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Thread: My FAVORITE plant

  1. #9

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    Yeah you can. If it's clone 1 its definitely a hybrid. The differences are obvious, and I have spoken with a ton of the "top" people about it (off forum) and the status quo is that clone 1 is a hybrid.
    Z polski y dumny
    Prayer - how to do nothing and still think you're helping.
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  2. #10
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    Until there is hard proof, everything, even the amazing status quo (which I agree with!), is speculation and opinion. Yes there are obvious differences, but when you only have a handful of clones to compare an entire species to that really doesn't amount to much.

    I can't make this any more clear:

    Saying "Clone 1 is definitely a hybrid" is incorrect, because at this point you can NOT prove it.

    Saying "It's my opinion that clone 1 is a hybrid" or "Clone 1 is probably a hybrid" is correct because that is an opinion, not presented as a fact. Until there is good proof that it is a hybrid, everything (on both sides of the argument) is speculation. It doesn't really matter whom you've spoken with, because until they have hard proof about it, all they can give is their opinions.

    You tell me you can say that it is for sure a hybrid, I say that's great show me some hard proof besides saying "it's not quite bulbous enough" or "The peristome is slanted wrong" because not all plants in nature have the same DNA that would cause the base to be a certain measurement of bulbousness or the peristome slanted at the same angle on every plant. It could just be a skinny clone of the real N. clipeata with less peltation that the other plants.

    I agree with you, it probably is a hybrid, but until it is proven you just can't say "It IS a hybrid".

    My argument is about your wording and how you present your opinion not the opinion it's self(which I agree with!)

  3. #11
    Viva La Revolution de Nepenthes! nepenthes369's Avatar
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    Ok, but I'm pretty sure it, as the one I sent you, is because Its pitchers that it produced are completely different from the original clipeata. (sorry don't have pics though and yes I'm sure that, that's going to possible throw out my arguement I guess.)
    Rob

  4. #12
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    Did you read my post? I'm not talking about whether it is or is not pure, I'm talking about how you can't say "it IS" or "It IS NOT" until we have solid proof and so far the proof just is not solid enough.

  5. #13

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    Yeah, you can say it is. You want proof? Look at the holotype. They are extremely dissimilar. This past Sunday I had a chance to look at a mature specimen of clone 1 (aka clip x clip x eymae...its referred to by the hybrid name for a reason). In a mature plant the differences are MUCH more apparent. Have you seen a mature plant? Maybe I can get you a picture to compare with a pure clipeata. The pitchers are much different, but I don't like distinguishing neps on pitcher morphology alone, as they are (to some degree) slightly polymorphic. The most striking differences are in the leaves and internode separation distance. Clipeata never vines...ever. Clone 1 vines with 6" or more between internodes.
    Z polski y dumny
    Prayer - how to do nothing and still think you're helping.
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  6. #14
    Stay chooned in for more! Clint's Avatar
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    I have seen a mature plant. I agree with you, I believe it to be a hybrid (damn what do you want from me? lol) but until it's absolutely positively proven you should say "I believe" or "in my opinion" or "the consensus is" instead of "it is"


    I can't argue that any more lol. That's just my opinion on how you (anyone not just you) should word it. Say whatever you want lol.


    AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!! DAMN YOU N. CLIPEATA CONTROVERSY!

  7. #15

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    I think I'm fine wording it the way I have, as I reckon it has been proven beyond reasonable doubt.

    The only controversy I see with clipeata is it seems some growers of it are keeping silent about their plants and the status of said plants, which kind of bothers me.
    Z polski y dumny
    Prayer - how to do nothing and still think you're helping.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F5aCUNE4Z8
    ^^^Newest vid

  8. #16
    Viva La Revolution de Nepenthes! nepenthes369's Avatar
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    Ahh now i see sorry should've warned everyone that I can be a little slow at times.



    No problemo amigo!

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