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Terrarium vs. windowsill

  • #21
I like windowsills personally. Assuming those are my only two choices. It allows the plants to grow to their full size, where the terrarium may not be large enough. Also, sometimes terrariums may have a problem with stagnant air, i'm not sure about this, but it seems to me like it would be a problem. Besides, most highland Neps, sarracenia, flytraps, many butterworts, bladderwors, aldrovanda, many drosera and more all do well on windowsills. I have highland neps, sarracenia, dionaea, and a butterwort doing very well on a windowsill. My friend Andrew has a few bladderworts, butterworts, and a N. Morganiana on his windowsill. Morganiana is a lowlander by the way. So like windowsills best since most cp's can grow there anyway, they have better air circulation, and they provide plenty of room.
 
  • #22
Besides, it's pretty cool when your Nepenthes hand pitchers down to the floor from a table two feet high. My N. Ventrata is almost there.
 
  • #23
Actually if we are speaking of Cp's in general, Dionaea's, most sun loving drosera, and others would do better outside.  Especially Sarracenia's and Dionaea's.  An outdoor grown dionaea can outgrow a windsill/terrainium dionae plant anyday.  So mainly, I think it depends on what type of Cp, some do better w/o competition and vice versa.

Sorry AE, I took it the wrong way
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  • #24
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Phyrex @ Nov. 14 2004,4:33)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Starman @ Nov. 14 2004,2:04)]Sure, the plants will look brillaint, but change the terrarium climate and they will sulk and start to wither.
Windowsill plants are a lot tougher,a nd will take season changing with a grain of salt.
Yes they will be tougher but will only survive on the windowsill if they are easy plants in the first place.

You can’t place a villosa on a windowsill and expect it to do well over time.
The plants have had millions of years of evolution to get accustomed with the climate they have evolved in. This won’t change in a few months on a windowsill of course.
Strange that, I have a Heliamphora which is thriving on my windowsill, and yet, everyone says I cant grow it on a windowsill. How some its thriving and looks as good, if not better then a terrarium grown one?
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Actually, I have hard and easy plants, every single one is thriving on the window.
 
  • #25
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Starman @ Nov. 15 2004,4:50)]I have a Heliamphora which is thriving on my windowsill, and yet, everyone says I cant grow it on a windowsill. How some its thriving and looks as good, if not better then a terrarium grown one?  
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For the sake of debate..I am quoting Dino but this really could apply to just about everyone

If I recall when you got the plants people suggested you use a terrarium because for most people their windowsill conditions are not suitable for tender plants such as Heliamphora. Does this mean you can't grow it on a windowsill? No, because everyones windowsill is different. It's nearly impossible for me to know exactly what your conditions are within your windowsills. There are simply too many factors involved that I have no knowledge of. A terrarium however has certain atributes which remove alot of the unknowns. Such as increased humidity and moisture and more stable temperature. The reason to suggest a terrarium is because conditions from grower to grower are MORE SIMILAR in a terrarium.

As for your other comment that it looks as good if not better than a terrarium grown one.

How do you know? Maybe if you had an optimum terrarium your plant would look even better than it does now.

The bottom line is how the plants look to you. Are they healthy, growing normally, growing well, and increasing in size and color over time. Do they look comparable to the same type of plants from other excellent growers? Do you attempt to tweak the environment to improve upon the plant and make careful observations for the results? All we have to go on when growing a new plant for the first time is knowledge of how the plant grows in nature and what other people with practical experience have found in cultivation. It's up to us to then use this as a starting point for our own personal attempt at cultivation.


Tony
 
  • #26
Dino, like Tony said, how would you know your plants grow better on a windowsill instead of a terrarium?
This topic is about which environment is better not which environment is “good enough for you”.
Of course this differs a lot from person to person but in general a terrarium has a more stable environment because you can control every little thing.
 
  • #27
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Phyrex @ Nov. 15 2004,8:09)]Dino, like Tony said, how would you know your plants grow better on a windowsill instead of a terrarium?
This topic is about which environment is better not which environment is “good enough for you”.
Of course this differs a lot from person to person but in general a terrarium has a more stable environment because you can control every little thing.
Because I have seen terrarium grown Helis.
 
  • #28
Well Dino you seem to have completely missed the point. Who's terrarium grown plants were you comparing to? It is very easy to grow lousy plants in a terrarium. It is even easier to grow them lousy on a windowsill because a windowsill you can't control the environment as well. That said it is EASIER to grow excellent plants in a terrarium because you CAN have easier and more control over the environment.

