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Thread: Basal Harvest Pics

  1. #1
    OMG h8 pings MrFlyTrap2's Avatar
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    Basal Harvest Pics

    Decided to play around with my camera today. Here are the basals I'm currently waiting on rooting:

    This is really my first time trying to root Nepenthes from basals. I used to just let the basals grow... however they just seem to destroy my young plants and keep them in the same states. I have 3 nepenthes for 3 years that are just about the same size as when I got them. They produce basals like crazy but never grow. As a result this year I'm cutting. (and trying to change other things as well) While cutting these, I'm also working on the best methods that work for me.

    One key thing I'm trying to work on is producing stable conditions. (free of humidity drops or sudden dry outs) You'll see me using a 'cup' method for most of these cuttings. So far with good results. All of these cuttings are a month or older.

    First up is, N. Unknown 7, treated with Orthonex for a pest. Leaf burn is present in the basal, but new growth is emerging. Cut on 12-19-08.
    From Basals
    N. Unknown 12, treated with rooting powder.
    From Basals
    N. Unknown 19, treated with Physan 20
    From Basals
    N. muluensis X lowii sitting in more soggy conditions than the rest of the cuttings
    From Basals
    N. Unknown 15 was already growing roots and skipped the cup.
    From Basals
    N. talangensis with rooting powder
    From Basals
    N. Unknown 28, cup not used, and crappy results so far. However new growth does seem to be happening.
    From Basals


    N. Unknown 23 tube method, with a little spag at the bottom. So far good results with new growth.
    From Basals


    N. talangensis (another one)
    From Basals
    My Grow List

    "It is only by studying nature that can we ever hope to defeat it."

  2. #2
    OMG h8 pings MrFlyTrap2's Avatar
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    Follow up to this...

    These are the basals waiting for cutting. While they seem to be a pest at times, they are very cute in how they seem to "hide" under the arm of mom. I'm waiting for sure fire rooting signs from the ones above before these are cut.

    N. Unknown 24
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. spectabilis x ventricosa (I should have cleaned this up before a pic)
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. muluensis X lowii this is another basal from my 3 year old plant. Still as small as the day I got it. Kicking out one basal after another while the main stem suffers. (this one has produded at least 6 basals) I'm trying to break the habit by actually cutting these off this year. In addition I have potted up and tried a new soil mix.
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. Unknown 19
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. Unknown 23
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. Unknown 27
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. Unknown 25
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. Unknown 28
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. Unknown 27
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. Unknown 2, treated with orthenex. Notice the leaf burn... was worried about this one but new growth is fine.
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. ventricosa trying to take over.
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. x lady pauline... ready to cut
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    N. ramispina which is starting to mature and has been under my care for 3 years. First year of making a basal. This plant has grown and totally matured, while the basal factories mentioned before have not.
    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Basals to Harvest


    Thanks!
    Nathan
    My Grow List

    "It is only by studying nature that can we ever hope to defeat it."

  3. #3
    Tony Paroubek's Avatar
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    Interesting thread. I will admit though that I am puzzled as to why you have plants which are not getting larger for years and are kicking out basals. Sounds to me like something isn't right with the plants. They will natually produce basals if the terminal main shoot isn't growing properly. You mention orthenex a couple of times. Perhaps the plants were stressed and the terminal growth points damaged which has caused the basal profusion? Perhaps we can figure out what is going on with the plants that is causing them to take this route.

    Another option you could try is instead of removing the healthy rapidly growing basals and trying to root them would be to remove the main shoot and leave the basal on the full root system already there. With all those roots the basal which is now the main plant will take off with alot of vigor. I also find this is a good way to keep from ending up with my main plant one long brown stem with just a tuft of leaves on top.
    Is that a Nepenthes in your pocket or you just happy to see me?

  4. #4
    OMG h8 pings MrFlyTrap2's Avatar
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    Tony I would love nothing more than your input into this topic. For 90% of the pictures I understand why they are throwing out basals. They are new plants (8 months in my care), most have settled into odd positions which, if a nepenthes grows at an angle, it will make a basal. Some also grew so large after I got them, that their roots really didn't get a chance to ancor themselves to stay upright. However there are a few problem plants.

    The problem plants were never touched by orthenex. For the ones that were, once treated they resumed normal growth immediately. (reflected in the pictures) I'm using orthenex in a can which I guess has another additive than the concentrate. The pest that lead to the use of orthonex was the one shown here. http://www.terraforums.com/forums/sh...439#post912439 This eliminated the pest but ended up as the temporary damage shown.

    Now here are the meat and potatoes that are the current problems.

    N. Spectabilis N. Sumatra Cl 1, 3 year plant. You can see the main stem is just about dead, and the basal has taken over. This is the second time this plant has done this. I repotted this plant just about a month ago once I saw it doing this again.

    From Problems

    N. muluensis X lowii, 3 year plant. This plant just drives me nuts. It grows when it wants to, then just throws 2 - 4 basals at the same time and declines. I repotted this one as well last month.

    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Problems


    Just to show the difference in size, here it is next to same age ramispina.

    Basal Harvest Pics
    From Problems


    There are a few other 'problem' plants that I got from the same vendor. All of these were shipped with cedar mulch. Some people say it works great for them, however I think that's the major problem. Maybe mulch is fine for larger neps, however the ones that stayed in it never advanced for me. I repotted the rami some time ago and it started to grow in size. It took off, grew to the side and is now working on a 'natural' basal. The others never grew enough to really jusify repotting. When I repotted these two, I didn't pull the mulch off, which I somewhat regret. But I'm hoping to pull basals from these two and get them into a new media / new start all together.

