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Hi, need some help again.

Situation: Plants not growing- not increasing, or even decreasing in diameter.
Truncata bought from MT in april, has produced 3 leaves, all of which are equal in size. pitchers have increased about 1cm every leaf
Rafflesiana BE-99 bought in late June, bare-root. Has been decreasing about 2cm for every new leaf produced, pitcher size, no change.
Merriliana, same from BE, leaf size decrease about 1cm, 1pitcher produced.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b209/Lam_wn/1b0cec67.jpg
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b209/Lam_wn/91f182c4.jpg
( numbering shows order in which leaves grew )
My growing conditions: I live in Singapore, tropical climate, humidity always above 65%, lighting is about 4hours direct sunlight, 3hours 50%-shaded sunlight, about 4-5 hours more shade. Potting media: cocopeat, LFS, perlite, charcoal, vermiculite, with very small amount of 'high peat content soil '

Singapore is 1 degree north, MT is 2 degrees north in Kuching.
MT supposedly uses 30-50% shading with 3-4 hours direct sunlight, I followed likewise, except the neighbouring houses block off several evening hours.
Humidity is never lower than 65%, nothing seems to be wrong with my potting mix except maybe slightly richer in nuitrients... I am quite worried because I put this off at first, saying acclimitizing... but now it seems its starting to get quite bad already. I need some help, especially from those who frequently import plants, is it really necessary to fertilize them? since I do not use fertillizers at all. I heard about superthrive to help bare-root plants develop root system, whatabout 30-10-10 foliar fertillizer solutions, are they a must?

oh, and the plants usually feed (literally) themselves, so I do not. Nitrogen or nitrates come from the amino acids from proteins from the prey right?

Thanks
 
From the coloring of the leaves, it tells me that not only NPK is lacking but some very important micronutrients as well. Magnesium is very low and when using LFS and cocopeat they become hogs for that nutrient. I would change your media first of all. Since humidity is high, use a small grade orchid bark, add perlite and a soil conditioner of a material like redwood soil conditioner. Keep the mix bland but porous. Since it appears that your plants may have lost some roots due to your media, I would use Superthrive on a weekly basis with fertilizer solution. After your plants have become adjusted and starts to show signs of growth, start using Epson salts in your fertilizing regime. Add a teaspoon of Epson salt to your solution of about five gallons fertilizer/Superthrive mixture.

During the hot summer it is ideal to fertilize weekly as new growth occurs rapidly. Water with plain water in between and allow plants to dry out to be come adjusted to water stress.

Michael
 
Fertilize? I wasn't aware we were suposed to do that to Nepenthes, or any CP's for that matter. Thanks for any info.
 
While I agree with Michael that nutrients are important, I don't think that is the main crux of your problem.  I think your main problem is mix which is too wet and leaf spot fungus.  I would unpot and check on the roots.  I suspect there is not much left. Poor root systems will lead to unhealthy small leaf growth which will show symptoms of malnutrition.

Edit: It is really hard to get an unfertilized healthy plant to show minor and micro nutrient defficiencies even potted in soilless mixes and watered with very pure water. Generally they just grow and increase in size slower. But when the problem is corrected it is like an explosion of growth waiting to happen. And even then it is usually the addition of major elements (NPK) that make the biggest difference. Plants with root problems however show nutrition problems quite frequently because they are unable to absorb elements needed for growth.

Deffinately need something chunky in there.  LFS/Perlite/charcoal or bark or coconut husk chips or something/ 1:1:1 and maybe a little of the coco peat.  Skip the vermiculite and high peat soil stuff.

Superthrive .. no comment

A little misting with some dilute 30 10 10 might help give it a little boost, but go easy on it.  Try not to hit the center of the emerging leaves as they may burn.

Let us know what you see after examining the roots.

Tony
 
If the fertilizer is in dilute form, just lay it on.  Growing tips don't seem to mind.  Do you think I have the time to make sure that a set up like these get their newest growth wet?
nep4045.jpg

 BTW, these four inch pots are being grown in full sun against a wall.  

