What's new
TerraForums Venus Flytrap, Nepenthes, Drosera and more talk

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

LAWD! LAWD!

  • Thread starter Bugweed
  • Start date
  • #21
Aaarrghghh !!! I thought we kept that Illinois / Hillary link underwraps. I'm still writing in my first 3 choices. Benevolent, conservationalistic dictatorship. It's got a certain ring to it. I can hear it now... "and I'll put a destroyed location sarr. in every pot !"
 
  • #22
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Can you show me a sucessful male politician(meaning, one who has held office) who doesn't live by these words? Good lord, that's funny.

Didn't say I could! Which support what I'm saying: there's far to much "crowd pleasing" going on. Heck, I don't mind a woman being a president. If a woman represented my feelings better than her male competitor (and I was allowed to vote at all) I'd vote for the woman. My last issue with Hilary would be that she's a woman- my first and foremost that she's a politician that acts like all the other politicians.

I'm not glorifying the people you compare her to, just saying she's just and bad as many other politicians, and I wouldn't mind if I had nothing to do with her. Ya know?

Without getting all cynical and shout-y about it: I've got no reason to want to see women treated unequally. I've experienced my fair share of prejudice as an immigrant, thank you.
The bottom line: don't care about the race or gender, I care about the message- saying otherwise is an unfounded, and rather ridiculous claim.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]And quite frankly, I don't know a single person, republican, democrat or independent, that checks with their party to see how they themselves should feel about the issues.

God bless you and your town!
laugh.gif
 
  • #23
EST got it right! It's about the message. When looking at candidates, we should look at the issues, not the sex. No, not that kind of sex Ozzy! I don't know how accurate this site is, but I found it interesting. Here's Hillary on the issues:
http://www.issues2002.org/Hillary_Clinton.htm

And here's Condee:
http://www.issues2002.org/Condoleezza_Rice.htm

Hmmm, looks like Condee's got some catching up to do! Hillary has an opinion about everything; Ms. Rice appears to have little on record, even pertaining to her own job. I admit that this site may not be completely up-to-date, but it does have info up to 2005.
 
  • #24
April, i dont like Hillary and i didnt like her husband, i dont like Bush either. personally i would vote for any person who set out to reduce the size of our idiotic government. i could care less what party or sex or race the idividual is. if they set out on a platform to reduce the number of idiots my tax dollars have to pay salarys for i would be happy as all get out. oh and they would have to go back to the constitution(see my sig line)
 
  • #25
It's not just my town, it's people who live all over....believe it or not, we're not all sheep out here. We can think for ourselves.

My issues with Hillary are not that she's allegedly carpetbagger, or strident, or manly, or not sufficiently subservient to her husband, or whatever BS issues the right/religious right comes up with...my issue with her is that she's a centrist.  To paraphrase Jim Hightower..the only things to be found in the middle of the road are dead skunks and yellow dogs.

As the link you sent shows..she has voted with right wing Republicans many, many times, and it's high time that the Democratic Party stopped tolerating that.  It's time for Democrats to stop being "Republican Light." Democrats need to represent a clear, line in the sand choice.

I don't want anything or anyone that even remotely smells like a Republican representing me. And in Illinois, for now, we have succeeded.
 
  • #26
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]As the link you sent shows..she has voted with right wing Republicans many, many times, and it's high time that the Democratic Party stopped tolerating that. It's time for Democrats to stop being "Republican Light." Democrats need to represent a clear, line in the sand choice.

What I'm about to say has nothing to do with Hilary, this is just to prove my point.

This is what I was talking about. I don't know what Hillary voted for or against. I would assume she voted for what she thought was right. This is why I am against both parties, you can't vote for what you think is right, you have to vote for what the rest of your party believes. I'm sorry but if I was in congress or the senate, I would vote for what I felt was right, not what my party told me too. I have a brain and I will look at a situation and decide for myself if I believe in a certain issue or not.
April, you said that not all of you are sheep, but what you said sounds to me that you believe that we should all follow the Democratic party just like sheep do.
This is the same issue I have with Peta, Greenpeace, the NRA, etc. Instead of looking at what is right or wrong they only see thier own side.

