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Thread: Only Moderately Temperate Sarrs: Your Thoughts

  1. #9
    A leuco by any other name would still be as gluttonous. CorneliusSchrute's Avatar
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    I should clarify I am only speaking in regards to the warmer growing species mentioned in the original post.
    Corey Bennett

    My cultivated vegetation, carnivorous and otherwise...

    Formerly cbennett4041

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    scottychaos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbennett4041 View Post
    Thanks for your response, too, Scot. I have read your blog, particularly your extended post about dormancy. Good reading!

    I did have a thought while perusing your reply. I thought I remembered reading somewhere that colder temps play a part in triggering dormancy for Sarracenia, but reduced light is what keeps them there. In other words, it was my understanding that a few cold nights (with the reduced photo period) began dormancy, but warm snaps during winter don't necessarily break or interrupt a plants hibernation. Instead, it is the increase in daylight hours in the spring that wake up these sleeping beauties. If this is true, then a letting plants "feel" a few cold nights in the fall would get them to sleep, and then a cooler window sill should be fine to keep them dormant.

    Thoughts? I might have just made all of that up subconsciously. :S
    I believe it is a combination of light and cold..you need both to start, and to end dormancy..

    it was my understanding that a few cold nights (with the reduced photo period) began dormancy,
    It's a lot more than "a few"!
    Humans have a 24 hour wake/sleep cycle..
    plants have a year-long growing/dormancy cycle..

    Dormancy is triggered by 4 months of slowly decreasing photoperiod, and slowly decreasing temps..
    Light levels begin to decrease in late June, Summer Solstice,
    and temps gradually decrease through all of September and October..
    For Sarrs and VFT's, they are usually fully dormant by the beginning of November..
    but they *need* those several months to slowly go dormant..it's not a quick process..

    The process of "going dormant" happens through the entire months of July, August, September and October..
    With September and October probably being the most important months..
    So it could be considered a 4-month process (for light decreasing)..
    but its certainty a 2-month process at the minimum. (for both light and temp decreasing)
    It takes a lot more than "a few days" of cool temps to do it..

    If this is true, then a letting plants "feel" a few cold nights in the fall would get them to sleep, and then a cooler window sill should be fine to keep them dormant.
    No, wrong..because:
    1. As I said, it takes much more than a few cold nights to trigger dormancy..
    2. increased light in the Spring is a factor for coming out dormancy, but its not the *only* factor..warm temps play a part too..

    Think of spring bulbs..daffodils, crocus, etc..Many years they can pop up "early"..What triggers an early appearance?
    early warm temps..not the light.
    One or two warm days in January wont do it..it takes at least a week or two..
    but bulbs can sprout in February, or April, depending on if the Spring warmth is "early" or "late"..
    So temp is definitely a factor, in addition to light..
    I believe both are equally important..

    If you did this:
    If this is true, then a letting plants "feel" a few cold nights in the fall would get them to sleep, and then a cooler window sill should be fine to keep them dormant.
    They wouldnt go dormant at all..because its not enough time to trigger dormancy.
    and if they *were* dormant, say from being outside Aug-Sep-Oct, then warm temps indoors could bring them out of dormancy far too early..

    Plants need that yearly cycle..
    Spring - temps slowly and gradually increase and light slowly and gradually increases, brings plants of dormancy..the process takes months.
    Summer - Plants are actively growing.
    Autumn - temps slowly and gradually decrease and light slowly and gradually decreases, puts plants into dormancy..the process takes months.
    Winter - Cool temps and low light keep plants dormant..

    There are no shortcuts.
    plants are designed to work under this year-long cycle..

    Scot

  3. #11
    A leuco by any other name would still be as gluttonous. CorneliusSchrute's Avatar
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    Good points on all accounts, Scot. I guess I was just curious how strictly the the few in question adhere to the rules of nature.

    Since my montana purp and rosea were just recently obtained (came in the mail a few days ago), I think I will let them both acclimate for a few days on the window sill. I figure the rules mentioned above might be thrown a curve ball if the roots aren't acclimated yet. After a brief acclimation I will put the montana outside. I think I am going to risk it with the rosea and let him live inside this year. I remember reading on Barry Rice's site that some have had luck growing them in terraria indefinitely.

