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Names! what's in a name?

Joseph Clemens

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Please be careful when using plant names. Since the ICPS is linked to the Carnivorous Plant Database, I often use and frequently recommend this resource whenever accurate/accepted spelling is desired to help avoid any possible confusion.

If you're trying to positively identify a plant with questionable ID, it is usually best to spell your guesses and speculations correctly. This way you avoid any possible confusion. It might not hurt to even give reference to your source, i.e. =>Carnivorous Plant Database.

As an obviously rediculous example of what might happen, consider "Drosera capilensis". It's not Drosera capillaris nor is it Drosera capensis.

Remember that plant names are universal and precise:

Drosera hamiltonii is not the same as Drosera hamiltonnii

Sure, we all make typos, but we should not be indifferent to them by ignoring them. It does not help anyone to ignore obvious mistakes, I doubt if any of us can be 100% correct, 100% of the time.
We should be open to pointing out when we think someone has, for instance, spelled a name wrong. I know how to feel foolish when correcting someone elses mistake and at the same time make another of my own. I have made my share of spelling errors. But I give my thanks to all the people over the years who have helped me to be aware of the ones I make. It has helped me to make fewer. I call all of us to consider being that courteous to one another.
 
oh dear. I better go check my seed lables, make sure I'm thinking of proper plants and all....

oh and I sugest making a little list and taping it were you can see it of the names you use a lot so you don't get screwed up like me all the time lol.


...BTW does anyone know of a sundew that sort of looks like a x-mas tree with the tip cut off, but is actually made up of curving, stacking broad flat leaves that come to a point? I have two of these things growing in with my seedlings and I don't see any dew hairs and I'm totaly new to these things. Anyways, I'm starting to wonder if these things are not really sundews at all o_O
 
I totally agree with this viewpoint. In fact, according to the rules of botanical nomenclature, such errors should automatically be corrected. I feel that the corteous corrections of such errors are part of the learning process, and welcome any corrections to orthogenic errors I may make.

My personal favorite correction is the mis-spelled Drosera "spathulata", which should be "spatulata" :)

Rules of botanical nomenclature are quite specific on this point. The spelling of a species name is determined by the author of the protolouge (literally "first word"), and all subsequent referrals to the species must follow this spelling, even if it is incorrectly spelled at publication.

I will at times correct spellings I notice in posts, and I hope that I don't seem to be abrupt or abrasive in doing so. Another reason is that doing a websearch with a mis-spelled species will produce very little return.

Darcie's idea of making a list to refer back to for correct spelling is an intelligent idea. We all need to work to keep things accurate as possible to counteract the already confused condition of so many collections with misidentified plants, wrongly named and illegitimate species and mis-spelled binomials.
 
Darcie,

What you describe is not a droserae. I have such in various pots of this and that. I can't say what it is, only what it isn't.

Anyone else know what this little guy might be?
 
This suggestion has been made before but I will repeat it again.  Use a word processor that has a built in spelling checker.  Many of them have the capability of adding words to their dictionary.  This makes the addition of plant names easy.  However, it won't catch the mistake of using D. spathulata instead of D. spatulata if at some point in time you posted something about N. spathulata.  This brings up another point.  Proofread your post a couple of times before adding it to the thread.  I have found many errors in my posts this way.  Usually transposed letters and words I left out of a sentence.  After checking the post, Cut and Paste it to the forum Post box.
 
Well, you got me Tamlin, i always use "Spathulata" lol.
 
Spot-on Joseph, I agree as well. The problem IMO stems mainly from the fact that most forum members have little or no formal, biological training, and hence are neither aware of, or in the habit of using Latin binomial nomenclature. I frequently edit mis-spelt plant names on the UK Forum where I am a moderator and have yet to receive a complaint.

It would be nice if capital letters were used correctly as well as spelling. The rule is simple enough, the name of the genus (eg. Drosera should begin with a capital letter, whilst that of the specific epitaph (eg. capensis) should begin with a lower case letter. To be extra picky, all Latin names should be written in italics (or under-lined where italics are not available). To be honest, it's only as result of reading this post (thanks Joseph) that I noticed that there was a button which enabled italics and it is much slower to post using it, so I think we can excuse that one, but everyone should be very careful about spelling when posting plant names.

Cheers

Vic
 
DOH!!
Anyone notice PFT has "Drosera spathulata" in there online catalog? tsk tsk.
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(yeah. Like I'm a spelling wiz. Right. I gotta bridge to sell ya, too)

My favorite Drosera spelling error is mixing up the order of the vowels at then end of D. Aliciae (is that right? Darn it! I can never remember:angry:).
 
"...and all subsequent referrals to the species must follow this spelling, even if it is incorrectly spelled at publication..."

To my knowledge this is not correct, e.g. Nepenthes hamata was first described as Nepenthes hamatus TURNBULL & MIDDLETON (btw. Kurata described it as Nepenthes dentata nom. nud. some weeks later so he lost this "race".)

