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Any combat vets? HELP!

The other night I had a routine mission: Drive up a road for a few miles at 5 miles an hour and do laps around that road looking for people laying bombs to blow us up.. Well instead there was a small group of men carrying AK-47s. I thought they were IPs (Iraqi Police) but there was no truck near by and they weren't in uniform. When they saw us they started shooting at us and that gave me the right to shoot back. I had a .50 cal and I saw one of my rounds hit his chest and blow a hole the size of my head in him.. I keep having nightmares about that.. I wake up in sweats screaming.. In my nightmares he comes back and is standing over me, dirty, bloodied and angry. I look around and everyone in the tent is dead, throats cut. I look at his hand and he is carrying a bloody knife... and then he cuts my throat slowly and I cant move to defend myself or even scream..
I feel so horrible... I had no right to take his life.. I sit in a giant chunk of mobile armor.. his rounds did NOTHING but scare me... Everyone was safe in the trucks... Please try to understand where I'm coming from.. In my religion it's wrong to kill ANYTHING... I took away the life of a father, or a brother, a son.. I won't talk to anyone about this here in Iraq...
 
I understand that it's against your religion, but you really have to think of it as a "your life or his" situation.
You may have been safe in your truck, but the guy shooting obviously didn't know that... He had every intent to kill you and your fellow soldiers.

You did the right thing. Thanks for your bravery.
 
Hi Adam. Good to see your doing well so to speak and still alive man. Sounds like a scary mission there. I know how you feel with the Nightmares and all. Even though I have never been in over seas combat, I have been shot at twice over here at my home. One of the rounds went right through my front door, and by the time I went out side to shoot back at them, they were already gone in there get away cars.

Anyways, I understand your religion about not killing anything, but The good thing is your still alive and in war its either his life of yours. A kill or be killed situation. Coming from me, a future 0311 USMC Infantry man, I feel you did what was necessary to stay alive and to keep the men around you safe. You and them can all now be safe and come home safe to your Families.

Killing is never a good thing, but if you have to kill to keep yourself, the men around you, and innocent men, women and Children safe. I say that it is a justifiable action that must be done.

You did a great job there man. There is now 1 less group of terrorists out there to do harm to innocents and you and your men.

Semper Fidelis

Mike W.
 
Adam, i agree with Mike and Dart, you did what you had to do, the guy intended to kill you, you did what was necessary to defend your life and the life of the fellow soldiers with you, by taking him out you potentially saved yourself or a soldier and thus, allowed them the chance to be able to be reunited with his/her family once this stupid war is over.

Terrorists may be human, but human or not, what they are doing is wrong, and what they are doing is killing.
You did the right thing, i know its hard to accept, and it will haunt you, but kill or be killed, kill a low-life who would kill a child or unarmed civilian in a dime, or you yourself, a man who is serving his country, a man who puts his life on the line for a country he has no connection to, to further better that country.....a man with a family, a kind spirit, and a man with connections to a real society, with real friends....
not self loathing, cave hiding, suicide bombing idiots who think they are going to receive golds and riches for killing every man woman and child they see...

Adam, your a brave man for doing what you did, thank you for serving your country, just dont forget who you are....
 
I have no idea how that would feel. To put this in perspective though my brother was driving a bulldozer for the SeaBee's either in Somalia or Bosnia I'd have to check with him, anyway the Marine riding onboard as a lookout shot someone that was attacking them and for that I am greatful. So in otherwords you may have taken someone away from their family but you made sure that the fathers, brothers and sons in your group will go home to their families. Thanks for taking care of OUR families that are with you. Take Care
 
huge difference between killing someone in self defense and murder, atleast in my book....they shot at you first, regardless of how safe you may think you were in the trucks you never know....one of them coulda had an RPG near by....they fired at you, you returned fire to protect yourself and your guys....you did the right thing....

as for the mental stuff.....suck it up, set you pride aside and talk with a shrink.....best way to get yourself as right as your gonna be with it the fastest....aint nothing wrong with it no matter what some tough guy says....not everyone is wired the same, yeah some can suck it up and not be bothered by it but not everyone can, seek professional help to talk it out.....
 
