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Elderly gunman kills guard at Holocaust Museum

  • Thread starter swords
  • Start date
  • #21
No, I'm just razzing Rattler. I don't follow a religion of any sort other than seeking to follow my own true will. What makes me happy today is what I shall do today.

Assalaam Alikum - I know the greeting though!

I work with some Somali muslims, we've hung out together outside of work on occasion. I find it enjoyable to converse with people of different backgrounds and share ideas.


Now there my POV, I was waiting for someone to say it lol As long as my 'happiness' doesnt do anyone or anything harm then I do it :)
And I love experiencing different cultures. My muslim mom's friend makes some KILLER food with couscous! Wish I had some right now :drool:
 
  • #22
was stating we are supposed to be in a war against terrorism.....someone who calls himself a terrorist kills two Americans on American soil and very few seem to pay attention to it including the major media......

Once again, the man who murdered the abortion doctor fits this description as well. On difference was the colour of his skin, and the name of his religion. I didn't happen to catch the piece that you're talking about, but I only just barely caught the whole abortion doc thing, but I know that was a big newspiece. (It's amazing that one can spend their time learning only to become ignorant of the things going on around them...)

as for the second part.....yah might want to take a poll from all the other mods before yah ask me to do that ive got a real good one but its libel to turn into a week long brawl with some here

Note my criteria; "interesting and discussion-worthy." Something that is incendiary and posted for the sake of starting a ruckus is trolling/flamebait -- this is not something that is discussion-worthy. That's why I don't like it when people post news stories without any of their own commentary. As for asking the other mods: you have the same rights as any other member here; neither extended nor abridged. If you post something stupid, you'll be in as much trouble as Swords would, or I would, or anyone else. But if other folks can post news, you can post news too; just don't abuse it (we've had it happen in the past. It's boring and stupid.)
 
  • #23
The "war on terrorism" ended a few months ago. It's called "Overseas Contingency Operation" now. I'm still gloating about Obama's victory!


was stating we are supposed to be in a war against terrorism.....someone who calls himself a terrorist kills two Americans on American soil and very few seem to pay attention to it including the major media......

as for the second part.....yah might want to take a poll from all the other mods before yah ask me to do that :D ive got a real good one but its libel to turn into a week long brawl with some here :D
 
  • #24
ESt....not necessarily inflammatory, actually personally i dont think it is at all, it just further makes a point ive been stabbing home on past discussions.....but its a subject that has rubbed some here the wrong way.....
 
  • #25
That's why I don't like it when people post news stories without any of their own commentary.
I actually I'm the reverse, I like to have just the article on the occurrence so people don't have any of my blathering commentary to contend with. Here's the story: ______ now let's discuss. The excess commentary from the news presenter is what keeps me from watching the cable news networks I just want the story not the presenters opinion along with it. At least here, we can all read the article and then discuss.

My main instinct about the story was the same as Capensis, simply "how ironic".
 
  • #26
Its not ironic. That's how terrorism goes. Highly visible and symbolic targets are the most desirable.

I actually I'm the reverse, I like to have just the article on the occurrence so people don't have any of my blathering commentary to contend with. Here's the story: ______ now let's discuss. The excess commentary from the news presenter is what keeps me from watching the cable news networks I just want the story not the presenters opinion along with it. At least here, we can all read the article and then discuss.

My main instinct about the story was the same as Capensis, simply "how ironic".
 
  • #27
Yes I know. His last event was against the Federal Reserve. I worked with a lot of guys at a plastics factory who had these ideas. they hated all these same people as this guy, etc.

If I let my post-modern entropy-loving side take over I can say I rather secretly enjoy watching ideologues going crazy, it's the old partisan game from here to eternity. No culture or civilization is any different than any other.

Rather the truth is perhaps it helps temper people on taking their "firm beliefs" too seriously whenever things like this happen.
 
  • #28
interesting..........a elderly white guy kills one and there is a post made.....a black muslim kills 2 in Arkansas last week....admits it was "a jihad killing" which makes it a terrorist attack on American soil and i find no posts on it here.......

Does that make it a terrorist attack? (Is it a terrorist attack just because I say it's a terrorist attack while I'm doing it? Is Blink 182 punk rock? I always thought that the elements of radical conspiracy and intent to inspire fear among broad groups of people were a little more characteristic of terrorism.) I didn't think that it had yet been established that he was acting with a terrorist organization. There was his trip to Yemen, but there's debate as to whether he may have been brainwashed - I hadn't heard of any evidence that he was freely cooperating with a terrorist cell. I think that, at best, von Brunn is as much a "terrorist" as Bledsoe. Given von Brunn's leadership among white supremacists, I'd say he's taken more levels in terrorist. (Because all politics are reduceable to Dungeons and Dragons references.) I can say that, of the two of them, only one has gone so far as to publish books on his extremist views, or to plan and carry out a kidnapping to obtain a forced confession from the enemies of his ideals; only one of them was a celebrity of his movement.
I'm not trying to say that the events aren't both newsworthy. I'm just not particularly surprised that the former wasn't posted about and the latter was. It's not very surprising that Muslims are upset with the US, and it's not especially alarming that an independent radical would act out. rattler, I'm sure you're familiar with the term "old news." Neo-Nazi activity is something that has been on the fringe of the news for a while up until it became an obvious object of speculation when Obama came up for the democratic candidacy. The museum shooting is part of a relatively (subjectively?) new trend, and the press is jumping on the contrast. Besides which, it's a great topic for speculative journalism because the idea of violence coming from familiar, domestic white demographics is so frightening to the average CNN or FOX News viewer. We're not accustomed to the threat being in our own backyard. It's disappointing, but not distressing.
~Joe
 