    -Nathan
    My Grow List

    "It is only by studying nature that can we ever hope to defeat it."

  5. #5
    SirKristoff's Avatar
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    yeah that same place sent me plants in cedar mulch and are the only "problem" plants ive ever had. repotted them and they are starting to kick up in growth....good luck with the plants Nate, ive gotta do a couple basal cuttings of my N. Talangensis here soon

    also, they sent me more than just plants...
    i got a few little red invertebrate friends...which ive been trying to get out of my plants now for awhile. ill never buy from them again for this freaking reason.

  6. #6
    Tony Paroubek's Avatar
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    Oh gosh where to start.

    Looks like many are just producing basals as the main plant has grown and elongated. I like to remove the main vine just above the basal and repot the root mass into a bigger pot with fresh mix. I also cut off all the old brown woody stem and root the top portions. The other option I have tried is repotting in some fashion to bury the old dried vine. This has been difficult and doesn't always seem to work out all that well for me lol. Especially if there is a basal and I am not wanting to cut it off. It sets the plants back more by removing the main stem but I think in the long run you end up with a larger and more robust plant.

    In regards to potting mix:
    The thing with potting mix and ingredients. What works for one person may not work for another. There are so many factors that can vary from one grower to another which all have an effect on how well a certain potting mix will perform. I think the key to becoming a superstar Nepenthes grower is to experiment and develop a mix which works best for the plants in your care. I think that anytime someone receives a new plant they should repot it immediately into a mix they have formulated themselves through trial and error. The benefits to fresh familiar potting mix will far outweigh the very minor setback caused by careful repotting.

    Deffinately some interesting things going on with a few of your plants but as to the cause it is unclear to me. I have never tried cedar mulch so have no opinion on it. Cedar does have compounds in it though which are toxic to some organisms.. which is why it doesn't rot easily and repells moths etc... Could it be bad for Nepenthes in some cicumstances? Beats me.. I am less inclined to believe it is a root/potting mix problem though if the main growth point is doing so poorly but yet the plant is able to start a nice healthy vigorous basal shoot. This doesn't make sense to me. I would look more specifically as to what may be causing the main shoot to grow so poorly in the first place. Culture conditions? Pest or Disease? Physical/Chemical damage?
    Is that a Nepenthes in your pocket or you just happy to see me?

  7. #7
    Jimmy's Avatar
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    You know, Nathan, I'll be glad to take those plants off your hands and see what the problem is...

    My experience with orchid bark: I have potted a N. ventricosa and N. burbidgeae into mixes that were largely orchid bark...The N. ventricosa does not grow its leaves much bigger (but produces larger pitchers) while the N. burbidgeae has a leaf-development problem, and the pitcher buds burn out. Every time I flush their pots, the water is brown and leaves an algae-like residue on the pot where the water usually stands in the shallow dish. I replaced a majority of the bark in those pots today with a large portion of sphagnum, and I found that the damp/wet pieces of bark had that same residue, only concentrated and darker brown than the water. So, I think that bark has its place in Nepenthes mixes, but it should not be the vast majority of the soil mix.

    Oh, and I'm 99% sure that your "N. unknown 24" is a N. ventricosa...Did you get it from Lowes or a garden center?
    "I'm just a scientist without the proper documentation."

    My Growlist: http://www.terraforums.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=113724

  8. #8
    OMG h8 pings MrFlyTrap2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Paroubek View Post
    Oh gosh where to start.
    lol it's not that bad is it?

    It sets the plants back more by removing the main stem but I think in the long run you end up with a larger and more robust plant.
    That's what I'll be doing with a few of these neps. Especially with the ones that decided to grow at an angle.

    I think the key to becoming a superstar Nepenthes grower is to experiment and develop a mix which works best for the plants in your care.
    I'm starting to see the light with that statement. For the first year or so I was so worried about how to make the right mix. Worried to the point of not trying to repot some plants when they really needed it. This year I'm going to try a few different mixes, and in addition giving the plan the room that it needs. And in addition to that, trying to understand if Nep X is happier in mix A or B.

    I would look more specifically as to what may be causing the main shoot to grow so poorly in the first place. Culture conditions? Pest or Disease? Physical/Chemical damage?
    This also puzzles me as well. And while getting to the root of the problem, I'm just trying to cross one thing off the list at a time. But it gets really frustrating to find a good source of Disease information for nepenthes. From what I can find, it really just seems to be something a grower learns to identify over time. Until then I'm just left puzzled thinking, is it a light issue, disease issue, or bug problem. Leaves seem to end up looking troubled for each of those issues, should it be a problem. So in a way I'm really happy that these basals are showing up. If anything, I'll be able to try different things to the same plant and observe the results. I'm sure for all new growers, including me, it's really difficult to want to try something new to a plant with it's your only one.

    And for the physical damage, I'm not one of those gardners that comes home from the bar and takes it out on the plants. 8P

    Jimmy also gave me an idea on something I should change. Right now I do all my watering via 1/4" tubing coming from my RO unit. I think at least once a month I should give every nep a good soaking, and do more observations. Perhaps trickle watering is building up sedaments and causing problems.

    And Jimmy, all of the unknowns except for a few are from a hybrid grower. They were the 'rejects' of contamination, missing tags, etc. From the way it looks in the photo, it looks very ventricosaish. But a more mature pitcher has a lowii look to it. And I also share your thoughts about bark. I havn't dug any up and looked closely, but the bark I've been buying is just too large imo. As a result it might end up being more of a wall to the root than media. I'm starting to seek out other media types and if I use bark again, I'll have to find a smaller ground variety.

    Great input so far, thanks!
    My Grow List

    "It is only by studying nature that can we ever hope to defeat it."

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