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Maybe the U.S. should hold talks with Iran

  • #21
OOoohhh Ok I see now. Thanks for clearing that up!
 
  • #22
[b said:
Quote[/b] (mabudon @ Dec. 13 2006,1:07)]With the current butt-whipping the insurgents in Iraq are laying on the US military, that option was taken off the table.
A couple of sucker-punch I.E.D.'s and crazy-Suicide Bombers a day does Not make it that our military is getting their "butt-whooped" look at the operation of Fallujah and tell me that the US Military got their "butt-whooped" there.
Pssshhh....
 
  • #23
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]While the world waits for Iran to do something really stupid, the US has done one stupid thing after another. Anyway, Iran's leader denies the holocaust happened and ours denies global warmiing is happening. It's a draw.

This's the nth time I've seen this argument, and I frankly fail to see the connect. Reasonable people can and have and DO argue against global warming. There are some clever people on each side of the debate. However, a resonable person can not be expected to deny historical fact. I don't like to nitpick people's analogies because it's difficult to make a perfect one. However, this agrees with the point that ignoring that the Holocaust ever happened is pretty stupid.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Iran also is saying it's Nuclear program is for "peaceful purposes" and are purposely manipulating the negotiations to their favor to buy time until they say "surprise, look what we got" and promptly give one to Hezzbullah to nuke Israel and to smuggle one into the US and maybe Europe by way of some unknown Terrorist group to wait for the signal.

Sources for any claims?

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]I was overexaggerating about the trees
smile.gif
. I just think it's funny that everything is the cause of Global Warming. Just like everything is the cause of cancer.

All of this posting is giving me cancer.
sad.gif
Think I should sue someone?
wink.gif.gif


[b said:
Quote[/b] ] If they wanted the power thenthey shouldn't have a problem with the UN running it. Or build them a reactor that uses something else for the reaction that has no waist left.

After a nuclear reactor has been going for a while you can get the plutonium needed for atomics from the control rods. Solution: No control rods allowed! Anyone else smell a brilliant plan?
tounge.gif


[b said:
Quote[/b] ]The sad thing is that I have operated on a lady in her 30's or 40's who never smoke drank or did anything to cause cancer. We had to operate on her for lung, liver and stomach cancer. So hell you only live once. If you don;t do any of those things you still could end up with cancer and die.

Ah, but I wouldn't use that as a justification to go out and do things that increase my risk. My genetics dictate that I have a 50-50 chance of getting Graves or Hashimoto's disease (overactive and underactive thyroid, respectively) but that doesn't mean it's a good idea to go hang around a radioactive site because "who cares if my thyroid takes in some radiation? It might have problems later in life anyway."
So I can agree on the "we only live once, live your life well, yadda yadda" I just wanted to clarify that if you use that as an excuse... Well, don't complain that your one life was cut short.

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Pootin is becoming more and more like a dictator himself. It is scary.

But what other leader has replied to questions asked to him about Cthulhu or suggested that they guard their boarders with giant robots? Putin <3
tounge.gif



I always need to think back to the whole Iran-Contra Scandal from during the Reagan administration. I mean, are there any reasons left for us to wonder why there's problems? Not saying the US is the root of all evil or the source of all the troubles or any of that BS, but if you take a gander back at history, some of the stuff going on is explained.

If you don't know what the Iran-Contra Scandal is all about, then you should read up on it. It's a double-whopper of illegal practices. Good thing several of the convicted fellons from the scandal serve in the current administration. lol
 
  • #24
It goes beyond the Iran-Contra Scandal.Did you know about the now-admitted covert operation of the CIA called Operation Ajax in the 50's that destroyed the democracy of Iran to restore a politically friendly dictator? The US and Britain helped organize protests to overthrow the unfriendly president and return the Shah who previously ruled the country  to Iran.  Iran's fledgling attempts at democracy quickly descended into dictatorship, as the Shah dismantled the constitutional limitations on his office and began to rule as an absolute monarch.
(wikipedia had a good article about that, where i got some of my information from)
Google Operation Ajax!
Because its not a democracy unless they are freindly to the US
 
  • #25
Denying the holocoucst should have absolutly no bearing on if we talk with a country or not. Period. It would be like if we said Germany does not dicusse the holocoust so we should cut all ties with Germany. Im not saying the Holocoust didnt happen, infact I know it did, I have it from first hand accounts of people who liberated the camps, but this is not the issue we are discussing.