I feel for you man, I really do. I support the troops but not the ideologies which send them (politics, religion, etc) or the things they're forced to do. Not many expect their goal of college tuition is going to force them into a situation of killing people. I can not congratulate you for the kill shot because it is not my way but I can congratulate you for feeling the way you do, I can count you as a brother. I would be going through those same things were I in your position.

I will have to second the advice to find someone to talk to about this. Preferably someone who has already gone through this themselves.
 
You did what you had to do and what you were trained to do... you removed a threat to you and your mates.
He made the decision for you, you simply reacted to a situation he put you in.
Rough yes, horrible yes... but regardless.... you may have saved the lives of others that day and possibly for many days to follow. He may have been the one to blow up a school next week or maybe plant an IED.

War is not pretty, its not a video game, its not something to look forward to... but it is sometimes unavoidable.
Again, just remember he made that decision for you and you did well. Innocent people will live because of what you did. All your training was to prepare you for that moment. So that you would react instinctively and decisively. There was no room for hesitation, the rules of engagement were met and you were taking fire.

Adam the soldier did what he had to do, what he was trained to do and may have to do again....
Adam the Buddhist must now learn how to cope with what has happened.

Godspeed Adam, hang in there and come home safe mate. You are in our prayers and thoughts.

Talk to someone

Av
 
Adam, my heart goes out to you. Please try not to feel shame or guilt over this. Your remorse and concern shows that you're true to your beliefs, even if you weren't able to reflect them in your actions this particular time.
I have not been in military combat but I'm from a military family and have many friends in the service. I have experienced some truly terrible things having lived in a combat zone, and heard even worse since then. What I can say is that you can't keep silent about this. It's good that you posted here, but I think you should also find some sort of support group specifically focused on military staff and combat trauma; I get the sense that you're feeling fairly isolated and alone in this right now. It can be hard for your heart to acknowledge this, but at least try to know, mentally, that you aren't the only person who's gone through this kind of hardship.
It's probably uncomfortable, and I know you said you didn't want to talk to people in Iraq about it, but what you need to do the most is talk face-to-face with another human being about this. Do you have someone in your unit that you can trust, or maybe a CO outside your unit that you have a close rapport with? I know talking to your own commander about this is probably the last thing you want to do, but if you're having nightmares and coming back to the same thoughts over and over, that's a liability to your unit and the people responsible for you need to know.
It's not your fault that you were put into this situation. While you could have not pulled the trigger, you did. It may have been a mistake, but I don't blame you for trying to do your job and protect yourself and your comrades. Your commanders are responsible for making sure that you are properly equipped, trained and briefed for your mission, and it's their job to take care of you. If you conceal your emotional condition now, you're not only preventing them from doing their duty, but you're also putting your unit and the people you're there to serve at risk. Most importantly you're putting yourself at risk. If you're not well, how can you expect to do right by the people that love and depend on you?
I know the military culture gets in the way of asking for help, and that likely a lot of the guys you work with have closed off their emotions or made sport of the situation. That's probably very alienating for someone of your background. But try to remember that that's just the way that they've learned to cope, from the cultures that they were raised in. It may seem very disillusioning and cold, but they're all just trying to survive a very ugly experience.
Remember that you, your brothers, your commanders, and even the civilians and the enemy all are just there trying to live on. You will see the worst of this conflict - corruption and hatred and desperation. The human animal isn't designed with warfare in mind, and it's hard to see past the horrors of combat. Try to remember that, at least at some level, you're there to help. Life is not something we want to compromise on, but occasionally you must kill in order to prevent your own death. You can do the most by living on.
The world is a harsh and lonely place; sometimes we're placed at odds with one another. I'm sure you're familiar with this saying; life is suffering. But you can curb your pain by learning from the experiences of others. You should really speak with someone in person about this if you can possibly muster the strength. Ask for a hug; try to remember what it means to feel the warmth and heartbeat of another person. That's why you're here, isn't it?
If you need someone to talk with in private about this, PM me. I'll give you the email-to-text bridge for my cell phone. I'm not always available, but I sleep poorly anyways so you can send a message any time without worrying about disturbing me.
Please don't doubt yourself. I know you're still on the path.
~Joe
 
