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Thread: Seeds germinating

  1. #9

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    I wondered about the aristocholioides after seeing a small one inch or so plant sell on eBay for a lot of money. I just received my first pod and have laid it out in one of my ex cookie box / greenhouses to germinate. It arrived so quickly that I ordered another of the same one plus a pod of singalana.
    In answer to anyone wanting any of these that I have that do in fact germinate and reach the two inch size, I will probably offer some for free to other collectors when the time comes. I have no interest in turning a hobby into a business which would ruin the hobby aspect for me. Same thing with my classic Honda bike collection, they will all go to my kids when I croak and in the meantime I will continue to have fun restoring and riding them. I made that mistake several years ago by making my 1950's sci-fi & horror movie collection available to others at a price.

  2. #10
    Sphagnum Guru Wire Man's Avatar
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    Yeah, aristolochioides is critically endangered, so I really recommend not ordering any more seeds from that guy of that species. It's been poached pretty badly for the past few years and not much seed has recruited. Technically, it's illegal to collect seeds since it's on the IUCN Red List.

  3. #11
    Whimgrinder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spooky1 View Post
    Unless someone can show proof that eBay seed sellers are breaking the local laws I will continue to collect from them. Now if I ruffle a few feathers or get myself placed on some ***** list or "don't-associate-with-this-guy-list" for speaking my mind that's fine, I don't care. Extremists from the free collecting and conservation camps should be heard but each person has to weigh the evidence and decide for themselves. Eventually a planet killing asteroid will hit Earth and create yet another extinction event and a few million years later intelligent plant life will be getting into trouble for collecting protected human species.
    The "all life on this planet is headed for the celestial trash bin eventually" argument is one that I have a real problem with, since it is ultimately an "Eric Cartmanian" style of rationalization designed to allow a person to do as they please, and damn the consequences. In this case, the big picture time scale view neglects the "will my grandchildren get to know these life forms?" scenario, and that is just as important, if not moreso. I personally do not think we can have these kinds of discussions without factoring in a responsibility to do as little damage while we're here, and leaving as much of the globe's biology intact so that future generations can see, study, and appreciate our living world.

    eBay allows potential buyers to circumvent legal channels to acquire seeds of critically endangered species. If a person chooses to knowingly purchase seeds of a critically endangered species in this manner, then that person is supporting and encouraging the illegal and unethical collection of material. As tempting as it is, I have specifically NOT purchased N. aristolochioides seeds from any of these merchants because I cannot justify the act. That said, I hope you recognize that I am just expressing a personal opinion and in no way am I suggesting that anyone else make the same choices I do. I would add that if anyone does buy seeds of species like N. aristolochioides, that they take that as a serious responsibility to raise and mature the resulting plants and treat them as the truly archival organisms they are, and not just the objects of ones personal (and often fleeting) fascination. It would be a huge insult to decide after a few years that you were bored of the plants and let them die, or just handed them over to someone who really didn't know how to care for them. If you are going to take on the responsibility, then commit to that responsibility. Please.

  4. #12

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    I always pay attention to anyone that challenges my opinion as long as it is done in a thoughtful way like you have.
    You have given me something to think about and I certainly do worry about my grandkids and future progeny having as close to what I had growing up. Maybe being a loner and isolating myself from humanity beyond family is giving me an unchallenged pessimism that I wouldn't have if I was sharing my thoughts with others and getting other viewpoints. I definitely will be altering my attitude towards the seeds I just received and are in the mail on their way here. My germination technique is right on and once the seeds hatch I will be paying special attention to their needs. I guess I won't be giving away any seedlings of this particular species but may PM other concerned collectors and offer to send them free of charge of course. I can't see how spreading them around that way could hurt and if even a single individual was able to produce a new generation of seeds it would be worthwhile. Who knows maybe the seller is a stinker and is sending out mislabeled seeds because he does care about the species survival.
    Thanks for the input!

  5. #13
    mcmcnair's Avatar
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    I agree with points from both spooky and whimgrinder, especially about people buying these seeds and then just getting bored with them and letting them die or giving them away. I have heard of way too many plants like robcantleyii and aristo being given to people and within a few weeks they have killed it because they don't know what they are doing and they just wanted these "cool" plants. Breaks my heart to see this happen but unfortunately it does all the time.
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  6. #14
    Whimgrinder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcmcnair View Post
    I have heard of way too many plants like robcantleyii and aristo being given to people and within a few weeks they have killed it because they don't know what they are doing and they just wanted these "cool" plants. Breaks my heart to see this happen but unfortunately it does all the time.
    Precisely why most semi-serious collectors should limit themselves to acquiring tissue cultured plants, which place absolutely ZERO pressure on in situ populations. If you kill a TC'd specimen of N. aristolochioides that came out of BE's lab, nothing unique has been destroyed. The same cannot be said when someone carelessly acquires a genetically unique plant (or grows collected seeds) and kills it because they cannot provide what it requires. That is why my plants of N. macrophylla, N. villosa, N. hamata, and N. aristolochioides are all from Tissue Culture.

    Please note that the comments in this post are not aimed at anyone in particular, nor do I intend any individuals to feel chided or criticized, they are just a continuation of my expression of personal opinion.

  7. #15
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    Spooky, I hope you don't mind me posting a link to your other recent thread, as I address this thread in it, and many of the talking points cross over between the two. I didn't realize that while I was addressing the topic in your 'human population' thread that Whimgrinder was covering much of the same ground here! Lol. Good discussion people! I'm glad to see it has stayed respectfull
    Cheers

    Here's the link: http://www.terraforums.com/forums/sh...23#post1105923

    Spooky, I hope you can feel comfortable having us on the forum to talk to
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  8. #16
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    It is always a good idea to check your sources before you buy anything, and make sure that if you buy something, it's not harming populations and that you have the proper grow area for the plants. I've dealt with the sellers mentioned here in this thread, all three, and I have to agree with some other users that ones like nepenthaceae aren't exactly the best sources around. Looking at the dates of the seed collections, over half of them are going to be dead seeds, collected many months ago, and another 30% aren't date labeled at all. The other two sellers, I can say are reputable, and though he hasn't posted publicly his processes for a while, **************** does his collecting in a more conservative way, collecting very few amounts of seeds at a time from private land he has access to.
    I'll admit I have bought seeds from the latter, some of rarer species, and am happy to say most are germinating and doing well. These plants I plan to keep with me for a while to make sure they grow properly, and while I will have many that I don't have room for, I plan to try selling or giving them away to those who know what they're doing as well, as these plants could now be critical for keeping variability and therefore interest in cultivated plants only.
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