The fact that the president will not talk with Iran im sure is part of his "crusade" and his move tword "rightification" in the middle east. The problem is we as a nation are treating Iraq and other countries in the middle east like they are islands which is completely unrealistic. You can drive across most countries in the middle east in less than 6 hours. well not Iran, but most of them. We need to start treating the middle east as an interacting group of countries, which means we need to talk with Iran, Syria, Jordan, Saudia Arabia, Oman, etc. and have them all discuss the problems in Iraq to help bring an end to the violence. Remeber these countries dont want a civil war in Iraq either as this would destablize their own governments.

Also Iran is more likely playing a game of bluff with the nuclear weapons. They would not use them nor let anyone else use them. The government of Iran is fairly unstable at this point, including have demonstrations against president Ahmadinejad which means there is a chance anything they let out of their control could be used against them or someone other than Isreal or the United States, both of whom would respond in kind if anything like that happened. Iran wouldnt give the weapons to Hezbollah as they are a fairly unstalbe organization and they are currently busy trying to over throw the democratically elected government, which we can all than Isreal for.

I personally think that talks with Iran and Syria would be a good first step to improving our relations with both countries and the rest of the Arab world.
 
  • #26
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Denying the holocoucst should have absolutly no bearing on if we talk with a country or not
No but it shows a strong ability to ignore basic facts that are inconvenient to their soapboxes. If they can do it here, they can do it again.

And i feel it would be folly to assume that bluff/ rhetorical mishmash or whatever that they spout should be ignored. They want to be taken seriously, and we have no way to know for certain where they are bluffing and where they are serious. Because some of it MIGHT be bluff is no reason to take their claims less seriously. It would be wise to take a more pragmatic approach to the situation so we dont find out later that we got it all wrong... again.
 
  • #27
EST Someone on this board was saying his father just designed a nuclear reactor that used something other than the currect technology that would use up the rods completely. It was a different type of reactor for generating electricity. I don't remember who said it. That was the type of reactor I was saying build for them. One that doesn't have the control rods left after the reaction is spent.

Yes I remember something about operation Ajax. I didn't know the name of the operation, but I remember something about it. We did cause alot of this mess over there. No doubt about it. Yet you cannot work on a compromise with only one side willing to negotiate. I don't believe Iran is ready to give in a little.

Even if Iran's statements are a bluff. You still have to consider how far they are willing to take that bluff and at what point does it turn from a bluff to oh crap here it comes! Dude personaly I am living right next to a highvalue target. SRS (Savannah River Site) ,where they make some of the component to warheads, is less than 50 miles from me. That is why the russia stuff scares me. I live around ground zero. I am sure terrorists consider it a high value target too. If that place goes boom then a large area does too. Not to mention A nuke plant vogal is close buy too.

Nukes are a pandora's box that was opened.
 
  • #28
How do we know how willing Iran is to give a little if we wont even talk with them. Remember we are the ones who refuse to talk to them not the other way around. Last time i checked we didnt send requests for talks to Iran and have theme refuse them.

I agree nuclear weapons are the worst invention humans ever came up with, next to agriculture. But what has been unleashed on the world can not be undone. Maybe if we would actully sit down and talk with Iran they would suspend their nuclear program, however everytime the worlds discusses it they seem to forget to send an invitation to Iran. Wouldnt it help if we could talk with them. Talking in this manner does not cause millions of deaths, not doing so could.

We have a bad enough relationship with the Arab world due to our support of Isreal, we need to talk with them and reach some understanding, unless you believe we should continue our presidents "cursade" against the Arabs/Muslims which ever group it is that he seems to hate. It as simple as this dialog can lead to understanding for both sides, understanding often times leads to conflict resoultion that is fair for both sides with out tons of bombs being droped everywhere. Basically its like we are having a shouting match between the two leaders in a crowded room so no one is getting a good understanding of the other so problems arise. We need to meet in the middle and discuss the problem.

Also someone mentioned that Iran wouldnt allow the UN to inspect its plants, well at first it agree to weapons inspectors in its enrichment facilities but our brilliant president said no that wasnt enough and so Iran decided fine we wont let them in since its going to make no difference to the idiot running America. So basically this problem is all George W.'s fault for trying to run the world like the little dictator he wants to be.
 
  • #29
I'm starting to hate everyone (no... not the jews.. they rock...) Im starting not to care. It's all I ever hear. Then again no one makes me watch CNN.

Lol, maybe i'm addicted to the news because subconciously i enjoy getting pissed off lol. I'm a little Lewis Black lol

I wish people would stop pissing the world off with the nuclear BS! We could kill them ALL and destroy EVERYTHING if we really wanted to, but they know we never will.

Dudes I dunno what i'm saying. I'm just sick of these ignorant little pieces of crap in the middle east and in the whitehouse and in congress. i'm sick of their BS.
 
  • #30
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]I'm starting to hate everyone (no... not the jews.. they rock...) Im starting not to care. It's all I ever hear. Then again no one makes me watch CNN.

