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Thread: Poachers

  1. #9
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    i guess people are naturally suspicious.

    besides, word gets around. i believe we all know about a certain nursery who's infamous for poaching and paying people to poach.

  2. #10
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    I guess I should emphsize that there isn't the large scale poaching that used to occur, as recently as, the seventies. Some of the largest importers of poached Sarracenia and flytraps are now the largest producers of tissue cultured cp. This has eliminated the need for poaching. Small-scale plant removal occurs but, not to the complete destruction of the site. Granted some of these sites with jonesii, alabamensis, oreophila, and purp montana are so small that little effort would be needed to remove all the plants.
    Ozzy, I question your comment about oreophila being poached from the Ashville, NC area. I don't know of all the sites but, the nearest oreo site is miles east of Ashville. Now, there are still sites with jonesii and purp montana around Ashville but, they are very difficult to access. I simply think we need to be careful about pointing fingers and pulling the alarm. Things should be in perspective; there is no greater threat to wild cp populations than careless spraying and urbanization. Comparatively, the rest is "nickle and dime." Enough cliches?
    imduff

  3. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]i believe we all know about a certain nursery who's infamous for poaching and paying people to poach.
    I don't... I don't know of anyone or any nursery that poaches/pays poachers.
    I DEFINATELY do NOT want to support poaching!
    and why isn't that nursery punished?
    Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish-Euripides
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  4. #12
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    well then i guess not everyone knows. i'll pm you.

  5. #13
    SirKristoff is a poopiehead Ozzy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]how exaclty do you figure it out? I mean... anybody could just lie (maybe except nurseries) and tell us that they grew it.
    Use your natural instincts of suspicion. Every time you by a plant try to investigate the seller a little. Notice things that may not be obvious. If you see somebody selling alot of full grown plants. If you see plants for sell on ebay by somebody that is not known in the cp community or if they are from a place that cp's grows naturally. If somebody has alot of bare root plants that they need to sell. All of these should raise warning signs. Just look for things that just don't seem right. Even if you visit the greenhouse and see them growing plants, be suspicious. I visited the greenhouse I talked about many times, but his method was to pot them give them a dose of root hormones and extreme light for a while to cause a big growth spurt and to redding the vfts. So I was fooled for a long time, but I saw things that didn't add up. If you even have a question don't buy the plant.
    Or you can always buy from well know suppliers like ********** and you'll never have to worry about it.


    I agree that poaching is not even a fraction of the threat of development but it still exists and it is still a problem. Check out Barry's website sarracenia.com.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]Ozzy, I question your comment about oreophila being poached from the Ashville, NC area. I don't know of all the sites but, the nearest oreo site is miles east of Ashville.
    When I said local it was meant to be a relative term. There are well documented locations near the NC/GA state line. Asheville is about 50 miles north east from the documented locations. I can't say that these location are the ones that the ranger was telling me about. I didn't ask. I don't know very much about oreo locations but I don't know any locations that are east of Asheville.

    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]I simply think we need to be careful about pointing fingers and pulling the alarm. Things should be in perspective; there is no greater threat to wild cp populations than careless spraying and urbanization. Comparatively, the rest is "nickle and dime."
    I think we should not turn a blind eye to any threats that face cp's. We should be putting most of our efforts towards saving locations and location material. But we should still fight the poaching problems.
    Until you see the damage that poaching does please don't say that it's so small that we need not worry about it. I know of poaching operations that are so big it not only makes a good living for the owner but it employs 4 or five other people. Thats alot of plants that have to be dug up and sold at $2.50 a plant.
    When you walk out into a field and see 200 holes where vft's use to be, then you can tell me how big a problem poaching is or isn't.

  6. #14

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    Poaching vs. collecting is another interesting angle on this topic. Where is the line drawn between collecting for 'science' and poaching come in. Remember some of our most prized plants were 'collected', 'Schnell's Ghost', 'Hurricane Creek White', purp venosa luteola and, on and on. A hybrid or cultivar does not come from a collected seed head necessarily but typically a plant must be taken from the wild. There is a picture in Don Schnell's book of his wife in the wild holding a recently 'collected' S. minor. When is this acceptable and when is it not? The NASC's mission, as Bugweed says, is to relive the poaching of location plants, that we can easily do with seeds. The more unsual plants are a different story. I have been actively breeding hybrids for two years for fun and to introduce. I hope to help take the pressure off the wild stands for unsual plants. For course unsual wild forms will always have their mystique and allure. Trading is a great way as well. I have established several trading buddies as of late and greatly increased my collectrion and I have helped them as well. Sharing this hobby is the greatest pleasure to me and that means sharing my plants too.
    I remain a man obsessed with a genus
    Brooks

  7. #15

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    Good points, Brooks. I know some real, true old timers in the cp world, who collected a lot during the seventies. Many of the plants everyone grows here today directly or indirectly came through them. The finest S. mitchelliana I've ever been able to find was selected from a flat of approx. one hundred seedlings raised from collected seed from one of these old timers. If someone has a State granted permit, and permission from the land owner, it's not poaching by legal definition.

    Trent

  8. #16

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    Florida is the only state that I am aware of that actually issues sarracenia collecting permits. Otherwise, a signed permission slip from the landowner is the only "certificate" you need in most states. Does anyone know of any other states that have sarracenia collecting permits?? I would think North Carolina would be in there, but have heard no word.
    45 yrs. growin\'
    Founder NASC

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