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  • #21
@RSS: you jest, but i think you're on to something. your leaves are much more greener! mine has yet to flower. im also thinking about dividing it and placing it into a glass cube like the others. it takes way too much space.
 
  • #22
I've taken divisions from that planter and rooted them in that tank, moved them over to a higher light tank and the new growths started hugging the medium, and have yet to flower. The humidity is also lower in the high light area so that may have something to do with it also.

One of my "someday" projects will be growing U. nephrophylla as a lithophytic.
 
  • #23
@RSS: mine are at the bottom of the tank, least amount of light possible....i only recently made them waterlogged.
 
  • #24
. . .
2008 Travis Wyman CPN article on growing Orchidioides - not available (what's up with that??) . . .

This article is available to ICPS members. All I needed to do was download a PDF copy of the correct issue; Carniv. Pl. Newslett. 37(3):68-74. Then I could read the entire article including the photos.
 
  • #25
Since potting up several plants in these a few months ago, I've been very impressed with the plant's growth. Other than the eventual issues of repotting/dividing & invading neighboring pots, I love them! I find it interesting that already we see some growers using undrained pots, some regular pots and some net pots .... it should continue to be interesting as we see how all the plants grow...
wonder if Nicole ever treads this way?
No documented sightings but as you note we need to be sure it is not for lack of an invitation... :bigthumpup:
This thread needs more pics, so I'll help out.
Agreed! Pics are always a good thing!! I'll try to slip in some here & there when I get a chance. Some of the pots aren't too accessible as I stick little pots full of LFS under wandering aerial roots for propagation.

For now, here's a quick snap of my 75 (1st) & 40 gal (below) tanks that currently house ~90% of my non-weedy utrics (these are in my basement and not exactly in 'presentation' condition). ??? I consolidated multiple 10 gal tanks into these two while also repotting several clones into much larger 4"x4" net pots to try them out. While I was quite comfortable managing humidity in the smaller tanks, I have yet to get a handle on it with the larger ones. In a 10 gal, there seemed to be less stratification from top to bottom of the tank ....
75galtank121810RS.jpg

40gal121810RS.jpg


... and this little humbo (BCP - misc clone) in a cup in another tank caught my eye. I threw a small root (rolon?) fragment into some moss some time ago and it has slowly grown into a mini-plant. Recently it has popped up 2 leaves which are much wider than the others. I love that tendency with the U. humboldtii - while most leaves are the normal paddle shape, some are extra skinny or extra wide and some are just odd (I've got to snap a few pics of the 'odd' ones...).
uhumboldtiibcpmisc121810RS.jpg


Speaking of leaf diversity (although a slightly different vein), here's a pic I snapped of U. humboldtii ferns & bladders growing up from the mini-water tray the pot sits in. The different leaves, bladders that get huge and aerial stolons that sneak everywhere - humbo's are cool!
Uhumbo-fernsbladders110510RSBrazil.jpg


Next is a U. endresii in the mix above, I have started 2 other pots of this stuff with just a leaf cutting, like you can do with U. longifolia. A few of the leaves (due to my carelessness) have fallen off and they started rooting in the bottom of the vivarium on the hydroton.
Belanger has a CPN article on this and I've only really tried it with a U. quelchii leaf that came detached from BCP - so far, it appears to be a complete failure... :headwall:

This article is available to ICPS members. All I needed to do was download a PDF copy of the correct issue; Carniv. Pl. Newslett. 37(3):68-74. Then I could read the entire article including the photos.
So that explains it - thank you. The newest few years are members only - so I could get it but not share it....
 
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  • #26
@Ron - How do you have the 75 setup with those cut up plastic bottles, are they just a way to raise up the plants? Are all of your pots sitting on LFS?
 
  • #27
@Ron - How do you have the 75 setup with those cut up plastic bottles, are they just a way to raise up the plants? Are all of your pots sitting on LFS?
I originally set up the tank with the right half dedicated to utrics in the 4x4 net pots and the left part attempting to duplicate the 10gal tank environment. On the left side, I set up a 'floor' of glass sheets on plastic bottles at the same height as the floor of a 10 gal (same distance from lights)(roughly). Just like in my 10 gal tanks, I line the space between pots with live LFS. It keeps the humidity in a reasonable range and acts as a visual indicator of low humidity.