Like the great Bob Ross once said

"We want happy paintings. Happy paintings. If you want sad things, watch the news."

Go to youtube and watch a few episodes of the Joys of Painting. That can placate pretty much any mood or temperment. lol I <3 Bob Ross, may he rest in peace.
 
  • #31
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
How do we know how willing Iran is to give a little if we wont even talk with them. Remember we are the ones who refuse to talk to them not the other way around. Last time i checked we didnt send requests for talks to Iran and have theme refuse them.

Why should we appease and make deals with terrorists?

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
I agree nuclear weapons are the worst invention humans ever came up with, next to agriculture. But what has been unleashed on the world can not be undone. Maybe if we would actully sit down and talk with Iran they would suspend their nuclear program, however everytime the worlds discusses it they seem to forget to send an invitation to Iran. Wouldnt it help if we could talk with them. Talking in this manner does not cause millions of deaths, not doing so could.

Your naive in believing they will stop their nuclear program. They have already made clear statements that they will not be bullied and believe it is their right to nuclear technology. Also do you believe it is in the best interests of Iran if Iraq becomes a free democracy that supports anti-terrorism?

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
We have a bad enough relationship with the Arab world due to our support of Isreal, we need to talk with them and reach some understanding, unless you believe we should continue our presidents "cursade" against the Arabs/Muslims which ever group it is that he seems to hate. It as simple as this dialog can lead to understanding for both sides, understanding often times leads to conflict resoultion that is fair for both sides with out tons of bombs being droped everywhere. Basically its like we are having a shouting match between the two leaders in a crowded room so no one is getting a good understanding of the other so problems arise. We need to meet in the middle and discuss the problem.

Why is it that the Arab world hates us for supporting Israel? Because we believe Israel has the right to exist? Our President is on a crusade against all Muslims because he has hatred for them? That is just wrong. The enemies we fight are Islamofascists:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamofascism

It is just distasteful to the peaceful Muslim majority to claim they are the problem and our president hates them!

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
Also someone mentioned that Iran wouldnt allow the UN to inspect its plants, well at first it agree to weapons inspectors in its enrichment facilities but our brilliant president said no that wasnt enough and so Iran decided fine we wont let them in since its going to make no difference to the idiot running America. So basically this problem is all George W.'s fault for trying to run the world like the little dictator he wants to be.

.....I'm sorry but you can't just open shop and create nuclear materials. Iran clearly knows they have violated international law and to this day continue enrichment. Our wonderful dictator is just doing his job trying to prevent crazy maniacs such as the President of Iran from hand delivering nuclear bombs to Hezbollah! Are you that eager to see Israel perish?
 
  • #32
Is that the afro dude?

God I miss him...

"happy trees..we'll just put a few happy little trees right there"


As for Isreal to perish.. no. I'm eager for them to treat palistinians like human beings and give them back their land. OR I'm ready for them to creat a new, secular nation.
 
  • #33
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]With the current butt-whipping the insurgents in Iraq are laying on the US military, that option was taken off the table.
  You are of course, entitled to your opinion.  However, I would love to see you say that, face to face, to some of our troops over there.  Talk about a butt-wuppin'.
nononono.gif
 
bigsmile.gif
 
  • #34
Oh, that's cute, a veiled threat of violence- I would just wait til they come home, and keep it quiet and respectful, the troops on the ground can't help that they've been sent to support a useless effort, and if the "proud American military" is so barbaric as to beat up civilians for telling the truth to their face then I don't see what there is to be proud of-

The US military is getting their arse handed to them, sure slow and painful like, but it'sbeing handed over day by day and I am saddened by it, I have a couple of friends in the service and fear that they may be asked to die for nothing,too.

I'm sure some folks don't wanna believe that the US military is on a fools errand, but history will prove this to be the case

Oh and lauderdale, I'd like to see YOU say that BS, smart-arsed little statement to in front of ME
biggrin.gif
 
  • #35
Let's not make generalizations please. I find the torture of civilians desgusting, aswell as this war, too. Let's remember that those "soldiers" are a minority.
 
  • #36
Re-read the whole post man, the part about not wanting my friends in service of the US military dying for nothing- just the smug pride with which my beating was assured by the previous poster really got my goat, the servicemen I know are all totally solid folks and I imagine most of the rest of them are the same, never meant to imply anything, just highlighting how some citizens would like to see other citizens injured by the US military for thinking Iraq is a lost cause which is pretty much what the Baker Report said in a nutshell, why don't the troops start by beating up James Baker for telling the truth??
See, it's ridiculous, that was all I was sayin
 
  • #37
My apologies.
 