  • #30
The media is giving it so much attention because it happened at the Holocaust Museum. One would not typically expect something like this to happen there. It is supposed to be a place of sober thoughts and reflection, not killing. Because of a very strong irony, they jumped all over it.

I actually saw an article today in Newsmax attempting to link this shooting to Obama's middle east talks to Muslim countries... the media makes me sick.
 
  • #31
Big Media is indeed sickening Baylor. Is it any wonder that their ratings are floating in the toilet?

.....another interesting article on the museum killer:

Museum shooter

And on the killing of George Tiller:

49 million to 5
 
  • #32
Thanks for the links Fryster. This guy is living in his own dream world. Countless misinterpretations and poor understanding of contextual clues in writing. He also needs to revisit history as to why the Roman Empire collapsed... a combination of overextending themselves and high inflation over the course of hundreds of years ripped the empire apart. The barbarians simply finished the job. But, the museum shooter claims Christianity was the sole defeater of the Roman Empire, so I guess he is right :)

I also detected a bit... ok, maybe ALOT of Friedrich Nietzsche in the shooter's thought process. Surprise, surprise, also the main philosophical influencer of Hitler and Mussolini.
 
  • #33
Nietzsche was not a not "a nazi" but a nihilist/cynic philosopher and broke off his relations with Richard Wagner (the composer) because he didn't agree with his racist views. Racists who like Nietzsche don't understand what they are "enjoying". The ignorant mentality of racism and "average human thought" is what must be overcome by the superman or ubermensche... Anyone attached to an ideology is not a superman.

Nietzsche's sister however, was an anti-semite and compiled (likely edited as well) and sent out his work to a lot of pre-nazi rightwingers after his death. The new translations by Kaufmann(?) are likely quite different than the "originals" published by his sister. I have not had the chance to read an original. Obviously Christians or monotheists of any sort do not like Nietzsche for a number of reasons. I encourage everyone who seeks the truth of the matter to read for themselves The Gay Science, Ecce Homo and Thus Spake Zarathustra if you want to "see" what Nietzsche really said. Barnes and Noble has them all bound in one volume now after I bought them separately. :(

I found one of those links hilarious as it accused MIT professor of Linguistics and Philosopher/US foreign policy analyst Noam Chomsky of "millions of deaths". Again, so much wrong there I could write my own book... Are they pulling "evil sounding" names out of hat? :D
 
  • #34
Swords, good synopsis and I couldn't have said it better myself. Though Nietzsche was himself not a racist, the outworking of his philosophical belief more than facilitates haneous acts. There cannot be any justifiable framework for ethics or morality under this philosophy. Sure, one can live a moral life, but it is not the logical outworking of Nietzsche's philosophy.

It really stinks that so much is taken out of context like you said. It seems the biggest culprit of them all is the darned media! lol, I just read your last line. You're right, Noam Chomsky definitely sounds like an evil professor!!!
 
  • #35
:0o:
Hey, you know, Bush was a dirty treehugging hippie too. Did you hear that he pushed a bunch of laws through with dirt-loving names like the "Clear Skies Initiative?"
I'm so glad my TV tells me what all of these big words mean so that I don't have to worry about their actual definitions.
~Joe
 
  • #36
Nietzsche's philosophy is merely aimed at individuals transcending mundane humanity and becoming "all you can be" to steal a popular phrase. The nihilism and cynicism comes from his idea of rejecting all your past conditioning from state, religion, race, heritage, upbringing, traditions, addictions, etc. Being better than your predecessors/ancestors who were bound by these restrictions to the human spirit. Evolving your human organism beyond the "philosophical dark ages", so to speak.

I recall seeing one book that listed one of Nietzsche's works as one of the "10 books destroying the world" or some silly thing like that. All 10 being discussed were books I would recommend people read even if I don't agree with some of them. To truly know what they actually say you must read the real books. Not a synopsis book by someone who could be pulling your leg for some reason not yet divined. I guess that book could fall under the heading of "media" too. I almost bought it merely for the comedy factor but it was more than $20 and the joke of it might have worn off by the time I got home with it.

One interesting thing about Chomsky is that being a linguist much of his books go to unraveling what names like "Clear Skies Initiative", "Radical Reduction", "Sunshine Units" , etc. is actually talking about. When the government has something shrouded in some campy term - it's never good! :D

For those interested Understanding Power is a good easy starter Chomsky read before delving into some of the other rather long and often boring (sorry!) works.
 
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