    Thanks folks! *fingers crossed*
    Corey Bennett

    My cultivated vegetation, carnivorous and otherwise...

    Formerly cbennett4041

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    Maybe this will help. I live in Zone 7b and I keep my Sarracenias outdoors all year, no protection. None needed, they are fine in Zone 7 outdoors. Granted, I don't have very many. My only concern would be plants in pots with no protection when a cold snap moves through. A few years back we got to -22F here, and it stayed below freezing for over a week. Another problem we have is some of our winters are very mild where we will have days around 70F in December and early January, but that doesn't happen often. Those things are not the norm, they happen very infrequently. The average lows / highs in Zone 7 are pretty good for Sarracenia throughout winter. I believe what Scot was saying in the post above mine, and I agree, is it's best to leave them outdoors all year so they can experience the normal temp and light cycles that they would in nature, and doing so will ensure their health. Bringing them inside and out again will throw their natural cycle off balance, bringing them out of dormancy too early and eventually could lead to their deaths but for sure will lead to poor health.

  5. #13
    A leuco by any other name would still be as gluttonous. CorneliusSchrute's Avatar
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    Hmmm.. All of mine are in pots. Would the collective you keep a freshly shipped and potted Sarr outside as well?
    Corey Bennett

    My cultivated vegetation, carnivorous and otherwise...

    Formerly cbennett4041

  6. #14
    A leuco by any other name would still be as gluttonous. CorneliusSchrute's Avatar
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    It dawns on me that I should explain my greenhouse, too. It is one of those cheap instant tents that is about six feet by six feet. I leave the door and window plastic off thus having a steady breeze and air exchange. Also, j keep a shade cover on it to prevent excessive heat build up.

    As such, my "greenhouse" mostly just buffers from the really bad stuff.

    For what it is worth, we had a day in the sixties this week and the tent barely made it up to the mid seventies.
    Corey Bennett

    My cultivated vegetation, carnivorous and otherwise...

    Formerly cbennett4041

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    scottychaos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbennett4041 View Post
    Hmmm.. All of mine are in pots. Would the collective you keep a freshly shipped and potted Sarr outside as well?
    Depends on who you bought it from, and where and how it has been living for the past year or so..

    If its a "death cube" type plant from a garden center, then its a recent tissue culture plant, and it really has no idea what season it is..
    It has probably been growing indoors all of its life so far, in weak light and warmth..so it "thinks" its currently living in a warm cloudy summer..
    In that case, this time of year (late October), putting it outside would be a shock..
    it should be nearly fully dormant right now, but it isnt, because its been growing indoors..its not ready for winter right now.
    In that case, leave it indoors for this winter, then put it outside in the Spring..
    It will then have a full Spring/Summer/Autumn to re-set its internal clock, and it will be ready for a proper dormancy next winter.

    If its a plant you just bought from an actual reputable CP nursery, then it has probably been growing outside all of this year..
    In which case it "knows" what season it is right now, and should be just about dormant already..
    In that case, keeping it outdoors right now would definitely be the right thing to do..

    So..where did you get the plants? and do you know (or can you find out) how they been growing for the past 10 months?

    (just FYI, for future reference, Autumn is the *worst* possible season for buying new Sarrs or VFT's!
    Spring is best, summer is ok..Autumn and winter are bad..
    you want to buy in the Spring just for the reasons we have been discussing..giving your new plant a full growing season
    so it can be properly acclimated for a proper winter dormancy..)

    Scot
    Last edited by scottychaos; 10-27-2013 at 05:24 PM.

  8. #16
    A leuco by any other name would still be as gluttonous. CorneliusSchrute's Avatar
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    I had heard it was best to buy I these plants in the spring, but these were actually swag from a great swap with a member here (thanks, Dan!). They were grown outside and have the seasonal rhythm in step methinks. Our weather is warming up this week, anyway, so I figure I would enjoy the plants inside for a few more nights and then more them outside with my others so they can enjoy a not-so-sudden change.

    Thanks again for the sage guidance, gang!
    Corey Bennett

    My cultivated vegetation, carnivorous and otherwise...

    Formerly cbennett4041

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