grow them together I doubt this will be a problem either

    Quote Originally Posted by Crissytal View Post
    Yes it would be plenty moist enough for the U. longifolia. I always describe watering this Utric like a Nepenthes, which is moist but not soggy. It can survive in a variety of media types. I have found that for me, in my conditions, it grows best in a mix much like you describe with orchid bark, LFS, maybe some perlite and cypress mulch thrown in. I also have some growing in a peat and sand mix. It seems to grow faster in a more open mix like mentioned above (for me).
    Again, this is going to depend on the clone. Each one seems to have a pretty broad range of tolerances and, while there is a large area of overlap between them all there are still outlier conditions. For example, one clone will happily grow fully submerged while another will rot out under those same conditoins.

    WHAT? It is absolutely not necessary for flowers. At least for my clone.
    As I said above, this depends on the clone.

    But U. nelumbifolia goes really well with helis. I've actually got one with it's tendrils in a helis pitchers, without my help! The tendrils are starting new plants in the heli.. kinda cool.
    Just an FYI, plants growing in Heli pitchers are significantly weaker than those under other conditions. Seems something in the Heli is a bit detrimental

    Quote Originally Posted by Jefforever View Post
    Btw, this utric loves it soggy. It can tolerate dry, but it grows much faster flooded, then drying out a little.
    Again, this depends on the clone. I would avoid making such sweeping statements. It just gets people into trouble

    Many people are just realizing some of these macro utrics can take a lot wetter conditions than people generally expect.

    Here's my proof:
    Remember that U. longifolia is wholly unrelated to the rest of the "macro" Utrics. What it can tolerate and what the Orchidioides and Iperua can tolerate are not the same thing. The only Iperua that is as tolerant as longifolia is nephropylla.

    Quote Originally Posted by obregon562 View Post
    Maybe keep the heli all by its self as a focal and plant the U. humboldtii in a nice Broncchinia (i know this happens in the wild, a la Barry Rice's book?)?
    U. humbo does not really do well in bromeliads. Yes, it will grow in them but it does much better when grown terrestrial.

    Quote Originally Posted by lambdlth View Post
    Obregon - I have looked all over the internet for U humboltii (for my personal collection) to no avail. They seem to be available everywhere but the US.
    They are here in the States, you just have to hunt.

    I believe that U. humboltii and U. quelchii(?) are the only Utrics that I have made a positive connection to Helis in the wild.
    Not quelchii, it really cannot tolerate overly wet conditions. The bromeliad associated Utrics are mostly humbo and nelumbi though reni have also been found in them on rare occasions


    And, just a quick answer for you. Atlanta Botanical has U. longi growing in among the Helies in the highland display greenhouse so you should be fine having the two together in your set up.
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  4. #12
    What is and what should never be Crissytal's Avatar
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    Thanks for clearing that up Pyro. I must have the more difficult one, as it is picky and doesn't flower freely. I had forgotten there was more than one clone; my mistake on that.

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    lambdlth's Avatar
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    Wow - thank you everybody. I am going to dive in and start the grand experiment...although it has been done successfully before, not much of an experiment.

    The humboltii is just too elusive. One day, I'm going to place a massive international order, invest in all the permits and $1,000 later have my $12.00 Humboltii. Wish me luck!!!

    I appreciate everybodies advice, input and education. This is awesome, thankx

  6. #14
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    there is also more than one clone of humboldtii in the states.........and i do believe there is a big difference between the two....
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  7. #15
    N=R* fs fp ne fl fi fc L Pyro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lambdlth View Post
    The humboltii is just too elusive. One day, I'm going to place a massive international order, invest in all the permits and $1,000 later have my $12.00 Humboltii. Wish me luck!!!
    Just an FYI, it is possible to make an order from one of the overseas vendors who carries U. humbo and not need the permits... He has a US distributor for that reason
    'My love was science- specifically biology and, more specifically, when placed in a common jar, which of two organisms would devour the other.'

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