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Taking suggestions
- Thread starter unknownclown
- Start date
jimscott
Tropical Fish Enthusiast
Gee, I thought you were going to ask about doing away with or combining the Fresh & Salt Forums.
Shelly, I wouldn't personally put a goldfish (non-tropical) with a Betta (tropical) in an unheated tank. While the goldfish can take a wide temperature extreme, a Betta should be in the 70-80 degree range. It is analogous to the CP plant cube combinations that Lowes does, by putting a VFT with a Darlingtonia with either a D. adelae or a P. primuliflora. they have differing requirements.
Can it be done? Yes, but it isn't the best combination. Do you have the typical tank set up with filter, pump, light, etc...?
Goldfish are also notoriously dirty and cloud up a tank in no time flat. Bettas, ironically, are what they call - anabantids. They can breathe atmospheric air. They naturally hail from stagnant rice paddies in SE Asia and have adapted to poor water quality.
Another thing to strongly consider is whether you are using a tank with an established filter medum. If so, the metabolic waste that they produce should be handled well enough. If you are emplacing a brand new filter in the tank, it is a set up for disaster because it needs to go through the nitrogen cycle (Ammonia->Nitrite->Nitrate). Water changes alone won't solve the situation. Once through the nitrogen cycle, then it will be safe to introduce other fish.
What would be the temperature for your area during winter? If it gets below 70, you run the risk of having ich killing the Betta and other fish - but not the goldfish. I know Washington State is more maritime in climate, but it is also a big State and you may not be on the Coast.
Shelly, I wouldn't personally put a goldfish (non-tropical) with a Betta (tropical) in an unheated tank. While the goldfish can take a wide temperature extreme, a Betta should be in the 70-80 degree range. It is analogous to the CP plant cube combinations that Lowes does, by putting a VFT with a Darlingtonia with either a D. adelae or a P. primuliflora. they have differing requirements.
Can it be done? Yes, but it isn't the best combination. Do you have the typical tank set up with filter, pump, light, etc...?
Goldfish are also notoriously dirty and cloud up a tank in no time flat. Bettas, ironically, are what they call - anabantids. They can breathe atmospheric air. They naturally hail from stagnant rice paddies in SE Asia and have adapted to poor water quality.
Another thing to strongly consider is whether you are using a tank with an established filter medum. If so, the metabolic waste that they produce should be handled well enough. If you are emplacing a brand new filter in the tank, it is a set up for disaster because it needs to go through the nitrogen cycle (Ammonia->Nitrite->Nitrate). Water changes alone won't solve the situation. Once through the nitrogen cycle, then it will be safe to introduce other fish.
What would be the temperature for your area during winter? If it gets below 70, you run the risk of having ich killing the Betta and other fish - but not the goldfish. I know Washington State is more maritime in climate, but it is also a big State and you may not be on the Coast.
FlytrapGurl
apple rings.. what more can i say?
elgecko
I've got a magic window!
unknownclown
BoooOOOOooooo!!!!!
um... ok the tank has been set up for over a year and theyve been fine so far...
I dont like gold fish either but since my daughter gave our last fish a half gallon of milk and juice to keep their bones strong and for whatever other reasons I thought gold fish were a good cheap replacement. now that shes a bit older Im thinkin about adding to the tank.
anyone know if one of them frogs would be ok?
I dont like gold fish either but since my daughter gave our last fish a half gallon of milk and juice to keep their bones strong and for whatever other reasons I thought gold fish were a good cheap replacement. now that shes a bit older Im thinkin about adding to the tank.
anyone know if one of them frogs would be ok?
For goldfish, a year doesn't speak too much, considering how long they can live. Goldfish just don't do well in small tanks. They get too big on the long run(well...its not really long run considering how fast they grow in good conditions).
The frogs would work(providing you had only that betta in the tank) as long as you kept the temperature up a bit. You probably wouldn't need a heater but simply take some precautions that the tank doesn't get cold.
I highly reccomend WCMM's. They can be very interesting little guys.
The frogs would work(providing you had only that betta in the tank) as long as you kept the temperature up a bit. You probably wouldn't need a heater but simply take some precautions that the tank doesn't get cold.
I highly reccomend WCMM's. They can be very interesting little guys.
jimscott
Tropical Fish Enthusiast
A frog? What kind of frog? would it be one of the ones you cancatch from outside or the kind they sell in the pet shops (African, Dwrf African, Albino African)? I would think that the frog and goldfish would do fine together, since they can take temperature extremes better. It's like a Sesame Street thing - one of these don't belong - and in this case it is the Betta. Having two separate tanks is the way to go.
