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Thread: Yellowing Leaves

  1. #17
    Never Knows Best gill_za's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mannex17 View Post
    I just had to re-pot my big VFT because he was potted using Schultz brand peat moss, and there were little osmocote bb's in it that they didn't feel the need to mention on the bag. Each leaf he put out was smaller and more squiggly and the traps were stunted.
    Mine is in 50:50 washed peat:silica sand soil. Was ok at first, produced amazing growth just over a month ago and now this

  2. #18
    Never Knows Best gill_za's Avatar
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    Well I decided that yesterday was as good of a day as ever to re-pot it. I had some 50:50 peat:sand mix (washed and sterilised using 1% peroxide solution for 24 hours) left from other re-pottings and some new pots that came in recently.

    The plants were removed from their pots and rinsed under tap water until squeaky clean. I then I gave them a bath in pyrethrin containing insecticide for approximately 10 minutes. Following that plants were again washed with tap water and submerged in distilled water for 4 hours. Before replanting them into pots I inspected the distilled water and found two nematodes alive and well swimming. That I suspect is not good. Both pots are now isolated from each other and from the rest of the plants an will remain this way.

    Below are the pictures.
    First Plant:







    Second Plant (notice more developed root system):








    The dark long roots were present on the plants when they were first separated and repotted from a small pot that they came in. Surprisingly, even though at some point both plants produced a lot of leaves, the roots on both plants seem underdeveloped. Have they rotted away?

  3. #19
    Not Growing Up! GrowinOld's Avatar
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    WoW!

    Wow!
    Indeed you look to have done a good job & put in a good effort!
    So you know (in case you don't), any of the black roots that seem to have "skinny" portions (thin like a fat hair) are likely dead, however the black roots that have the small white/yellowish growing tip on them & a decent amount of thickness throughout their length are alive and growing!
    You can safely cut off the dead roots with no harm to the plant. In fact it is one less place for rot or "uninvited guests" to hide & reside.

    If indeed you saw more 'bugs" in the water, another wash & dose of some insecticide could have been repeated, but from the sound of it you have done a decent job and now time will tell how things go from here.

    I often dust with a rooting/fungicide mix when planting back up, but VFT's are so hardy that this is pretty much overkill. I also encourage trimming off black/dead leaves & remains. (Not every portion needs to be removed, but I like to make it clean looking and remove the obvious "spent" portions. They aren't going to return back to life anyway, but one needs to use reasonable care when doing this.

    Many people use "transplanting" time to break the bub-lets apart to propagate more plants, however I like my plants large so I only divide them when they produce small "side-cars" of smaller plantlets. When left on, the plants often grow & pack so close upon themselves that there is no room for decent growth anyway, & so it allows me to propagate new plants without taking away much energy from the main plant in allowing it to get large.

    From the look of your plants, they are decently healthy and growing quite well. I don't know how long you have had them, but they apparently have liked where they were growing at some point.... at least before the bug attack!

    Do keep us posted on the progress of the plants. If the "bug killer" you used doesn't do the trick, then indeed something stronger will be needed. I do hope that won't be necessary, but you never know.
    Keep in mind that you have now greatly decreased the nematode/bug population by "thinning out the herd", which alone may be enough to give your plant the upper-hand once again.
    I myself have occasionally used stronger things like malathion, diazinon and other such nasties, however with overuse, incorrect handling & people who don't know what they are doing (nor able to respect the potency of such materials), it seems that anything that works really well is being taken off the market.
    (And in view of the damage that people have done with these things, I guess removing them from the hands of the general public was a prudent solution.) But indeed, it can be hard to find something that may work well.

    Again, time will tell if the infestation returns, but you've done a great job of addressing the situation head-on! Nice pics by the way!

    Experience is the best teacher. At least it used to be.
    But then, common sense isn't so common anymore, is it.


    http://www.terraforums.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=113866

  4. #20
    Never Knows Best gill_za's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrowinOld View Post
    Wow!
    Indeed you look to have done a good job & put in a good effort!
    So you know (in case you don't), any of the black roots that seem to have "skinny" portions (thin like a fat hair) are likely dead, however the black roots that have the small white/yellowish growing tip on them & a decent amount of thickness throughout their length are alive and growing!
    You can safely cut off the dead roots with no harm to the plant. In fact it is one less place for rot or "uninvited guests" to hide & reside.

    If indeed you saw more 'bugs" in the water, another wash & dose of some insecticide could have been repeated, but from the sound of it you have done a decent job and now time will tell how things go from here.

    I often dust with a rooting/fungicide mix when planting back up, but VFT's are so hardy that this is pretty much overkill. I also encourage trimming off black/dead leaves & remains. (Not every portion needs to be removed, but I like to make it clean looking and remove the obvious "spent" portions. They aren't going to return back to life anyway, but one needs to use reasonable care when doing this.

    Many people use "transplanting" time to break the bub-lets apart to propagate more plants, however I like my plants large so I only divide them when they produce small "side-cars" of smaller plantlets. When left on, the plants often grow & pack so close upon themselves that there is no room for decent growth anyway, & so it allows me to propagate new plants without taking away much energy from the main plant in allowing it to get large.

