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Bad news : nepenthes viking extinction ?

  • #21
[b said:
Quote[/b] (nepizumiae @ Dec. 29 2004,12:11)]Adaptability is my concern regarding Vikings. We have genuses like periplaneta americana = common american roach which has survived earthquakes, tsunamis for thousands of years. On the other hand we have the Dodo which was extincted hundreds of years ago.
If both were adapted to their own environments why the former is still around and why the latter disappeared?
Humans and their associated cargo caused the extinction of the dodo. It has been postulated that the best way to get rid of pests and exotic invaders is to make them tasty or otherwise marketable.

There is a good discussion about the dodo at
http://www.bagheera.com/inthewild/ext_dodobird.htm

Here is an excerpt:
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]In 1505, the Portuguese became the first humans to set foot on Mauritius. The island quickly became a stopover for ships engaged in the spice trade. Weighing up to 50 pounds, the dodo was a welcome source of fresh meat for the sailors. Large numbers of dodos were killed for food.

Later, when the Dutch used the island as a penal colony, pigs and monkeys were brought to the island along with the convicts. Many of the ships that came to Mauritius also had uninvited rats aboard, some of which escaped onto the island. Before humans and other mammals arrived the dodo had little to fear from predators. The rats, pigs and monkeys made short work of vulnerable dodo eggs in the ground nests.

The combination of human exploitation and introduced species significantly reduced dodo populations. Within 100 years of the arrival of humans on Mauritius, the once abundant dodo was a rare bird. The last one was killed in 1681.
 
  • #22
Wow,that is such a devastateing event! My heart goes out to you you`re family and your people.

Plants come back people don`t. I sure hope that nothing else like this happens for quite a while(never would be good).


So sorry to hear about the destruction:(
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I`m just thankful you`re ok. During all the hurricanes in florida my friend Kelsey in pensacola I was so worried about because she didn`t contact me for like 6 months but thankfully her family got out without an deaths although an uncles of hers house was crashed in by a tree.

Please keep us updated on this.
You are in my prayers,
Noah.
 
  • #23
Interesting info Bob. If we were to compare to the number of insecticides people have used on the common roaches, these should be extinct by now.
Thus, the adaptability of the Roaches is far greater than that of the Dodo. I would have to agree though that man played an important role in its extinction.
 
  • #24
If someone has a male and female plant in cultivation, there is still hope for the species. I really hope someone does. If there is, it can be reintroduced in to the wild in areas that are suitable for it.
 
  • #25
Hi,
I have a couple of different male plants that I know of and a couple that haven't flowered yet. Half way there. I crossed the males with a nice N. ampullaria x either mirabilis or rafflesiana from the south near where the N. "Viking" are found. Hope it turns out ok.
Truly,
Tom
 
  • #26
Tom,
That Thai ampullaria natural hybrid sounds pretty interesting. Does it look like a N. xHookeriana?

Trent
 
  • #27
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Nong @ Dec. 29 2004,1:48)]This evening I heard a lot of news with deep regret.More than 20,000 fishing families have been severely affected by the tsunami which ravaged six southern coastal provinces on Sunday. One of those families is one whom I was so worried about because their humble cottage was 15 meters from the beach.Bung Kasem , his wife and two children were whom I tried to make contact by phone since the disaster. The line returned no signal everytime .I just knew  why this afternoon.Half of the village was swept  out to sea . Their cottage with bodies were found under  5 feet deep sand and mud . Bung Kasem was the one who took picture of Viking in the wild for me . He helpt me collect data of Vikings in their natural habitat .
      Late evening , a call from Phang_Nga province again. Nearly all area of plainland on the Island where Vikings grew are covered with sea mud.
     Till now , the death toll rose sharply yesterday to 1,657 – with 8,954 injured and 4,086 still missing – and there are still many dead bodies waiting to be removed. The Navy officer  believes there are no more survivors left on the islands in Andaman sea. Many coastal villages and resorts – now nothing more than mud-covered and rubble blanketed with the stench of rotting bodies.
     Sorry.
     Let me share with the idea that if the plants are growing in this spot, they might have been hit more than once with this kind of phenomenon. The statistic from Thailand's  Mineral Resources Department shows the  earthquake that sent tidal waves crashing into southern Thailand on Sunday was the worst one to affect the country in 459 years. And to review the history of our country , no phenomenon of any Tsunami like disasters had ever been recorded  600 years back. No legend , folktales or any literatures of Tsunami-like disaster while there are few about earthshakes and a lot of monsoons . Or I can say , this is the first Tsunami ever recorded in Thai history.
     Just an input for discussion.Anyway , I still believe the plants will survive and recover with the help of mother nature.It may take a month to explore the real situation and I have a lot to do meanwhile .I will join the forum again . Thanks for all.
      Nong
So sorry you lost your friend and his family:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(
 