Issuse are not always black or white, sometimes both sides may have a element of right. There is a song that says, "I don't see things in black and white, I see things in wrong and right"
 
  • #27
Rattler,

Some of the "idiots" you pay the salary of may be your neighbors. I'm not anti-government. After all..the government makes sure your roads are safe to drive on, your food is safe to eat, your air is safe to breathe, your cars are safe to drive in, your mail gets delivered, your water is safe to drink, your taxes are not above your ability to pay them, your old age is not lived in abject poverty, armed gangs don't roam your streets, firemen will put out your house if it's on fire, your military defends you, your policemen defend you, your wildlands are sometimes preserved, art that you may or may not enjoy is preserved, museums are funded, schools are funded, disaster relief is funded, hospitals are funded, emergency rooms are funded, medical research is funded, road building is funded, airports are funded, and the security and air traffic controller personnel to employ them, and public transportation, etc., etc., etc.
 
  • #28
I think it looks like so many people are spoonfed opinions by their party because that's how the media makes it seem. There's no such thing as individuals in the media... just "republicans", "democrats", "blacks", "whites", yada yada yada... spoken of as if they were single unified hive-minds or something.

And personally I don't think gender or race are even close to being relevant criteria for a political office... so irrelevant they aren't even worth talking about. Does anyone know how many green-eyed presidents we've had? Does anyone care?
 
  • #29
No, Ozzy, I said I would work for the more progressive local and national candidates. I said this fully realising that progressive(liberal) democrats and regular democrats are not the same creatures. Lieberman and Clinton are Republican Light candidates. Lieberman should probably switch parties, it would be more honest. Personally, I voted for Kucinich,and I'd love to see Feingold run for President. I'm even kind of hinky about Barak Obama...he's way too nice to the opposing party...when there's so much to go after.

We're really on the same side, Ozzy.
 
  • #30
Im glad hillary is such a centrist. i have been watching rather closely and several of her ideas have become more... moderated, but most havnt changes sice she has been in a presedential hopefull. What she stands for most closely approxomates my beleifs better than any other candidtate

i hope she wins

so shoot me
 
  • #31
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]It's not just my town, it's people who live all over....believe it or not, we're not all sheep out here. We can think for ourselves.

No need to make further insinuations. I don't believe all people are sheep (who'da thunk?!) I am merely making an observation of something which I have seen and noted. I neither accused you, or anyone else here of being a "sheep."
 
  • #32
BAAAAAA
 
  • #33
April:

Firefighters: only have a local volenteer service, i donate greatly to them, not much of my tax dollars fund them so when they have a raffel or a banquet or such i buy a ticket or two. they saved my house once. not to mention we give them a break on any printing we do for them at the shop. i also buy the guys a beer when they are out having a few when i am, these guys have my upmost respect.

Police officers: mostly paid by my tax dollars, have minimal beef with the locals, most of the feds are useless, especially the FBI idiots we have stationed locally.

Military: no problem with funding them as long as there isnt an idiot in the office. unfortunatly they are spread thinner than i would like at the moment

Schools: mainly local taxes, no beef, infact i voted to increase my taxes several time to help out the school my step kids go to as they needed the funding. really wish the ACLU would stay out of stuff, they have out lived their usefulness.

i have no issues with bout half the stuff my taxes go to however i have issues with aany govenment job such as those dealing with the Patriot act, the no child left behind act, the ATF is about useless and mostly unconstitutional, the boarder patrol is largly ineffective also ect ect ect

we have lost the war on drugs, the money should be directed twords helping those who want it instead of imprisoning those using them moderatly in their homes.

having a rifle with a barrel 16 inches long is legal, but at 15 and 7/8 inches its a felony(technically though its evading a $200 tax but you will be imprisoned for a long time)

as far as those ppl being my neighbors, we are looking for a decent office gal at the papaer and are paying decent for the area yet cant find anyone, im sure one of those layed off could easily get an honest job at the newspaper.
 
  • #34
Mr. Omnipotent here again.
Just a reminder that you all were warned about the dangers of politcal factions.

