User Tag List

Informational! Informational!:  0
Likes Likes:  0
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 8 of 9

Thread: Sinking Sarracenia seeds

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    1,672
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Sinking Sarracenia seeds

    I noticed today while washing some Sarracenia seeds that the majority floated but a portion of thems sank. Does the sinking of these seeds indicate anything in terms of viability? Similar to testing whether or not an egg is edible by placing it in a glass of water?

  2. #2
    Lucky Greenhorn Lil Stinkpot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    San Jose, CA
    Posts
    2,075
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I may be wrong, but I think that it's about the textured surface. All of the seeds will sink, once you get the air bubbles off the seed surface.

    Like I said, I may be wrong. I should try it out.
    If you shake a rain stick, you get rain. I need a hamata stick.
    My WWWs

  3. #3
    Fred P's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    612
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Never tried that test frenchy.

  4. #4
    Hello, I must be going... Not a Number's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    7,506
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    It has been thought that water plays a role in dispersal of Sarracenia seed as the seeds have a slightly waxy coating. I believe it was Schnell that looked at populations of S. rubra subspecies. At one end of a river are one subspecies - downstream another and in between an intermediate form - with enough distance separating the populations that hybridization was unlikely.

    The school of thought with some is that the seeds have a better chance of stratifying and germinating if you first penetrate the waxy coating.

    Aaron Ellison as I recall scarified Sarracenia seed in a weak acid wash in one study and found no significant difference in the germination rates vs seeds not treated.

    I always soak my seed overnight in water but have never separated them by floaters vs non-floaters. Nor have I paid much attention to the ratio of non-floaters in relation to non-germinators. I'd say that some batches have more floaters than others but my germination rates are typically 85% or better.
    Grand Hotel... always the same. People come, people go. Nothing ever happens.

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    1,672
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Yes you are correct NaN. Don Schnell's book briefly talks about seed dispersal via water method but I will look for the rubra experiment you mentioned. It would absolutely make sense to have these slight variations in a progeny, I just had never noticed this effect before for some reason. I was half a batch for an experiment when I noticed that some sank immediately.
    I did not get an exact count but 80% would sound like a safe number for the number of floaters. This sounds like a future experiment

    LilStinkPot: I think you may be on to something as well. Floating for a while then sinking would have it's benefits in the sense that you could maximize the distance the seed travels then maximize stratification. Neat!

    Fred: Sounds like a future experiment in the works

  6. #6
    Tropical Fish Enthusiast jimscott's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Western New York
    Posts
    18,768
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    In the words of Alex P. Keaton, "This is not a problem".

  7. #7
    Hello, I must be going... Not a Number's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    7,506
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I've had seed batches where less than 20% floated and still got >=85% germination out of them. It might depend on the species and the environments they are adapted to. Or age of the seed or who knows what.

    If you want to look at it another way the ones that sink have a higher chance of germinating since they will definitely absorb the water needed to stratify properly. In the scheme of things the seeds that disperse may end up in conditions that are not favorable for the survival of the species. Therefore it would have survival value for some of the seed to remain in the same area.

    But don't let that discourage any experimentation.
    Grand Hotel... always the same. People come, people go. Nothing ever happens.

  8. #8

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    1,672
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Not a Number View Post

    If you want to look at it another way the ones that sink have a higher chance of germinating since they will definitely absorb the water needed to stratify properly. In the scheme of things the seeds that disperse may end up in conditions that are not favorable for the survival of the species. Therefore it would have survival value for some of the seed to remain in the same area.

    But don't let that discourage any experimentation.

    That's another explanation I really like and sounds very very plausible. Getting an appropriate setup to test this should prove.......fun. It'll be a while before I take this up though...

    I am surprised there hasn't research on this topic before, I'm sure it would apply to a larger spectrum than just Sarracenia. Time to put that JSTOR account to work!

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Seeds, Seeds lots of Seeds (Sarracenia) winner Captain Hamata $30
    By Ozzy in forum 2008 NASC Benefit Auction
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 07-07-2008, 04:37 PM
  2. Sarracenia seeds
    By NeciFiX in forum Pitcher Plants: (Sarracenia, Heliamphora, Darlingtonia, Cephalotus)
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 04-27-2008, 07:56 PM
  3. Sarracenia seeds
    By little Nices in forum Carnivorous Plant Trading Post
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-03-2006, 09:29 AM
  4. I have sarracenia seeds that i don't want
    By bowhunter in forum Carnivorous Plant Trading Post
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 03-11-2005, 03:30 PM
  5. Sinking lids
    By Clint in forum Tropical Pitcher Plants  (Nepenthes)
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 07-19-2004, 02:49 AM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •