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Heliamphora and Cephalotus in the same Terrarium?

As I am thinking about moving my Heliamphora and Cephalotus in to terrarium, can they be in the same terrarium? I am pretty new to both, so bare with me.

Are not their temperature and humidity requirements different for both?
Also Helis can sit in small amounts of water, but Ceph. do not like it?
My orchid shelve where I want to put the terrarium is usually around 80f in the day and 70f at night, I know it would be hotter in the terrarium. Would that be a big problem for the Heli?

Although as summer ends here in the USA would be me cooler, as I keep my house 65-70'f in the Winter.

Also what else would be happy on a terrarium? I also have Nethenpes, Sundews, VFTs, sarracenia and butterworts.

I appreciate ALL of the help!
Steve
 
I grow all my nepenthes, helis, and cephs in the same HL growchamber and they do well, temps are 80F day and 65F night this time of year, and 65F day and 45F night in the winter...humidity is 80%.

The temps you mentioned are probably too warm for the heli...at least in the terrarium.
 
@steve: you're going to have to figure out whether you will be able to grow cephs and helis in the same tank. i have tried doing this in the past. i tried and i failed. my conditions proved too wet for the cephalotus which severely set back its growth....

as you can see, what is possible with one grower, may prove disastrous to another...
 
I'm a fan of just dumping plants wherever and having them make due, but honestly helis like higher humidity and I hear really high humidity is bad for cephs because they get crown rot. Seems like it might come down to either scorched heli nectar spoons but happy cephs, or happy helis and the constant fear of killing your cephs. Otherwise, mine got the same amount of light and sat in the same amount of water with the same fertilizer mixture in the water. The cephs were in 2 perlite : 1 peat, the helis were in lfs : perlite.
 
I thought Butch was growing Heliamphora and Cephalotus in the same chamber?
 
@NaN: Butch has some magic mojo that causes the vapor from his humidifier to evaporate quickly as it empties the tube. my setup does not do that, and consequently, the mist settles on to the crown of my ceph. apparently wet enough to cause the crown to rot...
 
I've got a Heliamphora minor and a Cephalotus growing right next to each other in my tank. It's a 10-gallon tank under 125watt light. It gets about 85-90 degrees in the day and just under 80 at night.

Both plants are thriving and producing mature traps in this tank for almost a year.
 
What Heliamphora species are you growing Steve? I think the biggest problem you will have is too much humidity for the Cephs. I grow H. Minor and H. Puchella with my Cephalotus on a grow rack and don't do anything to increase humidity.
 
Although I've never grown cephs (or helis), you have to remember what their native climate is like to give them the best chance of success... They're not tropical plants, they're from a pseudo-Mediterranean climate in southwest Australia. Even in the height of summer, their nighttime temperatures typically drop to around 15°C (60°F). Daytime temperatures in the summer are usually about 23°C (73°F), although they can get wicked heat waves too (so high day temps probably wouldn't harm the ceph as long as it cools off at night). The humidity is not high all the time either, except in the winter. During the summer, it's normal to have high humidity at night, but it often drops to less than 50% during the day.

I think optimizing the terrarium for one species would be a disaster for the other, and making a climatic "compromise" might just lead to two plants that survive but don't thrive. Although, it seems like other people on here are making it work, so who knows. If it was my terrarium though, I wouldn't risk it with such expensive species. ???
 
  • #10
What Heliamphora species are you growing Steve? I think the biggest problem you will have is too much humidity for the Cephs. I grow H. Minor and H. Puchella with my Cephalotus on a grow rack and don't do anything to increase humidity.

It's a Heliamphora minor, and I hope to add a few more before Winter here.

Thank you for the advice.
steve
 
  • #11
@NaN: Butch has some magic mojo that causes the vapor from his humidifier to evaporate quickly as it empties the tube. my setup does not do that, and consequently, the mist settles on to the crown of my ceph. apparently wet enough to cause the crown to rot...

It's called airflow...I have it too. :lol:
 
  • #12
Ive grown helis in 40-60% RH and they did very well.....

You can find a happy medium easily enough, I would be more worried with airflow and temps.
Hot and stagnant equals death for both, especially the heli

lol@exo.... you nut
 
  • #13
It's called airflow...I have it too. :lol:

Oh crap - that's something I do not have right now.

But I've been checking out small USB computer fans. Anyone using these instead
of the small 12volt computer fans? Looks easy to sit up especially since I have a few
USB outlet plugs.

Steve
 
  • #15
@steve: egg crate works...especially when water is filled with it....raises the ambient humidity. as for 70F at night, i'd strongly advice you to push your temps down even further. 70F is too warm for these plants at night time. in the wild, the temps go as low as 45F.
 