However, I realized I had too many net pots and needed some of the other space so the left side has a raised platform roughly in the shape of an 'L'. The rear left half of the tank is all raised platform and the front is 50% raised platform (left 50%). On this raised platform are a bunch of the utrics I'm holding for a friend, little propagation pots, the baby U. 'Jitka' (which has been adding leafs recently!!), the U. jamesoniana and misc other smaller stuff (N. izumae seedlings...)(although there is one U. reniformis that is no longer small)...

The net pots are all sitting on 4" plastic pots to raise them up closer to the lights. This is apparently causing my humidification stratification issues. The bottom of the tank is filled with growing LFS (and a bunch of D. prolifera thriving down there) and is nice & humid. The upper reaches of the tank are heated by the lights and don't have nearby wet LFS (at least on the right side). Looks like I need some fans or a fogger or both or ..... ???
This plant has not reacted well to the same feeding schedule. But to be honest it is also getting the least amount of light compared to the others (significant difference) So its ability to utilize the extra nutrients cannot be the same. Mea Culpa
Interesting manifestation of (potentially) excessive fertilization (not that i would have any idea of how plants should react anyway) ??? ... of my non-Iperua Orchidioides, this plant (and the 2 U. alpina clones) have exhibited the most robust growth so far ...
 
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  • #28
Hi all,
I'm new to this forum, I discovered it thanks to Ron a few months ago but I didn't have the time to post anything:) One of my faves are epiphytic utrics, and I thought I could share some of the growing tips I was given by other growers and experiences I gathered while growing them.

I think You all already got what it's all about with them, and the only thing missing are some growing nuances. I would like to discuss with you the watering methods, substrates, lights, and all that stuff that varies in our collections.

The first thing I would like to discuss is the way they grow in natural habitat - horizontally, and - vertically. Many of them grow on vertical surfaces like mossy rocks, trees and so on. The species in this group could be U.jamesoniana, U.asplundii and U.campbelliana I think (also U.unifolia? and the "U.uxoris", which is tought to be U.jamesoniana). I was growing U.campbelliana like other utrics from the group, in normal pots - and it wasn't doing well. I wondered what may be the cause, the conditions given were quite good. And then I saw some pics of this plant growing on trees in the natural habitat. I purchased a xaxim slab which is used for growing orchids, and started to grow it vertically. The results were good - here's the xaxim slab after a week or so:

campe.jpg


And here's the plant as for today:
86533465.jpg


It could use mor elight but it's doing fine, a lot better when kept vertically. Longer stolons, there's also a lot of very small leaves popping out from the xaxim everywhere. The only thing to be considered as negative is that I can't transplant it now, the stolons have grown into the slab. The plant has got something like a life cycle under my condtions - a lot of new leaves appears, they lat for a few months and then they die back. The cycle repeats itself. I think the method could suit the other utrics in the group but unfortunately I never had an opportunity to get U.jamesoniana or asplundii in trade.

Damn, looks like I'm a bore:D so maybe I'll stop for today and write something about other epyphitic ones I grow within the next days

Peter
 
  • #29
@peter: seems to me that the ex section Iperua, or at least the majority of its clones can be grown in waterlogged conditions. the other members of orchidioides prefer more drier conditions as well. the way how you are growing campbelliana seems to support this.
 
  • #30
That's true, but the interesting thing is that when I kept it horizontally it received the same ammounts of water. There must be some reason for which the plant is found mainly on vertical surfaces.

Peter
 
  • #31
@peter: seems to me that the ex section Iperua, or at least the majority of its clones can be grown in waterlogged conditions. the other members of orchidioides prefer more drier conditions as well. the way how you are growing campbelliana seems to support this.

for the record ive watched my alpina grow essentially as an affixed aquatic.....
 