Side note: Your avatar has changed. I like the pic that can no longer be seen in Suzanne's, "Well it's that time of year..." topic the best.
Another side note: Have you ever seen the movie entitled, "Killer Clowns From Outer Space"?
Side note: Your avatar has changed. I like the pic that can no longer be seen in Suzanne's, "Well it's that time of year..." topic the best.
Another side note: Have you ever seen the movie entitled, "Killer Clowns From Outer Space"?
ehhh i dunno about the frogs... i was actually just looking into that myself (African Dwarf) for my very lonely goldfish but everything i'm reading says that goldfish and dwarfs don't mix, and i can definitely see my fish trying to take a nibble out of one. also i *think* dwarf's like things a little warmer than goldfish. but if somebody knows better than me, do tell. i think the frogs are adorable and i'd love to add one to my 10-gal if i know he's not going to be attacked
since my poor otocinclus just passed, i was actually thinking about getting an apple snail to keep the goldfish company. i can't plant the tank anyway (goldfish), and even if Picasso gets a bit hungry/curious/stupid as goldfish are inclined to do, the snail has its own portable shelter. plus they take a huge range of temps, and do better in the cooler goldfish range. i like the yellow ones too, i think they'll add a nice bit of color to my tank. just an idea.
EDIT: PS- about the betta... if they're getting along fine, great, but the betta may be happier in its own bowl. honestly i keep one of mine in a $6 half gallon unheated bowl in a warm room and he's active as anything, making bubble nests every week. the other fish is in a 2-gallon semi-heated tank (one of those "explorer" models, i think the covered filter keeps it warmer than normal) and he's also extremely active and healthy. it would also give you more options for the goldfish tank... just because mr. betta tolerates the goldfish doesn't mean he'll like newcomers, and vice versa. bettas are notoriously fickle about tankmates.
since my poor otocinclus just passed, i was actually thinking about getting an apple snail to keep the goldfish company. i can't plant the tank anyway (goldfish), and even if Picasso gets a bit hungry/curious/stupid as goldfish are inclined to do, the snail has its own portable shelter. plus they take a huge range of temps, and do better in the cooler goldfish range. i like the yellow ones too, i think they'll add a nice bit of color to my tank. just an idea.
EDIT: PS- about the betta... if they're getting along fine, great, but the betta may be happier in its own bowl. honestly i keep one of mine in a $6 half gallon unheated bowl in a warm room and he's active as anything, making bubble nests every week. the other fish is in a 2-gallon semi-heated tank (one of those "explorer" models, i think the covered filter keeps it warmer than normal) and he's also extremely active and healthy. it would also give you more options for the goldfish tank... just because mr. betta tolerates the goldfish doesn't mean he'll like newcomers, and vice versa. bettas are notoriously fickle about tankmates.
jimscott
Tropical Fish Enthusiast
You can also get a female betta attempt to breed them. I was fortunate enough to do that with bettas, as well as other bubblenest builders when I was in high school. That's always a fun thing for kids to experience.
Moonflower, I personally never mixed the Dwarf African Frogs together. So my suggestion may have been amiss.
I was thinking in terms of tropical, vs. non-tropical. Would the frogs be too slow for a goldfish? I kow that they hang at the top of the tank. Maybe of some floating plants were provided?
Moonflower, I personally never mixed the Dwarf African Frogs together. So my suggestion may have been amiss.
jimscott- as far as i know... plants + goldfish = salad bar 
the little pigs eat nearly everything in sight. i honestly don't know exactly how the two species would interact, having never kept ADF's, but i know that goldfish are a) always hungry and b) not terribly smart so a little brown wiggly thing in the tank might look appetizing, and i don't know how well that would work. personally i can't try it... no room for the poor frog if things don't work out for some reason or another.
i have also heard that one of the problems with keeping frogs & fish together is that the goldfish will eat all the food before the frog ever gets there... goldfish find food by sight, and the frogs find it by smell which obviously take a bit longer. in my tank, bloodworms for the frog would be gone before you could say "yuck". if anyone tries the frog/fish setup they may want to keep that in mind as well... but unknownclown, if you've got a spare tank laying around in case of emergencies, you could definitely try the frog... i can't see it turning out too badly if you keep a close eye on things. plus frogs are just cool in general
i think i'm going to go with the apple snail myself. it's a bit of variety, doesn't take up much space, and has that handy Goldfish Defense System known as a shell. we shall see...