  • #16
I don't know how this is possible, but I have the following growing next to each other in the same terrarium successfully:

Sarracenia purpurea venosa
Nepenthes ampullaria
Heliamphora minor
Cephalotus

All of them are producing healthy, colorful traps. They are also growing quite quickly too. Well, except for my Cephalotus. I repotted it in fresh soil about two weeks ago and it went into a bit of suspended animation. But now it's starting to grow again (I see the fuzzy grow center sending out new leaves)
 
  • #17
I don't know how this is possible, but I have the following growing next to each other in the same terrarium successfully:

Sarracenia purpurea venosa
Nepenthes ampullaria
Heliamphora minor
Cephalotus

All of them are producing healthy, colorful traps. They are also growing quite quickly too. Well, except for my Cephalotus. I repotted it in fresh soil about two weeks ago and it went into a bit of suspended animation. But now it's starting to grow again (I see the fuzzy grow center sending out new leaves)

now that's a new one... That just doesn't seem at all possible, but if it's working, awesome! The only thing I can think of as far as the plants not doing well is the sarracenia. It may not show any damage and could very well be growing very quickly as well as have very good coloring on it's pitchers, but if it isn't allowed to go dormant in the winters, its lifespan could potentially be shortened. Other than that, I don't see anything else that may be suffering while you can't see any effects. That just seems weird that you're able to grow plants that come from such different climates together, and have them all be healthy, but if you're doing it, then great! :D


Anyways, onto my experience with growing cephs and Helis together...

I don't have too much experience in growing either of these plants, compared to some people on the forum, but I have been growing a Cephalotus Follicularis alongside multiple Heliamphora species, with pretty good results. The Helis I've grown the ceph with, have included Minor, Heterodoxa, Pulchella, Nutans, and Heterodoxa x. Minor. The conditions that I grow mine under are as follows:

Daytime Temp. 75-80F
Nighttime Temp. 65-70F with some nights down closer to 60F
Humidity 70-75% during the day and about 80-85% at night

I have a simple shoplight for lighting, 2 T8 or T5 bulbs (I'll have to check which), each bulb is a 32W "soft white" bulb. I also have a plain old 60W compact fluorescent bulb angled into the terrarium, so that it casts it's light in a wide and even distribution, on most of the plants, which includes my Helis and cephs. I have a humidifier that runs 30min before the lights come on, all day while they're on, and then it turns of 30min after the lights go off. It then comes back on again at 12:00am and 3:30am, for 5min each time. I don't have any cooling fans, but I have lots of air movement in the room with the terrarium, which is provided by a rotating floor fan. I am going to be adding 2 small computer fans so that the ventilation is better in the terrarium, because there is algae starting to grow on the surface of the pots. I figure that if the fans take out enough humidity to really change anything, I can always add more with the humidifier, but if I am not getting enough air circulation, then something needs to be done, hence the fans.

So far, under these growing conditions my ceph is looking very nice, it's still pretty young, so it hasn't developed full colors, but it is a nice green color with some nice darker areas, as well as some nice reds mixed in. The Helis that have been grown with it all seemed to grow pretty well, not as good of color as, for example Butch's Helis, but I only know a few people who can really even come close to his Helis as far as color. All of the Helis grow at a normal growth rate for their species, and have pretty good colors, very nice, soft greens, with some great reds in the mature plants. I did notice that the Helis were a little bit less good looking w hen they had somewhat warmer nights, ~70F, and a little bit lower humidity, 55-65%. After making some changes to my growing area and techniques, they seem to be doing better. I would post pics, but right now my only Helis are divisions that were divided very recently, so they don't look as nice as they otherwise might. My ceph is looking really nice, and I'm actually getting two more, Hummers Giant and Vigorous Clumping, so I'll post pics of those tomorrow, after they arrive. As always, if you have any questions about how I set things up for my terrarium, or about anything, feel free to ask, I'd be glad to share...I don't have too many dark secrets ;)
 
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  • #18
I have been growing cephalotus for 2 years and heliamphora minor for 4 months. I grow both indoor under the same conditions:

RH low 30s to high 60s
Temp high 60s to low 90s
Lighting 2*2ft T5 6500k 7 inches above plants.

I do not grow these in a terrarium. Cephalotus can definitely be grown in RH of 35-50 and temps of 75-85 for at least 3 months in my experience. Even though I have only been growing the heliamphora minor in these summer conditions for a few months I'm positive they can be grown with the cephs year round.
 
  • #19
Im late i know.

I grow 10+ heliamphora minor, 3 heliamphora pulchella and 2 big cephs in the same terra.
The nights temp is 15C, day 23C.
Its perfect for ceph, and heli.
I have 90% RH. And i think its great for ceph too.
But you have to be logic. If you grow your cephalotus at 90%RH, water the ceph like a nepenthes. No standing water. And always put your ceph on a little hill made with soil in the pot. This will add some air to the roots/crown. You can add more air to the roots by shaking the water bottle before watering the plant.


Maiden
 
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