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Thread: N. coccinea - two variations?

  1. #1

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    I bought both these Nepenthes at Kroger last summer. They are both labelled as N. coccinea, but they have different looking pitchers and growing characteristics.

    This one has pitchers of a solid maroon color. It has small wings, and the vine tends to grow quickly.


    This one produces freckled pitchers. The wings are more prominent, and it seems to be slower-growing.


    Are these differences just minor genetic variation within the hybrid, or are they, in fact, similar (perhaps very close), but distinct, hybrids?

    Peter D'Amato lists four hybrids that are essentially the same cross of N. mirabilis x (rafflesiana x ampullaria):

    N. wrigleyana
    N. morganiana
    N. lawrenciana
    N. coccinea

    He lists the N. coccinea as appearing like the top set of pics; according to his description, the bottom pics might perhaps be any of the first three hybrids I mentioned.

    Anybody have any ideas?
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  2. #2

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    Well, DeRoose over in Holland created the TC versions, and they have a mottled clone and a red clone, that I have heard of, at least.

    Cheers,

    Joe

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (The Griffin @ Mar. 23 2005,6:47)]Well, DeRoose over in Holland created the TC versions, and they have a mottled clone and a red clone, that I have heard of, at least.

    Cheers,

    Joe
    "TC" versions?
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  4. #4
    Nepenthes Specialist nepenthes gracilis's Avatar
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    Tissue Cultured plants.

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    Joe Griffin is right. Deroose Plants has tissue cultured two different clones of N. coccinea. ... kind of...

    N. coccinea is a Victorian hybrid, there are male and female plants. N. wrigelyana and lawrenciana are the same hyrbid, but made at different times. They are different grexes of the hybrid N. mirabilis x hookeriana. N. morganiana is the reciprocal cross N. hookeriana x mirabilis. There is only one surviving plant of N. morganiana.

    Deroose Plants produces thousands of these coccineas that are sold worldwide. At this point, you may be wondering how a Victorian hybrid is being mass produced from tissue culture (since neps can't be mericloned - yet). Well, that's because it really isn't true coccinea. We suspect that two siblings (female coccinea x male coccinea) were crossed to each other to produce the seed that went into TC. Some people say that it's not really a true coccinea, but the differences are minimal. True coccinea is still around in cultivation.
    There are two clones of coccinea in tissue culture. One is nearly solid red, the other one is spotted. We see very little difference in growth habit and vigor between the two clones. Both are male.

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    Quote Originally Posted by [b
    Quote[/b] (Trent @ Mar. 23 2005,10:36)]There are two clones of coccinea in tissue culture. One is nearly solid red, the other one is spotted. We see very little difference in growth habit and vigor between the two clones. Both are male.
    So it would appear I have one of each clone?
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    Someone please enlighten me here. If Nepenthes can't be mericloned, then why are they called 'tissue' cultured plants? Their tissues are never really utilized, right? Aren't they in essence seed grown in vitro? Which would make them all individual clones...wouldn't it? I was always under the impression that a plant from tissue culture was a meristem clone and all the Nepenthes which are grown in labs are actually seed grown in sterile conditions making them not really true tissue cultures. What is the real truth? Is tissue culture just a name given to the process of growing seed in vitro? I would really love to know.

    Thanks for any insight.

    Phil

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    Phil,

    You're half right - it is seed material that they use, but the tissue is cultured, so that one seedling can produce thousands of clones. Seed tissue in neps is free of the (symbiotic?) fungi/bacteria that dwell within more mature nep tissue, which is why meristem cloning can't be done, from what I understand.

    Hamish
    Demystifying Nepenthes: http://www.nepenthesforeveryone.com

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