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Shipping cp seeds internationally,

Hi all,

From your experience and knowledge, what are the legal problems one may encounter in sending CP seeds internationally? Especially when shipping in or out of USA.

Thanks
 
We have had this discussion before I think.

Let me be frank and honest. The odds of anything happening from anyone sending seeds anywhere is minimal. The only countries I know that actively prohibit reception of CP seed are Australia and New Zealand.

Is is legal to send seed from the US, or receive seed into the US without legal papers and licenses? It is not. It is illegal, and there are fines that may be levied. Even with an import license, there are other hoops. every sending and reception of seed must be individually stated and sent to the appropriate official for review. There are no blanket permissions issued, each is a case in itself requiring phytosanitary documents, import licenses, permissions of Fish and Wildlife, C.I.T.E.S restrictions to foreign countries.

To legally internationally send or receive a single seed here will cost at least 50.00.

So it is up to the individual in the U.S. as to how much of the law they are willing to break, and how much of a risk they are willing to take. Its a personal decision I think. The risk must be weighed against the consequences of not circulating this material. If seed banks here followed the letter of the law exactly, there would be no international seed banks: bad news for those CP threatened in habitat since they may not find a place in wide cultivation before their habitat is lost.

I raised these points in a phone conversation with a high APHIS official, and although he was sympathetic, he also stated that they were required to enforce the law, even though they were not tailored for hobby growers but rather for larger import operations. It took me over a week to reach anyone even minimally capable of answering my questions,and even that person finally said that all material and requests needed to be submitted each time a sending or import was considered.

Now, I wil confess. I have been known to send and receive seed without the legalities. I am not implying that you do the same: as I mentioned, there are fines, and if it involves CITES protected material, they are *hefty* fines of many thousands of dollars. My advice is in all regards DO NOT send CITES protected material internationally! If you elect to break the law, do so with candor: do not make public forum requests or solicitations that might bring unwanted attention to your activitiy. Use the PM option for your discussions.

As crimes go, sending CP seed isn't much of one. The real crime comes from habitat rape, and it is a shame that those who wish to preserve and cherish what otherwise would be wasted by an uncaring world should have to become crimminals to do so. But such IS the case, and there ARE no exceptions.
 
50-75 dollars for a phytosanitary certificate for one seed is correct... but be more specific... its more like one seed to 500 seed
smile_m_32.gif


[b said:
Quote[/b] ]My advice is in all regards DO NOT send CITES protected material internationally! If you elect to break the law, do so with candor: do not make public forum requests or solicitations that might bring unwanted attention to your activitiy. Use the PM option for your discussions.

What about seed like Drosera Capensis? Surely that is not CITES protected!
smile_m_32.gif
From what I've heard, you can export seed off the CITES list out of the USA, anywhere but new zealand and australlia, but you cant import ANY seed into the USA without all the certificates and permits etc etc...

You're right... you're posts are REALLY stuffed with meat!
smile_k_ani_32.gif
 
That is not correct, Spec. It doesn't matter if the seed is rare and protected or common as dirt. If you don't have the papers, and haven't contacted the authorities each time you send or import, you are not operating legally.
 
hmmmm thanks for the post Tamlin. i didnt realize seeds from non CITES listed were illegal to import......whoops
smile_n_32.gif
oh well i hope they grow well for me.

Rattler
 
Frankly I do my darndest not to realize it, just as most CPer's I know of. It's one of those laws that just happens to nip our segment of plantdom right in the bud.

I'm not trying to say do or not do, just be aware of what is real and watch the end you sit on.

LOL, I took a batch of gemmae to the post office last winter. The clerk there knows me and what I do, and asked me to tell everyone there what I was about. Rather embarassing considering things, but not a one of the clerks knew of any laws or restrictions and thought I was a hero. Once I was sent plants(!) from Australia in a box maked in 3 inch red letters LIVE PLANTS. The postman knocked on my door because he didn't want to leave the box out in the sun. It about gave me a heart attack though. Tell me the Power's aren't watching out for me!