  • #32
I'm new to this forum...
Hi Peter,
Welcome to Terra!! Way to come in and make a splash with the 'Big guns'! Congratulations on your success with the campy!

looks like I'm a bore:D so maybe I'll stop for today
Definitely not boring here! Some questions on your U. campbelliana:
- what are your conditions? (humidity, lighting, watering/spraying schedule, temps, etc)
- I got some xaxim (or something similar - treefern roots) with an order a few months ago but have been scared to try it - seems like it would dry out very quickly... Also, mine appears to have a lot more air space between the little branches. There are different densities of the material? I think I would feel much more comfortable if the little branches/roots of the slab were more densely woven
- You just tied the LFS, the campy was growing in, onto the xaxim slab and it took off - growing into the slab - right?
- how long have you had it growing like this?
- what is the slab tied to in the 1st pic?

Tobias also has some growing vertically (on a rock?) and only says that the air is "slightly humid".
 
  • #33
Hi Peter,
- I got some xaxim (or something similar - treefern roots) with an order a few months ago but have been scared to try it - seems like it would dry out very quickly... Also, mine appears to have a lot more air space between the little branches. There are different densities of the material? I think I would feel much more comfortable if the little branches/roots of the slab were more densely woven

I can answer this part. Tree fern does come in alot of densities, I have some that you could pass 1/4" objects though and others that are dense as wood.

As for the drying out part, I have some of the dense pieces cut into 2" X 3" X 1/4" slabs and they are hanging on the walls of a vivarium with constance 60%+ humidity. The tree fern does not dry out throughout a week, I rewater them once a week and they are never dry. The slabs hanging close to the fans do dry out along with the less dense pieces. You could do a dry run with the slab + mounting medium but minus the plant, and just see how it goes.

So far I have been avoiding mounting Utric's on mounts because I think they would be harder to keep from spreading and contaminating other Utric's. I would agree it probably would be a prefered method of growing alot of them. The results I've had with U. graminifolia on driftwood would support this even with non orchidioides.

I would think the more open mediums (airflow to the "roots") is the reason for the improved results not the horizontal position. I've been moving over to more open mediums and I've had nothing but good results. (Warning for the newer people...My vivariums are ALWAYS over 60% humidity, your results may vary greatly)
 
  • #34
what are your conditions? (humidity, lighting, watering/spraying schedule, temps, etc)
Humidity is very high, ca. 80% during the day and over 90% at night. The light conditions are rather poor - two 15W fluorescent lights and normal daylight they get through an east-facing window. As you can see on the first pic, the xaxim slab stands constantly in water, maybe it even gets too wet sometimes! I've got a fogger onside the terrarium which is working 10 minutes every day. Spraying - from time to time:) The temps are ca. 77F during the day and 59F at night.

- I got some xaxim (or something similar - treefern roots) with an order a few months ago but have been scared to try it - seems like it would dry out very quickly... Also, mine appears to have a lot more air space between the little branches. There are different densities of the material? I think I would feel much more comfortable if the little branches/roots of the slab were more densely woven
Yes, there are different densities but I think every treefern slab will work, even the ones that have a more sparse consistency. This utric really "catches" everything with it's stolons:
http://www.wistuba.com/images/dsc2196_579.jpg
You can always try the xaxim with some less demanding species

- You just tied the LFS, the campy was growing in, onto the xaxim slab and it took off - growing into the slab - right?
Exactly like that!

- how long have you had it growing like this?
3 months only or so, and the results are as shown! It really took off immediately

- what is the slab tied to in the 1st pic?
That metal thing is my cooler, that's a radiator which is cooled with water. I've got a freezer standing next to the terrarium, with a water pump and a reservoir inside. The cold water is pumped into the radiator.

Tobias also has some growing vertically (on a rock?) and only says that the air is "slightly humid".

Interesting! I agree the xaxim keeps the water very well and there's virtually no need of watering if the humidity level inside is at high levels and you spray it from time to time.