I think Matthias would have something to say about windowsill vs terrarium grown Heliamphora. He has a special terrarium just for this genus and they are the best examples of Heliamphora I have ever seen. I have never seen one grown on a windowsill even come close to the color and impecable health.
Here is a picture of several plants in his special terrarium:
131_3149.jpg

If you would like to visit his website Matthias

Tony
 
  • #29
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Tony Paroubek @ Nov. 15 2004,10:13)]... and they are the best examples of Heliamphora I have ever seen.
Word!
He’s the Heliam master.
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By the way, about terrariums, it also matters a lot what size it is. I mean a small terrarium is a lot less stable than a large one.
And a windowsill with a radiator underneath it for example will have very low humidity making it less suitable for Neps in general. But my windowsill is in a room where this heating is off...
There are just too many factors to compare the two but like Tony said, in general the terrarium is way more versatile.
 
  • #30
Also, If I can recall Starman, you were growing one of the hybrid heli's which is not the hardest to grow. If you were growing a harder one, I'm sure it'll be harder to grow on a windsill.
 
  • #31
Nice to hear my name in context with growing Heliamphora.
Maybe it's possible to grow some easier hybrids of Heliamphora on a windowsill but I have never tried it.
If you want a plant which does not only survive but also get the typical features and colours you need
to place it under high light levels in a humid but still cool environment. I doubt that these conditions are
possible on a windowsill.
It took me some time to find the right place and the equipment to get the best way for growing these
plants indoors which unfortunately is also not the cheapest way.

Here is a recent shot of my Heliamphora folliculata from the Murosipan Tepui...

H_folliculata_Murosipan.jpg


Cheers,
Matthias
 
  • #32
[b said:
Quote[/b] (peter @ Nov. 15 2004,3:20)]Also, If I can recall Starman, you were growing one of the hybrid heli's which is not the hardest to grow.  If you were growing a harder one, I'm sure it'll be harder to grow on a windsill.
.....................so?
A Helaimphora is a Heliapmphora, peole were saying I might as well put it int he trash whent hey heard it was geting placed on the window.
Look at my growlist on CPUK.
ALL of the plants I have are window grown.
 
  • #33
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Starman @ Nov. 15 2004,4:53)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] (peter @ Nov. 15 2004,3:20)]Also, If I can recall Starman, you were growing one of the hybrid heli's which is not the hardest to grow.  If you were growing a harder one, I'm sure it'll be harder to grow on a windsill.
.....................so?
A Helaimphora is a Heliapmphora,
Ugh, that's like saying a N. ventrata is like a N. villosa.
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It's very nice you can grow them on a windowsill Starman, but in general, for most people this isn't the case...

Oh and Matthias, one of these days I'm gonna start collecting Heliams just because of your wonderful pictures. But I don't know if I must blame or thank you then.
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  • #34
Your very stubborn Dino...

Didn't you also kill one? If I recall people were not saying you might as well put it in the trash. What they were saying is that odds are it will do better in a terrarium. Why did they say that?? Perhaps because noone but you knows exactly what your windowsill is like while it is much easier to know what the conditions are inside a terrarium regardless of who has it. A proper terrarium will have less temperature fluctuation, less humidity fluctuation, a higher relative humidity. Conditions that favor better growth. Perhaps they were saying it because they have tried Heliamphora on a windowsill and failed or were unhappy with the results even if the plant didn't outright die. You have seen Matthias's plants that were grown in a terrarium designed for Heliamphora. You say they do better on a windowsill because you have seen terrarium plants that didn't look as good as yours. Well? How does yours compare to one properly grown in a terrarium? Post some pics! Lets have a look.

Tony

Ps the discussion wasn't about whether it was possible to grow them or not.. but which would give the best results. Plants will grow even under adverse conditions but can you claim that they are growing to their maximum health then? No...surviving maybe.
 
  • #35
I agree with Caps on the lighting part. My(his...hehehe I still can't adopt it completely)is still producing leaves but the pitcher growth has screeched to a halt. I wonder if those little tendrils will just fall off or if they seriously think they can wait it out till next spring...or until I try some growlights.
 
  • #36
Hey Folks,
Loved the pics of Matthias' Helios. They look great. However, I grow all of my Heliamphora outdoors yearround. They're doing awesome but don't look as nice as Matthias'. That's because the weather, pests and other things take their toll. Nature does that. I think the main point I get from all this discussion depends on the growers' location, space, time and passion they want to put into their collection. I've had Neps like truncata grow great as windowsill plants but got over 3 ft tall and I couldn't house them in a terrarium anymore. Others like bical did great in a terrarium but struggle as a windowsill specimen but still look good to me even though I know they will never be as robust as terrarium bicals. My outdoor Neps never look like greenhouse Neps because wind, winter, sunlight etc. interfere with "optimum artificial" conditions. But if you live in an apartment and the best you can do is a terrarium and put your money into your environment, then your plants should do well. So really to me it's a matter of the time and conviction the grower has devoted to their plants that makes the big difference. If you have the devotion to your hobby or obsession (that's my problem) then terrariums, windowsills, or whatever will make your plants do well for you and you will appreciate them even more for all your hard work!