Now, I am no fool, and I know that import and export are going to happen. There will always be those who's love will lead to these risks. Someday I will probably get a knock on the door, and will have to face the judge. I have some things to say if and when that happens, not that it will make any difference. Justice is blind.
 
One final word, if you decide to risk illegal import or export, do NOT attempt outright deception.  Once you mark a package and declare it's contents other than as what they are, you are in for a load of poo if it is intercepted.  This is tantamount to an admission of guilt.  Better to mark the package (only if it is required) as "Research material: no commercial value" and leave it be at that.  That goes for getting material as well as sending it.

Disclaimer: the views expressed above are my own and do not necessairly reflect the opinions of the owners of this Forum.
 
I should clarify the laws for Australia. We are allowed to recieve seed as long as it is clean (no flower material, dirt etc.), corectly labled with the correct botanical name, (Drosera capensis, not D. capensis) and is not on the prohibeted list like Genlisia or some of the aquatic Utrics. Mind you I have some nice "Drosera hispidula" growing at the moment.

All other plant matter is illegal to import without the proper paper work and quarantine facilities...

So feel free to send seeds to Australia!

Seandew should be able to clarify anything I have got wrong as he is incharge of inspecting the seeds as they come into the country!

There are no issues for sending seed out either.

George
 
Most countries do not have the restrictions Uncle Sammy hands us. It falls on each member to be aware of the import restrictions pertinent to their own country. I never even ask if it is legal for someone I am sending to to receive the seed: that is not my concern, and I assume that all is well or the request wouldn't have been made. When it all hits the fan, it isn't the sender that has any worries.

Since Australia has such harsh restrictions on live plant material coming in, I encourage everyone who can to PLEASE send seed to our mates there since it is the only way they can increase the circulation of non-native CP.
 
  • #10
Sadly, tis true; any seed of any plant must have papers, hoops, and $$ tendered to be brought into the USA legally.
 
  • #11
According to the APHIS guys who busted me, the only seed you need any paperwork for is N. rajah and N. khasiana.
Below is the whole email. I don't see anything about phyto mentioned....

I did not know the answer off the top of my head so I sent for an official
response. I hope this answers your questions. If not, let me know and I
will try to get further information. The response is as follows:

It depends on the species of Nepenthes. Two species of Nepenthes, N.
rajah, and N. khasiana, are in CITES Appendix I, the most restricted
category. Under Appendix I, all parts, including seeds, are regulated.
All other species of Nepenthes fall into CITES Appendix II and their seeds
are exempt from CITES regulation. The Appendix II listing of Nepenthes
spp. has the annotation #1 next to it. That annotation states the
following:

#1 Designates all parts and derivatives, except:
(a) seeds, spores, and pollen (including pollinia);
(b) seedling or tissue cultures obtained in vitro, in solid or liquid
media, transported in sterile containers; and
© cut flowers of artificially propagated plants.

The CITES website (http://www.cites.org) has a lot of good information,
including the list of species regulated in the CITES Appendices. The CITES
appendices also have what is called an "Interpretation" which describe the
annotations/footnotes.

Bud Petit de Mange
CITES and Plant Inspection Station Coordinator
USDA, APHIS, PPQ
4700 River Road, Unit 60
Riverdale, MD 20737






"Joe Griffin"
<joeg@brstores.co To: <James.B.Depue@aphis.usda.gov>
m> cc:
Subject: seed
11/10/2003 07:33
AM






Hi Jim,

Long time, no chat. I was wondering if you knew something off the top of
your head. Are seed of Nepenthes under the same restrictions as the plants,
ie is it illegal to mail Nepenthes seed with no CITES paperwork or permits?
I saw some Nepenthes seed on eBay and was curious*the seller was in
Singapore, I think).
Thanks,

Joe
 
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