If you would be entirely correct you have to write it Nepenthes hamata in italic letters.

Not all people are happy with Jan Schlauer's database. He seems to be very fast with including several species into one. Take for excample some pygmae Drosera which are now be listed as subspecies.
I would believe Allen Lowrie that he knows what he describes....

Martin
 
  • #10
Schloaty,

You know I really never noticed that (hmmmm, make note to talk to Phill about this ;-) )!!!!


Martin,

ALthough I am no expert on the ICPN rules, unless things have radically changed since my college years, I do believe I am right regarding protolouge spelling. I'm not familiar with the example you state (i.e. Nepenthes hamatus) but it seems likely this is an orthographic correction. The rules as I understand them state that the first valid publication of the species determines all subsequent spellings of the species name, except in cases or typographical or orthographic error (e.g. where the Latin usage is grammatically incorrect). This rule is retroactive to 1753.

For example, there are some istances where botanists tried to honor certain people by naming species after them. The problem was, they didn't spell these names correctly! By the ICBN rules, the deed could not be undone, and they continue to be misspelled, even today (some honor&#33
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. I find such rules to be entertaining, like a game, so I try to play by the rules. There are so many, that one could spend a lot of good drinking nights trying to internalize it all!

Regarding Dr. Schlauer's data base: I suggest that Dr. Schlauer probably has spent a number of good drinking nights studying this protocol. I wrote to him and posed this question, and will get back to you when I have a reply. I don't necessairly agree with all of Dr. Schlauer's taxonomic opinions either, but the fact is the CP Database affords us the best chance of reasonably discussing these species (a central point of reference), and provides a great resource of type location, initial authorship, previous changes...but it must be accessed through correct spelling of the species name. I think this was why this topic was introduced - it does address a very real need.

The CP Database should be a tool, but not regarded as the final word or utimate authority. I do not believe the author intended that it be taken as such. Taxonomic opinions are always changing with subsequent review. Everyone has their own focus regarding what constitutes a species. The thing I like about Dr. Schlauer's work is that it is there. It is reachable. I wish that Mr. Lowerie would afford us more of his experience, but he apparently doesn't own a computer, and I can't afford his books :)
 
  • #11
Hi Tamlin,

"...The rules as I understand them state that the first valid publication of the species determines all subsequent spellings of the species name, except in cases or typographical or orthographic error..."

You are right, I thought that you ment that all errors can't be corrected.
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"... but the fact is the CP Database affords us the best chance of reasonably discussing these species (a central point of reference), and provides a great resource of type location, initial authorship, previous changes...but it must be accessed through correct spelling of the species name. I think this was why this topic was introduced - it does address a very real need..."

Of course the database is an excellent work and there is nothing comperable at the www. But many people believe that it's the holy bible of carnivorous plants and this is something I don't like.
One man to decide about a species rank or not....

I'm not a taxonomist (I couldn't be farer away from beeing one), so I don't have the knowledge to make any suggestions.
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"... I wish that Mr. Lowerie would afford us more of his experience, but he apparently doesn't own a computer, and I can't afford his books :) ..."

Hmmm, yes, would be time for a new big book including _all_ up to date species from Australia. ;-)
Martin
 
  • #12
Hey Tamlin,
   While your at it, I think "Nepenthes sanguniea" should be "Nepenthes sanguinea."  
 
  • #13
I just now applied the screws to Phillip. To be honest, I sort of forgot previously and he is not to blame, so my humble apologies. Also, I want to say how nice it is for Schloaty not to take offense, since we, errr, just corrected another mis-spelled reference on another post, and he kindly informed us of the continued mis-spelled entries on the catalog page! heh heh.

To make up for it, when we all have our first International Petflytrap Barb-b-que and Plant Exchange Extravaganza, I will present myself to the community to be Pied. Yup, thats what I said: Pied: P-I-E-D defined in Tamlin's First Dictionary as: verb. (from the Old English "pyed"): to be energetically presented with a pie, applied by the "pier" using a throwing motion of the pie (or pye) directly to the face of the pied, with or without prior knowledge or consent of the pied, for the purpose of light humor (or REVENGE). As in: "I pied him" "he was pied" "we shall pie him".


Hmmm, maybe we could raffle off for the chance to be the pier!!! (see above) and donate the thousands of dollars so generated to some good cause. Hey, we could take a poll: to pie or not to pie!!! Go ahead, I dare you, hah!
 
  • #14
Mhmmmmm

I see how it is
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Just talk about me... and not tell me to fix it!
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<grin>

Well, lately even if you HAD told me to fix it, it probably woulnd't have been done so quick.

I'll take care of OUR spelling errors this weekend.

Thanks guys,
Phil
 
  • #15
Dibbs on pier.

Think I earned it....
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