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Thread: NEPENTHES IZUMIAE IS LIVING WITH ME!!

  1. #9
    swords's Avatar
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    Nobody's naming names or anything (contact gus for the name and details by PM if you like). But the source of his plant has tons of great species, it's just that most of them are not listed as being large and for sale. Now that I know I have proper conditions I would be more than happy to begin buying cuttings from large plants, you just can't find em very often... He's lucky (and I'm jealous)!

    This source of his plant does make some of their own very nice hybrids (such as the N. aristolochioides x thorelii). But my real desire is to make my own hybrids with my species plants, not grow other peoples hybrids!

  2. #10
    Nepenthes Specialist nepenthes gracilis's Avatar
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    I don't think that rule has come into effect quite yet nate. But i belive it is coming soon.

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    Hi everybody:

    I just want to say that here in Australia, i am dying to get a nep jacquelinae, Nep platychila, and a couple of other types. but nobody has them. It is the same story with you for other species that we have in Australia. So Swords, please don't feel like that. Instead of wasting energy in thinking when to get a new species i think we should all unite and try to break the red tape when it comes to phytosanitary certificates, import permits and all the other trash that we have to go through. I understand that some permits must be obtained to protect the environment as well as unique species, but again, some governments go out of their way and over enforce their laws. As a result we have people like me longing for a jacquelinae or a platychila and people like Josh longing for an Izumiae. I hope you all understand where i am coming from.

    Gus

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    swords's Avatar
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    Yes, the CITES rules do make things a hassle (and more expensive) for hobbyists. Even more harrying for orchid and Nepenthes botanists who must try to obtain scientific CITES permits so they may legally transport botanical sheets of unknown/unnamed species or else figure out a way to "break the red tape" in another sense.

    As for rallying together to get the CITES laws changed, for either independent sceintists, hobbyists or nurseries... you might have a better chance ressurecting Ben Franklin and teaching him how to send email! These laws were created by lawyers and based on 19th century collecting practices. Not based on the conservational botanists of today who take selected pieces (seed) or one example of an entre community for study and getting the species into captivity. These days it is very unlikely that any botanists are hiking through the rainforests wth chainsaws, felling an entire area of forest to 'hide' the location of a rare species of orchid or Nepenthes (as was common 100-200 years ago).

    CITES laws were/are backed by several politically powerful botanical and zoological societies who have their own ways of "breaking the red tape". Any researcher can tell you there are certain institutions who are free to trade hassle free in any species whereas if one of "us" (meaning hobbyists or independent botanists) were to try the same thing we would at the least loose our shipment. Recieve a huge fine and possibly risk a raid and confiscation of our collections (provided your collection is not documented with receipts and invoices for all your CITES protected species).

    I don't like paying the paperwork fees but it beats the alternative. Just one bust on a single shipment of even one plant (even a dead dried one) can open a whole can of worms with the customs and wildlife departments. That kind of bust can dog you for a long time-not to mention make yourself a headline story in the newspapers! From what I've read on breaking CITES laws, I'm pretty surprised at the USDA and US Fish & Wildlife Dept. for not revoking Griffins import permit and possibly confiscating whatever undocumented CITES listed species he has in his collection.

  5. #13

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    Dear Josh:

    I agree with you 300%. However, let's not give up. There must be away to change those rules. They can't stay there forever!!. Next major CITES conference, I am willing to write a letter of complaint. If anybody wants to join in, please let me know.

    Gus

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    There's big time nurseries around the world who agree with these points concerning CITES and plant regulation. The beaurocrats want to make it even tougher, and there are lobby groups working against this. There is an attempt to stop all trade of certain plants, including orchids, and the American Orchid Society has successfully lobbied on behalf of all orchid growers. It's international politics and requires lots of money and lawyers.

    Trent

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] ]i think we should all unite and try to break the red tape when it comes to phytosanitary certificates, import permits and all the other trash that we have to go through. I understand that some permits must be obtained to protect the environment as well as unique species, but again, some governments go out of their way and over enforce their laws.
    For a start, CITES and phytosanitary certs are nothing to do wth each other.

    Phytosanitary certificates are to certify that the plant that you are buying is in good health. If you don't care enough about your country that you are willing to introduce new diseases to save yourself a few $$ then there's nothing I can do to change your attitude. What I can do is point out that if you try looking it from a purely selfish point of view (and I'm going to bite my tongue here) you are also getting a guarantee that the plants you are buying are healthy before you see them for yourself so you won't receive them and have them die on you from some disease a few days later.

    The theory behind CITES is also sound. A few months ago I was literally wading through a field of Paphs on a mountain in Sumatra, what was to stop me stuffing them all into my bag and then flogging them on the net once I got them all home? Locally I wouldn't get anything for them and no one overseas could buy them because of CITES restrictions.
    I agree that in some cases the implementatrion leaves a lot to be desired but until a better alternative comes along it's the best thing we've got in place and I for one am happy to see it there for the moment.

    Cheers, Troy.

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    the only thing i would like is a easyer way to obtain these forms and certificates. Zongyi
    What you want to do is illeagle here in Canada.
    Email does not work! Use PM or yangzongyi@hotmail.com instead.

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