  • #10
Adam, You said it yourself. They attacked you first and they had no intention of talking. Trust me if they would have a chance they would kill every one of us. This person knew what would happen once he gave the first shot. You are also correct, this person could have been a father, brother, or a son but you also have to think that not all people are raised the same and have the same sanity. Remember that you are doing a job in the military and is not in your best intent to kill someone. There is a big difference between a duty and a desire to kill.

I know it is hard for you but remember why you are in Iraq, to keep your loved ones safe! I know killing someone is really hard especially when everything you are doing is against your religion. The best to do is to ask for forgiveness and pray for the soul of the person who was trying to kill you. If you are feeling this way is because you are still sane and care about people. Just like everyone on this thread, Adam, remember who you are, and if you feel your dream is out of control, seek professional help.
If you think you are still not ready to talk about it with anyone else, we are here for you! or at least I am here for you. You can always count on us. Take care Adam.

Jesse
 
  • #11
What you are experiencing is normal of PTSD symptoms, which, unfortunately, is normal for combat vets. Don't try to handle it on your own. I don't know if they offer counselors, psychiatrists, or any medication while you are still over there, but if they do, take advantage of it.
 
  • #12
What you are experiencing is normal of PTSD symptoms, which, unfortunately, is normal for combat vets. Don't try to handle it on your own. I don't know if they offer counselors, psychiatrists, or any medication while you are still over there, but if they do, take advantage of it.

they do......ive got a cousin that had to visit with onbe while over there.....help is available, but yah gotta ask......if you dont ask, unless yah freak out it is assumed all is well....
 
  • #13
I cannot imagine what it must be like to go through that. Like the others said, it was either him or you. Had you not done that, it may have been you or your mates that would have been killed. And I also think there is a distinction between murder, and killing. Murder is wrong, killing, not so much as it depends on the situation. War is one.

My cousin came back from Falujah in '03, really, really in need of help. Most of his friends had been killed, and he saw some of the worst fighting that Iraq had. He had a classic case of PTSD. Please, seek help! It will only fester and get worse. Years down the road you may think you have it buried, but it will resurface. See a councilor, psychologist or psychiatrist, even a religious councilor. But you need to talk to someone to work this out. You owe it to yourself. I wish you the best.
 
  • #14
Adam please seek the help you need to get through this ordeal. Let there be no doubt that you did the right thing; you were assigned a mission and accomplished it as you were trained to do. Now you need to take care of yourself or you become a danger to yourself and those around you. As others have said, this will only fester and get worse if you do not seek help. Thank you for your service!
 
  • #15
What you are experiencing is normal of PTSD symptoms, which, unfortunately, is normal for combat vets. Don't try to handle it on your own. I don't know if they offer counselors, psychiatrists, or any medication while you are still over there, but if they do, take advantage of it.

Yes and if the situation gets out of hand they can force me to go seek help. "Commander reffered" if I remember right. I was in training for this sort of thing before my MOS (job) got switched to MP (Military Police). Night terrors... A proper name.
I'm surprised how many replies this post received so quickly! I'm nervous about coming home.. So use to the way things are here.. Was hard to go on R&R actually... was paranoid for a week! I'm afraid of what my family would say if they knew what was going on here...
 
  • #16
:usa2:
Time heals all wounds.
Others have made it thru what you are going thru, and you will too.

Life really is short, so hold on to the good things and let go of the rest.
As you see, a lot of good people here who are empathetic with what
you are going thru.