I usually keep larger size pots at the lowest portion to get the draining fertilizer solution and inevitably, they grow even faster than the upper rows.
nep4046.jpg


But I somewhat agree with Tony, if you have an enclosed set up, it would be advisable not to fertilize as heavily if you were outdoors like me.  But terrarium growing would still benefit from fertilizers even in the dilutest form.  If not for the NPK, but calcium, magnesium, zinc, iron, etc.  alone.  These micronutrients are lacking in insect matter in sufficient quantities to make an effective diet.  Recall that many nepenthes grow on soils which can stunt other plants due to high concentrations of these minerals, yet the nepenthes thrive in an otherwise inhospitable soil.


M
 
Great settup Michael! whatcha growing there?

I would agree with Tony.

1.Roots too wet. ... repot with more open mix, and let it dry out more between waterings.

2.Evil red fungus... systemic fungicide. Has probably spread to all your neps whether its visible or not, so may want to spray them all.

3.Possible mite infestation too. They are usually responsible for spreading evil red fungus.

Take care of those first, then worry about fertizer.
Robin
smile.gif
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (RainforestGuy @ Sep. 05 2005,2:08)]Recall that many nepenthes grow on soils which can stunt other plants due to high concentrations of these minerals, yet the nepenthes thrive in an otherwise inhospitable soil.
M
Sorry Michael.. I totally disagree with you on that one. I bet you would find the mineral content fairly low even on those few species that grow on ultramafic soils or inbetween limestone crevices.

While I agree a very dilute fertilizer solution won't pose a problem for growth tips.. What happens as the fertilizer solution is sitting on those tender leaves and the water evaporates from it? It's no longer a very mild dilute solution. I can tell you from experience, you can burn new leaves if the plants are not flushed overhead to wash off the solution before it evaporates and the salts crystalize. It is not always just the brand that causes it.

T
 
Root problem?
smile_k_ani_32.gif

That was the last thing I wanted...disturbing the roots again!

Ok, maybe I should confirm first, the red stuff on the leaf...they are fungus and not burns? I always thought they were caused by plant adjusting to light levels!
And to treat this, the only way is fungicide? Must this be diluted more than usual too?

How about potting mix, let me get this straight, is cocopeat, even 100% cocopeat, airy enough a mix for most plants? Or is it advisable to use LFS with perlite only.
I dont want to get this wrong again, so just bear with me, is a mix of cocopeat, peat, perlite, charcoal,  LFS ratio of 2:1:1:1:1 suitable?

besides these, I dont have much else, but I just read up about "cocopeat hogs" (not sure what that is supposed to mean)

I have not yet checked the roots, but I want to be sure of a perfect potting mix before I transplant, because I feel there has been too much root disturbance already, 2 transplatns with 3 month interval is quite bad right?

Thanks
 
Good lord rainforestguy! You have a freakin' nursery of Nepenthes there! How many plants do you grow?

Great looking setup by the way
cool.gif
 
  • #10
a fair few neps there
smile_m_32.gif
They all seem to be liking some sun there.
Bye for now Julian
 
  • #11
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Lam_wn @ Sep. 06 2005,1:40)]Root problem?
smile_k_ani_32.gif

That was the last thing I wanted...disturbing the roots again!

If your careful there shouldn't be any negative effects.  And if there is a problem with the roots in the current mix then changing it could make a big difference.  Everyones conditions are and cultural practices are different.  The most important aspect is adjusting a mix that works best for you.

Ok, maybe I should confirm first, the red stuff on the leaf...they are fungus and not burns? I always thought they were caused by plant adjusting to light levels!
And to treat this, the only way is fungicide? Must this be diluted more than usual too?[/quote]

The red spotting/splotchy look is not burns or light adjustment.

[b said:
Quote[/b] (Lam_wn @ Sep. 06 2005,1:40)]
How about potting mix, let me get this straight, is cocopeat, even 100% cocopeat, airy enough a mix for most plants? Or is it advisable to use LFS with perlite only.
I dont want to get this wrong again, so just bear with me, is a mix of cocopeat, peat, perlite, charcoal,  LFS ratio of 2:1:1:1:1 suitable?

besides these, I dont have much else, but I just read up about "cocopeat hogs" (not sure what that is supposed to mean)

Potting mix should be WELL drained and airy, but yet hold sufficient water.  The problem is the potting  mix needs to balance with all the other cultural practices.  How often you water, how much you water, air movement, temperature etc etc etc.  The mix should hold moisture for at least a few days but yet it shouldn't be waterlogged after watering.  Personally I would skip the peat and maybe even the coco peat.  I would go with a LFS/perlite/charcoal mix at 1:1:1 with maybe a handful of the coco peat.  The thing is you need to try different blends out and see how they do.  THEN you need to make adjustments based on how it performs and the plants grow in your care.  It takes time and a fair bit of experimenting and observing and tinkering to come up with a mix that will do well as a general mix.  After that then you will learn how to adjust for some plants that like a bit more moisture or better draining mix or larger plants in big 2+gallon pots etc...