    From the look of your plants, they are decently healthy and growing quite well. I don't know how long you have had them, but they apparently have liked where they were growing at some point.... at least before the bug attack!

    Do keep us posted on the progress of the plants. If the "bug killer" you used doesn't do the trick, then indeed something stronger will be needed. I do hope that won't be necessary, but you never know.
    Keep in mind that you have now greatly decreased the nematode/bug population by "thinning out the herd", which alone may be enough to give your plant the upper-hand once again.
    I myself have occasionally used stronger things like malathion, diazinon and other such nasties, however with overuse, incorrect handling & people who don't know what they are doing (nor able to respect the potency of such materials), it seems that anything that works really well is being taken off the market.
    (And in view of the damage that people have done with these things, I guess removing them from the hands of the general public was a prudent solution.) But indeed, it can be hard to find something that may work well.

    Again, time will tell if the infestation returns, but you've done a great job of addressing the situation head-on! Nice pics by the way!

    Thank you for your comment. Yes time will tell. I saw that the plants both produced several offsprings but decided not to separate them because I just did not have enough potting soil and I also wanted to wait and see if I can rid of the nematodes. Otherwise I'm just spreading them around.

    I already tried to use three different insecticides to address the problem with no improvement: first it was neem oil extract, then imidocloprid ( I spraed so much that the soil seemed drenched), then when no improvement was seen I bought AzaMax, sprayed the pant and drenched the soil with 1% suspension.

    One of the crazy ideas I had and wanted to try as part of an experiment is to use over the counter cat roundworm medicine to try and kill the nematodes that were washed out first and then use it on the plant itself. I know it sounds crazy and I did not try it but both types of parasites are essentially the same thing and what works for one should work for another But I have no idea how something like piperazine dihydrochloride will affect the plant so I did not try it.

    Have you had any experience with predatory nematodes? I can't seem to find much information about using them against plant nematodes around here.

  5. #21
    Not Growing Up! GrowinOld's Avatar
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    Guard-Dog Nematodes

    As far as using predatory nematodes, I have used some in my garden to deal with japanese beetle larva and other vegetable garden invaders. But as far as results are concerned, it is difficult to say. Predatory nematodes is like releasing a couple cats into the neighborhood & hoping they solve a mouse problem! Some will indeed help out, however it won't be as effective as putting out poison or traps. (Or time to call the Pied Piper!)
    Most natural remedies are like that (IME) which is why the other methods were invented in the first place. (They do obviously have their drawbacks however.) Not that predatory nematodes can't help, but I wouldn't expect miracles from them. At least that's my opinion & experience, and others can certainly have great results that I haven't.

    I do use Trichoderma & other natural means for doing things, so don't think that my mind isn't open to other things. But when it comes to things like what you are experiencing with your plants, I tend to find that the majority of what I was taught years ago still holds true, & the old methods are many times still the best way.

    As far as the car worm meds, I would certainly go for it! First see if they kill the beasties in a separate container, then if that does kill them off, take a sacrificial VFT & give it a try to see how it does. That us exactly how new methods and ways are discovered, innovation! (I am actually a big proponent of that!)

    Well, again good luck & do keep me posted on how it proceeds! I do wonder where these things came to you in the first place, & I'd watch to make sure it doesn't spread. I've caught various "bugs" from trades here on TF (no names mentioned), and it can be a real pain to eradicate them. But that is part of becoming a good grower, and really is good experience. You can't claim to be great at growing plants if you never have to deal with difficult situations. So in a way I congratulate you & want you to know you are not alone in this.

    If worse comes to worse, we can always get you some new plants.
    Take care
    Last edited by GrowinOld; 05-15-2011 at 10:36 AM. Reason: typo
    Experience is the best teacher. At least it used to be.
    But then, common sense isn't so common anymore, is it.


    http://www.terraforums.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=113866

  6. #22
    Never Knows Best gill_za's Avatar
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    I suspect that they came to me from a nursery that supplies these plants to the store I got three of my plants from.
    Going to set up the experiment with the cat's de-wormer med today.
    I have just flushed the pot with Ping. Put the transparent tray with the water from ping onto the black paper and what do I see... found these guys there as well. At this point as I was suspecting this infestation has spread.
    Last edited by gill_za; 05-15-2011 at 10:19 PM.

  7. #23
    Never Knows Best gill_za's Avatar
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    Update:

    Well while I'm waiting for both plants to either improve or completely decline I've set up a little home-brew experiment where I've collected three 100-150mL aliquots from three trays of top watered plants that used to be in the same tray. All aliquots contained nematodes.
    Prior to that a pill containing 100mg of piperazine chloride was dissolved in 100mL of DI water (0.1% w/v)
    Approximately 30mL of piperazine chloride solution was added to the aliquotes and mixed gently.
    Trays were covered and moved to darker location. 24hours later I see great reduction in the number of free moving worms.

    This will be repeated with two treated trays and one untreated tray to serve as a control.

  8. #24
    Not Growing Up! GrowinOld's Avatar
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    Keep us posted!
    Experience is the best teacher. At least it used to be.
    But then, common sense isn't so common anymore, is it.


    http://www.terraforums.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=113866

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