Take care,
Paul
 
  • #17
Well instead there was a small group of men carrying AK-47s... When they saw us they started shooting at us and that gave me the right to shoot back. I had a .50 cal and I saw one of my rounds hit his chest and blow a hole the size of my head in him.... I feel so horrible... I had no right to take his life.. I sit in a giant chunk of mobile armor.. his rounds did NOTHING but scare me... Everyone was safe in the trucks... Please try to understand where I'm coming from.. In my religion it's wrong to kill ANYTHING... I took away the life of a father, or a brother, a son.. I won't talk to anyone about this here in Iraq...

Adam, I sense two issues in your post. Were you justified in killing? And what do you do with the guilt of killing?

With regards to the question of justification, from an ethical standpoint there is no question that you were justified. You might have been safe in the truck, but you might not have been. Even small caliber rounds can kill if one gets a lucky shot, and you did not know if they had something larger in their arsenal. And it is not your prerogative to assume that they were harmless when they are firing assault rifles at you. Clearly, they were hostiles. And as already stated, there is an ethical difference between killing and murder. Murder is killing an innocent. All murder is killing, but not all killing is murder. Their intent was to kill you (or perhaps others) and therefore they are not innocents. But let me make this even clearer, they made a choice to engage you in combat. They knew that they were not supposed to be there; they knew that they were not supposed to be packing AK-47s; and they knew they were not supposed to open fire on US soldiers. Using their own autonomy they exercised a choice. By responding to them with greater fire, what you have done is respected their autonomy. There is no question that your actions were ethically justified.

The question of guilt is another matter. People feel guilt for a variety of reasons. Sometimes guilt is justified, other times it is not. I understand the sensitivities of a Buddhist, especially regarding the prohibition upon taking life. While Buddhism has a strong ethical framework for dealing with the sanctity of life, it can sometimes be weak in dealing with the lingering effects of guilt. The effects of guilt do include night terrors but it can also manifest in other psychological and physiological symptoms if allowed to linger, and often these effects do not manifest until many years later. I am not a Catholic and I know you are a Buddhist, so I'm not trying to proselytize or be offensive to you by the suggestion I'm about to make. Nevertheless, you will need to find some way to excise the guilt you are carrying around. I strongly suggest that you seek out an army chaplain and confess your guilt to him. Confessing your guilt face to face with another human being is the best remedy for the guilt you carry. Army chaplains are trained to deal with this problem specifically and most will help you deal with this even if you are a Buddhist and the chaplain is not. Discussions with a chaplain are "privileged information" and confidential, which is not true of army psychiatrists. Unfortunately, many people wait until they are discharged from the military to seek help for guilt and end up spending decades (and tens of thousands of dollars) on psychological counseling, when an hour with a chaplain could have nipped this in the bud.

Stay safe over there... we are grateful for the service you are performing.

-Hermes.
 
  • #18
He was intending to kill you and other US soldiers. He might not have been able to kill you in that situation, but if had lived he may taken other soldiers lives in future attacks. You actions as hard as they are to deal with decreased future threats on others. He wasn't there to collect wildflowers or clean up litter, he was there to set an ambush or place ied's. If he didn't succeed on that attempt he would have kept trying and taken many lives in the process. Your actions were justified and for the overall better good.

Whether any of us agree with the war or not self preservation is the base of maslow's pyramid and the overwhelming influence of our actions. There are no politics in a foxhole.

There's probably nothing any of us can say that will truly help. If in your situation I would find a counselor or someone to talk to asap and when you get back home find a non-military therapist to talk to. I don't know if I would trust the motives of the military's mental health svcs. They don't have the best track record in helping with the psychologic / emotional needs of veterans, many of whom have to reort to self-treating themselves with drugs and alcohol. I was a navy corpsman at bethesda in the 1990's and had to treat alot of the vietnam vets that became shells of human beings after the war and little to no no help whatsoever when they got home.
 
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