By the way, what are your watering methods for the rest of the group? Really interesting with the alpina kept as an aquatic affixed, I know that U.longifolia can be found growing this way in the natural habitat. But I just can't get the watering of U.geminiloba right. This utric has been always one of the most demanding for me, what are your conditions? Also U.praetermissa and U.endressi don't do as good as I'd like them to in my collection. U.quelchii grows in the same conditions perfectly, as well as the weeds (reniformis, alpina etc)

Peter
 
  • #35
By the way, what are your watering methods for the rest of the group?
I usually water about once per week for most of the enclosures but that may be longer or shorter - depending on the conditions. I usually water when I see the live sphagnum drying out in several of the pots. As I'm trying to increase my humidity, I notice that the time between waterings is longer (as expected). ???

But I just can't get the watering of U.geminiloba right. This utric has been always one of the most demanding for me, what are your conditions?
Fwiw, I added some comments on my U. geminiloba over in RSS's flower thread.

Also U.praetermissa and U.endressi don't do as good as I'd like them to in my collection.
Join the club!:headwall: I've had some U. endresii for ~14-15 months. It has grown ok but has not taken the next step up beyond leaves of 1.5 - 2.5". About 2-3 months ago, I planted some netpots - one in 100% live LFS and the other in a fairly open peat mix. The plant in live LFS is has spread throughout the pot and is generally more robust than the other. Maybe RSS can provide some more hints as his seem to be doing very well...

I received a U. praetermissa in the fall (Sept 20) with one large leaf and at least one large obvious tuber (>0.25"). I potted it in a netpot w/ 100% live LFS. The single leaf died within a week or 2 and nothing obvious has happened since. I have been trying to keep the pot on the dry side (but possibly not dry enough?). Sometime I'll probably need to start digging around to see if it's still alive & non-rotted down there (but I keep hoping for a new leaf).

In the 1st post in this thread, there is a link to a Belanger CPN article where he recommends a hard annual dormancy which helps to produce good growth & regular blooms (definitely recommend reading).

U.quelchii grows in the same conditions perfectly, ....
U. quelchii has tormented me. The one I received 14-15 months ago promptly died back and I have struggled to nurse tiny remnants back to respectable growth. I 'seem' to be making some progress recently with higher humidity ((as he knocks on wood)). Another plant, received in late Sept with one leaf (~2"), has added a 2nd leaf similar leaf and several smaller ones. I just noticed yesterday that it is starting to send up another leaf (so there may yet be hope....).

...as well as the weeds (reniformis, alpina etc)
While I agree that U. alpina is the closest thing to a weed that I have (in the original Orchidioides), neither of my 2 clones have bloomed yet so i cannot say that I have yet made them completely 'happy'. The 2 smaller forms of reniformis have both grown like weeds but also have not flowered. The larger seedgrown clones are robust but also have yet to bloom and another clone (fairly large) puts out one leaf at a time. This leaf usually lasts for 1-3 months and then it dies and another comes up (sometimes another leaf comes up before it dies). I grew U. reniformis 'Enfant Terrible' for a few months before it's sickly self decided to just die ... ??? The seedgrown clones will spend the winter in a cool back basement room (with my 'outside Cephs' and VFTs). I plan to dry them out and only give them water in the spring (& see if those massive swollen roots / rolons do any good ..... :-O :crazy:
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
Later edit: While I was doing my morning misting, I decided I had waited long enough and I checked the U. praetermissa - bad news. No tubers and the only quasi-recognizable remnants of roots were rotten. While the inside of the pot was not really wet, it had more moisture than I expected, given that I was trying to keep it 'barely wet' (aka: mostly dry). So that stinks! :censor:

Now that I was in there rooting around, I remembered Peter's xaxim post. While I'm not yet ready to jump head first with my small U. jamesoniana (even though that probably makes more sense), I took one of my small U. asplundii 'spares', removed it from the small cup it was in and tied it and the LFS it was on to a treefern slab (I had located the slabs last night, found that the 2nd one was more dense than the 1st). Wish me luck! Here's a fuzzy pic before it went into the tank:
Uasplundiiontreefernxaxim122410RS.jpg

The white lines are pointing to the leaves. The small ones on the right & left were visible in the pot but the newly unfolding larger leaf in the middle was hidden by some live LFS. I tried to keep most of the visible roots & bladders on the treefern side, behind the moss. The middle & right leaves are connected, the one on the left is soloing... (ooops) ???
 