the little pigs eat nearly everything in sight. i honestly don't know exactly how the two species would interact, having never kept ADF's, but i know that goldfish are a) always hungry and b) not terribly smart so a little brown wiggly thing in the tank might look appetizing, and i don't know how well that would work. personally i can't try it... no room for the poor frog if things don't work out for some reason or another.i have also heard that one of the problems with keeping frogs & fish together is that the goldfish will eat all the food before the frog ever gets there... goldfish find food by sight, and the frogs find it by smell which obviously take a bit longer. in my tank, bloodworms for the frog would be gone before you could say "yuck". if anyone tries the frog/fish setup they may want to keep that in mind as well... but unknownclown, if you've got a spare tank laying around in case of emergencies, you could definitely try the frog... i can't see it turning out too badly if you keep a close eye on things. plus frogs are just cool in general
i think i'm going to go with the apple snail myself. it's a bit of variety, doesn't take up much space, and has that handy Goldfish Defense System known as a shell. we shall see...
jimscott
Tropical Fish Enthusiast
Heather, you have more experience than me in this area. I never kept the two together at home, nor had we, at the wholesaler, put the two together. You know your stuff!
Personally, I would ditch the goldfish and/or frog idea altogether and keep a tank of fancy guppies. That was always fun for me when I was a kid and it was about the only thing my daughter found to be entertaining enough, as a baby/toddler, to keep her from crying.
Shelly/Unknownclown, you may want to consider any of what I had when I was a kid: I had 8 tanks in our basement. one had livebearers, just having at it. Another had Water Sprite. Another was for a breeding pair of Convict Cichlids. Anothetr for a breeding pair of Jewel Cichlids. The rest were devoted to breeding Bettas, Paradise Fish, Pearl Leeries, Dwarf, Blue, and Thicklipped Gouramis. Kids like to see baby fish.
Heather/Moonflower, have you ever had Ramshorn or Albino snails?
(I don't know what to call you two!)
Personally, I would ditch the goldfish and/or frog idea altogether and keep a tank of fancy guppies. That was always fun for me when I was a kid and it was about the only thing my daughter found to be entertaining enough, as a baby/toddler, to keep her from crying.
Shelly/Unknownclown, you may want to consider any of what I had when I was a kid: I had 8 tanks in our basement. one had livebearers, just having at it. Another had Water Sprite. Another was for a breeding pair of Convict Cichlids. Anothetr for a breeding pair of Jewel Cichlids. The rest were devoted to breeding Bettas, Paradise Fish, Pearl Leeries, Dwarf, Blue, and Thicklipped Gouramis. Kids like to see baby fish.
Heather/Moonflower, have you ever had Ramshorn or Albino snails?
(I don't know what to call you two!)
I would take the goldfish out, give it its own 20 gallon tank, and leave the betta by itself in the 10 gallon.
the tank is too small as it is for those 2 fish, adding more fish would overstock it further..
and those 2 fish are not very compatable to begin with.
the betta should have a heater, kept at 78 degrees:
http://honors.montana.edu/~weif/firsttank/betta.phtml
the goldfish shouldnt have a heater at all..
very incompatle fish..should never be in the same tank..
Scot
the tank is too small as it is for those 2 fish, adding more fish would overstock it further..
and those 2 fish are not very compatable to begin with.
the betta should have a heater, kept at 78 degrees:
http://honors.montana.edu/~weif/firsttank/betta.phtml
the goldfish shouldnt have a heater at all..
very incompatle fish..should never be in the same tank..
Scot
heheh just an added note... see my post on "stingray plecos" for another idea
and jimscott... i had a few golden apple snail years ago, when i believed the line "oh yeah they live off the algae in the tank, nothing else". a few years' experience and several pet stores later, i *might* try one again! right now i'm really liking the hillstream loach idea, although if i find that it won't overstock my tank i might just go for both.
oh to have the room/time/money for limitless fish tanks...
and jimscott... i had a few golden apple snail years ago, when i believed the line "oh yeah they live off the algae in the tank, nothing else". a few years' experience and several pet stores later, i *might* try one again! right now i'm really liking the hillstream loach idea, although if i find that it won't overstock my tank i might just go for both.
oh to have the room/time/money for limitless fish tanks...
jimscott
Tropical Fish Enthusiast
FlytrapGurl
apple rings.. what more can i say?
Apple snails can get as big as apples and crap constantly. I've had many, and I loved them, but, like I said, they crap constantly, and that adds to the high amount of ammonia a goldfish would already be creating in the water.3
Apple snails eat almost anything.. algae, fish food, dead fish, etc.
Apple snails eat almost anything.. algae, fish food, dead fish, etc.