There appears to be a fair bit of moss and moisture holding material on the surface of your mix which leads me to believe it is holding too much moisture for your current cultural conditions.  So you can either make adjustments to the mix, make adjustments to how much and often you water OR make adjustments to both.

[b said:
Quote[/b] (Lam_wn @ Sep. 06 2005,1:40)]
I have not yet checked the roots, but I want to be sure of a perfect potting mix before I transplant, because I feel there has been too much root disturbance already, 2 transplatns with 3 month interval is quite bad right?

Thanks

New plants should start to settle in and begin to show healthy new growth within a couple weeks.  If they are not doing that then something is wrong and changes need to be made.  Better to make changes than keep them in their current situation which is obviously not working and won't suddenly do so by waiting longer.

Tony
 
  • #12
Tony's suggestion for a mix is pretty much fool proof.
What exactly is "high peat content soil?" Something other than garden style peat moss? Sounds kind of suspicious.
Also, where is the cocopeat coming from? If it's not Sri Lankan, than it may have a high amount of salts in it.
It's not a bad idea to soak and change the water a few times on all your ingredients.

Cheers,

Joe
 
  • #13
What a complex mix!  
smile_m_32.gif
 Keep it simple like me. LFS and perlite. Vary the proportion for lowlands and intermediates.

I use Horti Orchid Hormone NPK 30:15:20 as fertiliser. 0.5ml per 4L of water. Here's a tip, buy Vit B tablets from Guardian Pharmancy. It's off the rack. Crush one into powder and dissolve in a litre of water. Use that to tide them over the shock of transplanting.

See Vit B1 helped neps recover!
 
  • #14
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Cindy @ Sep. 08 2005,12:29)]What a complex mix!  
smile_m_32.gif
 Keep it simple like me. LFS and perlite. Vary the proportion for lowlands and intermediates.

I use Horti Orchid Hormone NPK 30:15:20 as fertiliser. 0.5ml per 4L of water. Here's a tip, buy Vit B tablets from Guardian Pharmancy. It's off the rack. Crush one into powder and dissolve in a litre of water. Use that to tide them over the shock of transplanting.

See Vit B1 helped neps recover!
smile_k_ani_32.gif
Great minds think a like!
smile_o_32.gif

just joking, but I thought of using Vitamin B1 too, since I dont think superthrive is selling here, but was slightly hesitant...overdose of vitamins will not be harmful right? unlike fertilizers
I am slightly afriad of using too much LFS in my mix since the type I use (I think not very high quality) decomposes rather quickly over time. But I dont have much experience with cocopeat either and am afraid it will decompose even quicker! I was told to use a much coarser mix - with orchid bark... but not sure what it is, and dont know if I can get it here...

Thanks
 
  • #15
i use a capful of superthrive per 24 oz. no overdoses yet
smile.gif
 
  • #16
Have had bad experiences with coco peat. In a hot humid climate it breaks down in the lower parts of the pot into a reddish sludge. The husks or chips are much better. Vermiculite is too dense also.
There's some controversy about perlite/sponge rock. It may leach flourides into the medium over time, but we have used it judiciously with very good results. Sponge rock is perlite-only bigger. Because you're in Singapore and have such high humidity, you can use an open mix, which really stimulates a large healthy root system. When you water, flush the pot. the water should come flooding out the bottom within seconds. Also, overpot. The evaporation from the medium is helpful to the plant and contributes to a good microclimate. We noticed that overpotting was extremely beneficial for raff gigantea (BE 99). Merrilliana has a long root system. They need the space and good drainage.
As for Superthrive- no comment. (Did someone else say that?)
Personally, I would stay away from fertilizer until the plants are re-established. Once they get going again, do fertilize. I suspect there may be micronutrient problems with merrilliana, but that's another topic!
 
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