  • #28
I too am saddened by the horrific tsunami. I have been to Pattaya Beach Thailand twice and Sattahip Thailand while in the Navy. So many people have lost so much.

I planted the relatively common species N. mirabilis location: Phuket Thailand that I received from the ICPS seedbank. I was fortunate to have four seedlings growing and will protect them and propagate them to the best of my ability. I hope others are doing the same.

Kirk Martin
Fitchburg, MA
 
  • #29
Trent,
The Thai hybrid looks like one of those "C" grade N. "Viking" but with a lid smaller like N. ampullaria. One is brown speckled and the other from Satoon has a green/pink trap color but gets bigger than the average N. ampullaria. I have small plants I crossed it with a N. mirabilis type with a fat peristome
and good red color. Hope something turns out good.
Truly,
Tom
 
  • #30
Hmm...

It seems to me that this area, given that it's right next to massive amounts of volcanic/tectonic activity, would have been subject to tsunamis many times over the millenia. Is there a reason why this tsunami would have caused the extinction? Why didn't one of the others? What makes you believe that they're truly extinct?
 
  • #31
I guess that's the thing. We have never experienced anything like this, so we will have to wait and see.
 
  • #32
Hi All,
    Thanks for your kindness. I have chance to ask an Islander to take pics. of Viking Island after Tsunami for me yesterday by my digital.So pics. came out clearer and also clearly showed the damage of the natural habitat of this marvelous Nepenthes . The salty powerful wave invade 1 km. from the shore and the savannah where wild Vikings grew were severely destroyed.Small plants ,herbs , shrubs ,vines were mostly killed directly by the power of waves.
 
  • #34
Hi Nong,
Thanks for the update. The devastation is very sad. Did many of the islanders survive? You mentioned your friend Bung and his family did not live through the tsunami.
You may have the only photo of the wild Vikings in their native habitat before the tsunami. The photo after the tsunami showing the devastation is worse than what we had imagined. Only 10 percent of Vikings still there? Are they dying from the salt? Were the other Vikings in Satoon affected?
I doubt the plants will recover in our lifetimes or in the lifetime of our children and grandchildren. If left alone to nature, who knows what the new Vikings will look like, now with most of the gene pool lost.
 
  • #35
Hi all:

It's really a sad story with a semi-happy ending. Hopefully 10% of the total population still intact will allow the Vikings to flourish in the future. Preservation of this species is achievable, considering the number of hobbyists growing these plants and the current technology available.
Gus

Sorry people, never mind
 
  • #36
I am pretty sure that image is photoshopped. I've seen actual videos of the waves and they didn't look that tall...
 
  • #37
[b said:
Quote[/b] (agustinfranco @ Jan. 18 2005,12:14)]The wave on the right is taller than the tallest building on the left. (somewhere in SE ASIA)
Not to doubt the veracity of the photo, but if you look closely, you can see Godzilla peeking from behind that highrise.
 
  • #38
Hi all:

The photo was sent to me and it looks real to me. However, those with photoshop knowledge may be able to find out whether this photo is a fake. If any of you tell me that it is fake, please explain why.

Gus
 
  • #39
hard to say Gus but it just doesnt look right. most pics and video i have seen dont really show a large wave. what they show is water that just keeps coming and coming. no huge wave i know this is a poor analogy but it looked more like someone filling up a bathtub only faster. i cant guarentee its a fake but it just doesnt look right.
 
  • #40
The waves were only 4 meters tall. That is many, many meters tall. However, just to verify it for sure, I looked on www.snopes.com , the San Fernando Valley Urban Legend site. I just typed "Tsunami" for the search word and it was the second one.One of the best sites to have book marked, IMHO. Almost all the pics that float the web like this are fake(remember the young man cut open out of the belly of a python? That was a hoax too.).

Cheers,

Joe

PS That is not really Godzilla, is it, lol?
 
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