  • #38
[b said:
Quote[/b] (mabudon @ Dec. 15 2006,10:13)]Re-read the whole post man, the part about not wanting my friends in service of the US military dying for nothing- just the smug pride with which my beating was assured by the previous poster really got my goat, the servicemen I know are all totally solid folks and I imagine most of the rest of them are the same, never meant to imply anything, just highlighting how some citizens would like to see other citizens injured by the US military for thinking Iraq is a lost cause which is pretty much what the Baker Report said in a nutshell, why don't the troops start by beating up James Baker for telling the truth??
See, it's ridiculous, that was all I was sayin
The Baker report is not the final answer but rather an outside opinion. You know about opinions...
wink.gif.gif
 
  • #39
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Outsiders71 @ Dec. 15 2006,10:35)]The Baker report is not the final answer but rather an outside opinion.  You know about opinions...
wink.gif.gif
No, could you explain?
slap.gif
 
  • #40
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Outsiders71 @ Dec. 15 2006,4:23)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
How do we know how willing Iran is to give a little if we wont even talk with them. Remember we are the ones who refuse to talk to them not the other way around. Last time i checked we didnt send requests for talks to Iran and have theme refuse them.

Why should we appease and make deals with terrorists?

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
I agree nuclear weapons are the worst invention humans ever came up with, next to agriculture. But what has been unleashed on the world can not be undone. Maybe if we would actully sit down and talk with Iran they would suspend their nuclear program, however everytime the worlds discusses it they seem to forget to send an invitation to Iran. Wouldnt it help if we could talk with them. Talking in this manner does not cause millions of deaths, not doing so could.

Your naive in believing they will stop their nuclear program. They have already made clear statements that they will not be bullied and believe it is their right to nuclear technology. Also do you believe it is in the best interests of Iran if Iraq becomes a free democracy that supports anti-terrorism?

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
We have a bad enough relationship with the Arab world due to our support of Isreal, we need to talk with them and reach some understanding, unless you believe we should continue our presidents "cursade" against the Arabs/Muslims which ever group it is that he seems to hate. It as simple as this dialog can lead to understanding for both sides, understanding often times leads to conflict resoultion that is fair for both sides with out tons of bombs being droped everywhere. Basically its like we are having a shouting match between the two leaders in a crowded room so no one is getting a good understanding of the other so problems arise. We need to meet in the middle and discuss the problem.

Why is it that the Arab world hates us for supporting Israel? Because we believe Israel has the right to exist? Our President is on a crusade against all Muslims because he has hatred for them? That is just wrong. The enemies we fight are Islamofascists:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamofascism

It is just distasteful to the peaceful Muslim majority to claim they are the problem and our president hates them!

[b said:
Quote[/b] ]
Also someone mentioned that Iran wouldnt allow the UN to inspect its plants, well at first it agree to weapons inspectors in its enrichment facilities but our brilliant president said no that wasnt enough and so Iran decided fine we wont let them in since its going to make no difference to the idiot running America. So basically this problem is all George W.'s fault for trying to run the world like the little dictator he wants to be.

.....I'm sorry but you can't just open shop and create nuclear materials. Iran clearly knows they have violated international law and to this day continue enrichment. Our wonderful dictator is just doing his job trying to prevent crazy maniacs such as the President of Iran from hand delivering nuclear bombs to Hezbollah! Are you that eager to see Israel perish?
First how are you defining terrorists? Last time I checked all of the people who have attacked america in terrorist acts were from countries other than Iran. If you are defining it as groups like Hamas, well I consider them people trying to liberate their country, unless of course you considered the french resistance in WWII a terrorists group, in which case I may agree with you.

Also I never said we should appeaze them I said we should talk to them, last time I talked with someone I dont remember that being seen as me appeazing them and giving in to them. And if we dont talk to them how do we know they will not stop, again your talking about two people releasing public statements to each other without actully talking to each other.

As for why the Arab world hates us for supporting Isreal it could have something to do with their ethnic cleansing of Palestinans from Palestine.

As for our president, he doesnt seem to indicate much differnece between all muslims and terrorists. Just using the word cursade is an indication of his insensativity and lack of respect for the Muslim world. And im not claming all Muslims are the problem, infact I have many friends who are Muslim and if I believed in a god I would also be Muslim, however I am agnostic, but thats byside the point. I never made that claim so dont try to pin it on me.

Oh you can just start creating Nuclear material, then why arent we attacking India, Pakistan, Isreal, South Africa, and China who have all developed nuclear weapons in violation of International law. We can pick and choose when to enforce laws. Oh wait thats right if they are friends of the United States then its ok, or if they arent Muslim well then we will just sweep that one under the rug. See what I mean with our president, he chooses to find fault with teh muslims but not the rest of the world.
 
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