Joel
 
  • #37
Awesome responses, really helpful. Awesome heli's Matthias makes me kinda jelous
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What i originally wanted to see was people's thoughts on terrariums vs windowsills. The argument was that a terrarium (greenhouse or other type of grow chamber) was a better more flexible environment since it let you duplicate the plants natural climate. Dino argued that a windowsill is just as good as a terrarium. Dino understand i mean climate. Just so my words don't get twisted i specifically mean: temperature, humidity, and the fact that its aquatic or terrestrial. Plants have been around alot longer than we have and they are completely evolved to be suited to their environment, and they thrive in that environment. A plant doing good in different temperatures is the plants way of surviving. The plant still needs to try to produce some color, pitchers, dew, nectar (whatever) and still needs to maintain those things in order to survive. Sure it might be growing, and sure it will look good, but it does better in its natural conditons and it has for millions of generations and terrariums let you copy those conditions the best we can.
 
  • #38
Very true Tony (the first entry on page 2), everyone's windowsill is different. My friend Andrew (whom i mentioned earlier) has also grown a N. Rajah on his windowsill for about a year. He put a humidifier in his room and everything.
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 Then there's me, i'm growing a N. Macrophylla on my windowsill right now. (I just got it, but i haven't seen any negative effect though, so i think it'll be all right.) But of course i mist all my plants about 7-8 times per day, and i have multiple cups of waterlogged sphagnum for humidity. The heater isn't working either.
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  • #39
Sorry to be reviving a topic, but natural conditions arnt always the best.
The following information is NOT from me, but from an orchid grower much more experienced then I:

For example, one should be very careful about watering Ophrys, because even a drop of water in the tubor can lead to rot, while in nature is 100% sure that through Autumn a rain is going to occur. Sounds weird and it is. So orchids in our houses dont react as being in nature.

And what about Drosophyllums?
It is a well known fact they grow in places with little humidity and rather dry conditions.
And yet, there are people growing Drosophyllums in high humidity in terrariums.
And they look just as good as ones outside of terrariums.

Now, whose to say that plants outside of terrariums(or 'natural conditions') cant adapt and look just as good as ones in 'natural conditions'?

That means the ones in the terrariums ADAPTED and grow JUST AS WELL. As the ones outside of terrariums.

And, there is a lady in the U.S.A who is growing slipper orchids in just water.
And guess what?
They grow BETTER then they would in 'natural conditions'
They grow more vigorously, and flowered sooner then the ones she keeps in 'natural conditions'.
 
  • #40
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Starman @ Dec. 28 2004,8:33)]Sorry to be reviving a topic, but natural conditions arnt always the best.
The following information is NOT from me, but from an orchid grower much more experienced then I:

For example, one should be very careful about watering Ophrys, because even a drop of water in the tubor can lead to rot, while in nature is 100% sure that through Autumn a rain is going to occur. Sounds weird and it is. So orchids in our houses dont react as being in nature.

And what about Drosophyllums?
It is a well known fact they grow in places with little humidity and rather dry conditions.
And yet, there are people growing Drosophyllums in high humidity in terrariums.
And they look just as good as ones outside of terrariums.

Now, whose to say that plants outside of terrariums(or 'natural conditions') cant adapt and look just as good as ones in 'natural conditions'?

That means the ones in the terrariums ADAPTED and grow JUST AS WELL. As the ones outside of terrariums.

And, there is a lady in the U.S.A who is growing slipper orchids in just water.
And guess what?
They grow BETTER then they would in 'natural conditions'
They grow more vigorously, and flowered sooner then the ones she keeps in 'natural conditions'.
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Sorry to be reviving a topic, but natural conditions arnt always the best.

Then why are the plants growing there?


[b said:
Quote[/b] ]And what about Drosophyllums?
It is a well known fact they grow in places with little humidity and rather dry conditions.
I was under the impression they get alot of fog naturally.


[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Now, whose to say that plants outside of terrariums(or 'natural conditions') cant adapt and look just as good as ones in 'natural conditions'?

You are insisting it.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]That means the ones in the terrariums ADAPTED and grow JUST AS WELL. As the ones outside of terrariums.

They WON'T, if you put a highly sensitive plant on a windowsill, it will die, even if it was adapted, the trick here in growing a plant is to try to MIMIC its natural habitat, not throw it on some foreign growing area.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]And, there is a lady in the U.S.A who is growing slipper orchids in just water.
And guess what?
They grow BETTER then they would in 'natural conditions'
They grow more vigorously, and flowered sooner then the ones she keeps in 'natural conditions'

Perhaps they are, some plants can grow better without limiting factors they get in the wild.
 
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