The alternate domination of one faction over another, sharpened by the spirit of revenge, natural to party dissension, which in different ages and countries has perpetrated the most horrid enormities, is itself a frightful despotism. But this leads at length to a more formal and permanent despotism. The disorders and miseries, which result, gradually incline the minds of men to seek security and repose in the absolute power of an individual; and sooner or later the chief of some prevailing faction, more able or more fortunate than his competitors, turns this disposition to the purposes of his own elevation, on the ruins of Public Liberty.


Just for all of you who show party loyalty above the common good of the nation, you are the the destroyers. I promise that you will be reincarnated as bugs that will be eaten by carnivorous plants.

Bonus karma points for those that actually know their american history and recognize who said this and when.

Sincerely,
Creator of everything (except reality TV)
 
  • #35
George Washington, and it's an excerpt from his farewell speech. Sometime, when you have a spare hour, you should read the whole thing.

Since some of you have SO MUCH against political parties, and are quite willing to paint their followers with extremely wide brushes...could any of you political geniuses please be so kind as to name me some alternatives? I'd like to check them out! Please don't tell me Ralph Nader is one of them.
 
  • #36
[b said:
Quote[/b] (aprilh @ Mar. 01 2006,10:56)]George Washington, and it's an excerpt from his farewell speech. Sometime, when you have a spare hour, you should read the whole thing.

Since some of you have SO MUCH against political parties, and are quite willing to paint their followers with extremely wide brushes...could any of you political geniuses please be so kind as to name some alternatives? Please don't tell me Ralph Nader is one of them.
I have read it, quite a few times actually.

The alternative is to stop voting for extermists, of any party. If a person is not capable of being understanding, intellegent and use a certain amount of wisdom when it comes to dealing with all walks of life then he shouldn't be elected.
On that note people who are willing to vote for unbending , self agrandising, incompetents, are no better. If you want to vote for someone because your minister said so, you are just as bad if you vote for someone because your union leaders said do. Get a brain and research your candidates of all parties. Even tree hugging, pro life, log cabin, born again pagans.

I still admit that elections with the current cronies (the kingmakers not the candidates) make elections a situation where a person is forced to choose the voting for the lesser evil.

Remember at one point in this country the President got the most votes and the vice president was th person with the second most votes. I would also recommend looking into the disbanding of the electoral college.

The citzens of this country have right to completly screw it up with who they vote for. And it is the right of others to point out their incompetence.

Sincerely,
Creator of everything in six days

but my watch is not like yours
 
  • #37
Ha. The only use of political parties at this point is to fund the election campaign for their chosen one.

The independants don't have a shot because there really isn't anyone to foot the bill when they want to get their views out.

My take on the parties, though is that on some issues, the dems are right. On some, the repubs are. On MOST issues, NEITHER party has the monopoly on the right, but it really does lie somewhere in the middle. Problem with that is this: compromise is a difficult thing. I have enough problems just coming to compromises with my wife, and we're just two people, not two parties.
 
  • #38
compromise with my wife is easy, she understands that i have an addiction to firearms and i understand that she is going to thump me occationally because of purchases due to said addiction
smile_n_32.gif
smile_m_32.gif
 
  • #39
Schloaty has it right. The basis of the dysfunction in our political system is the way campaigns are financed and politicians bought. There is a huge statistical correlation with the amount of money spent and who wins elections. Our system as it stands is designed to give corporations a huge, indeed defining influence in who gets on ballots and who gets elected. Those politicians then represent the interests of those corporations on their donor list, and not the rest of us.

This infects both parties equally, and is a non-partisan problem. People intuitively feel a disconnect between their problems and issues and the politicians that represent them. At this point, people are used to not being represented in government. It's sad, and it won't stop until we are able to remove the corporate financing of campaigns.

Capslock
 
  • #40
I have a lot of friends I like to argue with about politics, both republican and democrat out here. We have been talking about yet another blatant lie told by our Head Nitwit, George. We all have agreed, the people in the parties are not the problem. The leadership of those parties, both repub or demo, leave too much to be desired. We are all thinking about independant parties that speak to our own particular political ideas. I guess a lot of us ARE getting tired of all this useless drivel dropping from the lackaleaderships lips. We are beginning to think a REAL change is what we need to stop this Killing of America. How long do you people want these greedy, lying , useless people to "rule" us? KICK'EM TO THE CURB!!!!
 
Back
Top