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  • #36
In the 1st post in this thread, there is a link to a Belanger CPN article where he recommends a hard annual dormancy which helps to produce good growth & regular blooms (definitely recommend reading).
I'll check it out for sure!

U. quelchii has tormented me. The one I received 14-15 months ago promptly died back and I have struggled to nurse tiny remnants back to respectable growth. I 'seem' to be making some progress recently with higher humidity ((as he knocks on wood)). Another plant, received in late Sept with one leaf (~2"), has added a 2nd leaf similar leaf and several smaller ones. I just noticed yesterday that it is starting to send up another leaf (so there may yet be hope....).
I noticed that U.quelchii needs a lot of time to get adapted to new conditions, the plantlet I received showed first signs of growth after 180 days! I keep mine in a net pot, only half an inch of water, looks like it's doing fine.

While I agree that U. alpina is the closest thing to a weed that I have (in the original Orchidioides), neither of my 2 clones have bloomed yet so i cannot say that I have yet made them completely 'happy'. The 2 smaller forms of reniformis have both grown like weeds but also have not flowered.
There's a lot of various clones of these species, some of them flower rarely and some other are easy to. None of my alpinas ever flowered, but I know people that purchased alpinas in garden centres here and got them flowering on the windowsill:D

Later edit: While I was doing my morning misting, I decided I had waited long enough and I checked the U. praetermissa - bad news. No tubers and the only quasi-recognizable remnants of roots were rotten. While the inside of the pot was not really wet, it had more moisture than I expected, given that I was trying to keep it 'barely wet' (aka: mostly dry). So that stinks!
Sorry to hear that. Was it kept in a net-pot? Hope you'll get another one soon!

(...)I took one of my small U. asplundii 'spares', removed it from the small cup it was in and tied it and the LFS it was on to a treefern slab
Hope you'll get nice results, I'm looking forward for photos of the plants' future progress on the xaxim!

Peter
 
  • #37
Story time!

One day while watering, me being the clumsy person I am, ended up knocking over my Utric. endressii. Thankfully there was no damage or so I thought. A few weeks past and it was time for my monthly clearing out the debris from the hydroton. Much to my surprise there was this tiny little leaf with a chunk taken out of it. It was still green and could only be from one plant in there. So I very quickly threw some potting medium into a cup and gently laid the leaf onto a moist spot. I forgot about the little guy for a few weeks, figuring his death would come soon. The next time I went to check on him, he was growing a root! Ok, so know I'm thinking I should actually try and take care of the little one. Well last weekend while watering I noticed some growth! The entire leaf is about 1/2".

The morale of this story is that you can it would seen grow Utric. endressii from a leaf pull.

Every good story needs a photo.
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/39807474@N07/5307451112/" title="Utricularia endressii leaf by randallsimpson, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5005/5307451112_798ec76e34.jpg" width="500" height="334" alt="Utricularia endressii leaf" /></a>
 
  • #38
Oh very nice! I didn't know you could propagate utrics from leaf pullings. Do you have pics of the flowers? I haven't ever seen a good thread on *just* pretty utric flowers...
 
  • #39
that IS exciting! dont think anyone is willing to do leaf cuttings out of their precious orchidioides! that being said, i suppose the chances of striking depend on how much of the base leaf you have? something similar along the lines of petiolaris dews?
 
  • #40
Oh very nice! I didn't know you could propagate utrics from leaf pullings. Do you have pics of the flowers? I haven't ever seen a good thread on *just* pretty utric flowers...

I have not yet flowered this one. Might be a good idea to start a Utric. flower thread like the orchid flower thread?

that IS exciting! dont think anyone is willing to do leaf cuttings out of their precious orchidioides! that being said, i suppose the chances of striking depend on how much of the base leaf you have? something similar along the lines of petiolaris dews?

This was not an intended pull so I'm not sure on the details. The main plant I have is sending out enough runners that I would not pull a leaf, just guide the runners to a pot then snipe a month later. In the spring I might do an intentional pull just to see what would happen.
 
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